Monoblock on 2x 360 rads performing sub-par

[Allubz]

Hi everyone,

I have a pretty extensive cooling setup for just a Ryzen 1700 @ <4.0GHz (lost the lottery hard), and a GTX1080 Ti.

The GPU is fine in idle (32c) and load (~55), 120% pl and tight OC. The CPU on the other hand idles after a while around 45c, and with just 3.80GHz at 1.4V it runs up to 75-80c. I'm honestly thinking I forgot to put the TIM inbetween, after just test-installing it months ago (it was a long project). I mean, surprisingly it's not overheating when this is the case, but on the other hand the cooling should be quite fine for even the CPU + 2x GPU. I've barely seen the water hit 40c after extensive runs, so the pump is doing fine at 100%.

Can I reasonably expect the CPU to idle around the same temperature as the GPU, slightly above water temp? Even in fixed 3.8GHz OC idle (so no P-states, this mobo doesn't allow)?

Setup:
GA-X370 Gaming 5 + EK monoblock
2x EK-CoolStream SE 360 + 2x 3x Noiseblocker fans
EK-XRES DDC 3.2.

One thing I worry about as well is the air still present in the top of the two compartments of the monoblock, roughly around top VRM's area. I haven't fully flipped the system over yet, but I don't think it's the cause of the high CPU temperature either.

Maybe some of you can shed some light on this, what else could possibly be wrong, but I can simply only think of forgetting the bloody TIM, which I can check maybe tomorrow.


Regards,

Al

PS: Galaxy S5 picture quality, but eh:

https://imgur.com/a/WX90o

 

[EarthDog]

600W with 360 rad is about right. I don't see an issue with the CPU temps, personally.

If there wasn't thermal paste, temps would skyrocket nearly instantly. That said, a remount and reTIM shouldn't hurt anything.

 

[Blaylock]

What are you using to apply the load? Certain programs (I'm looking at you P95) add excessive/unrealistic heat.

 

[Allubz]

@EarthDog Yeah, but if the system is idle I expected a roughly equal temperature to settle for the CPU core (~30-35) as does the GPU. Maybe I'm overexpecting because it's overclocked and also doesn't apply any P-states (it's alwyas max freq, idle or load). I'm used to CPU temps skyrocketing when one accidentally forgets the plastic cover on the base of the heatsink, but I deemed it possible that the setup would compensate for lack of TIM; it probably doesn't.

@Blaylock I am using P95 actually, different tests, but mostly 1344-1344 @ 15mins. I'm aware it's to produce unrealistic workloads and thus temperatures. I'm just slightly confused at both idle/load temps, but I'm used to recent Intel hardware in custom systems, so maybe it's Ryzen temps. I mean, load isn't bad at 80c if the chip doesn't go further, but I thought that the Ryzen CPU would stay cool, judging its relatively low clockspeed compared to Intel counterparts. It's just different tech then, and the wait would be for what is it, Zen+ / 2?

An idle state of 10% CPU usage (I have some "idle" programs open) results in 40c, but with quick differentiations up to 50c. I have seen similar behaviour with Skylake-X parts. I can live with this, but I assumed full load might be more around 60-70c with greater OC capabilities. The chip lottery does a lot for Ryzen it seems, as well. I can OC Skylake-X 8-cores to 4.5GHz (4.2 AVX) with just an AIO kit, and achieve the same results. The main difference is, I guess, that my system is always perfectly quiet.

 

[Lochekey]

How is the speed of your pump set? If you are not running it full bore try running it faster to see if it will help. That bubble in the monoblock could be causing restriction in the loop as well since the water is supposed to flow through 2 paths in the monoblock and seems to be restricted to just one path.

 

[Blaylock]

I would suggest running Aida64(free) for your load instead. It will stress your system just as hard as P95 except without one execution known to cause that unrealistic great (AVX2 IIRC). P it some results from Aida64 and let's see if it's just P95.

If you do have a bubble you're going to want to get that out of your loop. I'm not really sure why you haven't addressed that yet. Lol

Also it's possible that you didn't apply a correct amount of TIM. Too little or too much can cause bad temps. Maybe not as bad *** your experiencing, but less than ideal for sure.

 

[Mr.Scott]

If there's 1 air bubble you can see, there's usually more that you can't.
Bleed that air out. It WILL affect your temps.

 

[gsrcrxsi]

AIDA64 still tests AVX loads depending on parameters set. i could see this in the multiplier selected when running the benchmark.

if i had "stress FPU" or "stress cache" selected, I saw the -1 AVX multiplier applied

 

[Allubz]

I don't think AVX loads apply to Ryzen? It's missing at least AVX256 / 512.

I can see AIDA64 crashing within 10 seconds, roughly at 72c CPU, whereas P95 keeps running NP and ups the CPU temperature a little after that to max. 75c. I see my 1.4V CPU VID jumping between 1.416 and 1.45x (LLC to Extreme), so that could be a little less. 3800MHz and that hot, tho, needs some work.

The pump is set to max RPM via the BIOS fan settings.

I will try to get rid of the bubbles today and see whether it influences my results.


EDIT: to be continued, I broke off a customized part of the reservoir ^^

 

[GTXJackBauer]

I'm not too familiar with AMD atm but doesn't that voltage seem really high for the CPU? The higher the voltage, the higher the temps.

I also believe AMD in general has a lower temp tolerance than the higher intel has. Maybe it's changed with the newer chips? Idk...

 

[Allubz]

It seems 1.4 - 1.45 is alright with air and basic AIO aiming at max 4.0GHz. My setup should be able to cool this appopriately. I'll get back with an update when I have replaced the reservoir. Sorry for the delay, and thanks everyone for their input!

 

[bigtallanddopey]

It seems 1.4 - 1.45 is alright with air and basic AIO aiming at max 4.0GHz. My setup should be able to cool this appopriately. I'll get back with an update when I have replaced the reservoir. Sorry for the delay, and thanks everyone for their input!

1.45 is the max recommended by amd if memory serves me correct. Basically from my own experience and others on the net, once you overclock past 3.8/3.9 you seem to get an exponential heat increase very quickly.

Although I would say at the moment I am just using the stock cpu cooler and I am overclocked to 3.8 with idle temps at around 35. With a custom loop I would expect a little better or the same with more headroom when stressed.

But like I said, expect high heat around the 4Ghz mark. It’s not running too hot yet but you would probably be better running it at 3.8 for long term. The first Gen ryzen CPU’s are good but don’t expect a miracle. Most people are hitting 4Ghz and not much more. 4.1 if you’re lucky.

 

[bob4933]

Lets see, 103.28w on the cpu; gtx 1080 ti @ 300w while overclocked x2 -> >700w thermal power when everything is maxed out (really only a synthetic load possibility, but thats what youre using to test)

The EK coolstream SE series is one of the lowest performing 360 rads; super thin, wide fin pitch, low fin count etc. They are well made, but just not intended for this level of performance. I would imagine air bubbles aren't doing you any favors as well.

 

[Lochekey]

Lets see, 103.28w on the cpu; gtx 1080 ti @ 300w while overclocked x2 -> >700w thermal power when everything is maxed out (really only a synthetic load possibility, but thats what youre using to test)

The EK coolstream SE series is one of the lowest performing 360 rads; super thin, wide fin pitch, low fin count etc. They are well made, but just not intended for this level of performance. I would imagine air bubbles aren't doing you any favors as well.

He only is running 1 1080ti so a 400 watt load. He just references the 2nd TI saying the system should be able to handle 2.

 

[Thick8]

Sounds like you either forgot the tim, have an internal restriction in the monoblock, or the block is not mounted correctly.
I’m assuming you have the EK C6H waterblock. That thing is a pita to mount. took me three tries to get everything mated up correctly. I’ve had mine running since yesterday and have no air pockets in it. I do hook a vacuum pump up to my system to remove all traces of air though. On mine the pump pushed all the air out of the block. Makes me think there may be some sort of internal restriction.
What is your water temperature? Is it significantly above ambient? If not then the heat is not moving to the coolant.
With a water temperature of 26c my cpu idles at 27c. Fully loaded AIDA64 58c. The voltage rises to 1.46ish under load. 30c CPU/coolant temperature delta isn’t bad and my pumps never rise over 30 percent duty cycle.

Edit. I just noticed you picture. That’s not a little air pocket, that’s half you block with no cooling at all. Vacuum your system down.

 

[||Console||]

He only is running 1 1080ti so a 400 watt load. He just references the 2nd TI saying the system should be able to handle 2.

Doesnt the title of this thread say he has 2x 360 rads?

 

[Allubz]

Cheers for the replies!

I'm waiting for my replacement reservoir and then I'll get serious about removing the bubbles. How do you suggest hooking up a vacuum machine? I'm not sure how to imagine that, right now.

I'm indeed running dual slim 360's on a 8-core Ryzen @<4GHz, with the single GTX1080Ti at stock or a reasonable overclock. The GPU was doing fine, temp-wise, but the monoblock probably had too much air in it. Right now I am running with even less water and the block heats up faster.

The reservoir should be in any day now, but it's newyears so you know. When it does I can safely flip my system to move air.

I promise to get back

 

[EarthDog]

Lol, a vacuum...

Just tip it around, power off and on etc, it will go away...

 

[Thick8]

Laugh if you want but vacuuming a closed loop liquid system is the universally accepted best method for removing trapped air pockets or eliminating their formation in the first place. Many systems can’t be picked up and “tipped around”. How can you be certain that you have removed all of the air from a radiator or some other component you can’t see into; to insure you won’t suffer from corrosion? Do you just shake around your computer and hope for the best or do you use a simple, proven, easy to perform operation to ensure that all air is removed from the system?
So go ahead and laugh while you have to tear down your system and clean all the corrosion from you components all the while wondering “why do I have that green stuff blocking up all my components”.
To the OP, I have a guide that I have to find. I will post it in a little while. I have some honey-do stuff to get done first.

 

[Lochekey]

Doesnt the title of this thread say he has 2x 360 rads?

I don't understand what you are asking? Yes he has 2 360 rads but only 1 1080ti. The math Bob was doing including a second 1080ti. I agree that his system really should not have 2 1080tis on it but his current problem is not due to an overloaded system.