- Joined
- Oct 12, 2001
- Location
- Los Angeles
Glad to see you on the road to recovery! Did you see this?DodgeViper said:
http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5688&perpage=25&pagenumber=1
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My new WB has a scratch, what to do?
- Thread starter Chief_Wiggum
- Start date
http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5688&perpage=25&pagenumber=1
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2001
- Location
- WILDCAT COUNTRY
Wangster said:
Well not on my feet yet. I have a knot/abscess on the side of my neck that I see a doctor for on Monday. Was really weird, I was on my way to work when I noticed this pain in my neck a week ago this past Wednesday and during the day my neck continued to get bigger and bigger until I had to leave work. I pray this does not turn into something out of my hands.
Chief_Wiggum, I would try lapping. That mark will disappear very quickly. Remember to keep even pressure while moving the block in a figure eight motion. Also the spot over the CPU is all that is really important. So once the CPU area is clean and free of the mark and the surface is flat, mount the block.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Dec 30, 2000
- Location
- New Jersey
dodge I'm glad to see you back! I was wondering what happened to you the last couple of days; sorry to hear about your medical condition, I hope it doesn't come back. 
I made a thread about modified commercial waterblocks, would you mind adding your modded tc4 to it?
I made a thread about modified commercial waterblocks, would you mind adding your modded tc4 to it?
- Joined
- Jun 8, 2002
- Location
- Melbourne, Australia
Hmmm, I lap starting with 80-grit, then 120, then 240, then 600 and stop there.
As coarse as people think 80-grit paper is, it takes something like 20 minutes of hand lapping with it to remove just 0.1mm of material from a water-block sized copper block.
Go out and buy some low-smell kerosene. Makes for an excellent lubricant while lapping and doesn't stink the house out when you walk inside. Splash some on your lapping surface, slap down the sheet of sand-paper, splash some of the kero on the paper, and get to work. That scratch you show there will be gone in less than 5 minutes, then move to 120 and 240, and finally finish up with the 600, but dry sand at 600. It'll take about 5 minutes with 600-grit to get a shiny reflective finish with the (extremely) fine scratches that are condusive to a good thermal interface.
As coarse as people think 80-grit paper is, it takes something like 20 minutes of hand lapping with it to remove just 0.1mm of material from a water-block sized copper block.
Go out and buy some low-smell kerosene. Makes for an excellent lubricant while lapping and doesn't stink the house out when you walk inside. Splash some on your lapping surface, slap down the sheet of sand-paper, splash some of the kero on the paper, and get to work. That scratch you show there will be gone in less than 5 minutes, then move to 120 and 240, and finally finish up with the 600, but dry sand at 600. It'll take about 5 minutes with 600-grit to get a shiny reflective finish with the (extremely) fine scratches that are condusive to a good thermal interface.
OP
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2003
- Location
- New York, NY
- Thread Starter
- #27
Thanks to everyone for helping me out. It's impressive to see people like DodgeViper so commited to helping n00bs like me that even though he's sick and was in the hospital, he can't stay away!
Just thought I'd give you an update. I contacted dtek and they suggested that either I could lap it myself, or "they would take care of me" which I assume means they would replace it.
Either way, I was impressed. Both times I've emailed them, I've received a helpful response within 24 hours.
Anyway, I found a piece of pretty thick glass to lap on and some 220 and 600 grit paper. I followed the instructions everyone gave and now have this:
It only took me about 20 minutes with the 220 to remove the scratch completely.
Any thoughts on whether or not this looks okay? Thanks again everyone.
Just thought I'd give you an update. I contacted dtek and they suggested that either I could lap it myself, or "they would take care of me" which I assume means they would replace it.
Either way, I was impressed. Both times I've emailed them, I've received a helpful response within 24 hours.
Anyway, I found a piece of pretty thick glass to lap on and some 220 and 600 grit paper. I followed the instructions everyone gave and now have this:
It only took me about 20 minutes with the 220 to remove the scratch completely.
Any thoughts on whether or not this looks okay? Thanks again everyone.
It appears OK from the picture. You could possibly finish with slightly finer sandpaper, but there's no real way to tell if you'd get better temps or not from looking at that pic. If you have a machinist's ruler or other good stainless steel ruler, you can do a quick and easy test for flatness. Just hold the ruler on it's edge against the base of the block and look towards a light. If there are any noticeable light patches showing, you've got low spots.
- Joined
- Jun 8, 2002
- Location
- Melbourne, Australia
Doesn't look like you lapped it for long enough with the 600-grit. Here's what my blocks look like after a 600-grit session:
OP
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2003
- Location
- New York, NY
- Thread Starter
- #30
I'll give it another go...
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2001
- Location
- WILDCAT COUNTRY
Here are a few tips that I follow when I lap a block/heatsink.
1. First and most important item, you need a smooth and VERY flat work surface. You can use glass, granite, or a piece of ground flat metal. Make sure whatever you choose it’s thick and stable.
2. You want to use good quality wet/dry or waterproof sandpaper. 3M paper you can’t go wrong.
3. The use of water will aid in flushing out the particles as you lap the surface. It’s a good idea to wet the flat surface and the back of the sandpaper so that they make a bond and the sandpaper stays in place while you lap the block/heatsink. Also as you lap keep the sandpaper moist.
4. Depending on how smooth you what the final outcome and if you have some nicks or dings in the surface expect to spend 30 minutes or more.
5. There is a product called metal die that machinist use to layout and scribe marks on metal. This can be used to see just how flat the surface is. As you begin to lap/sand you will see how the surface looks after just a few minutes. You can also use a magic marker and do the same thing. Cover the entire surface and begin lapping.
6. Try to position the downward pressure on the block/heatsink at the center and move the block/heatsink in a figure-eight motion.
7. If the block/heatsink is smooth and flat, then begin with 400 grit sandpaper. After a few minutes you do not see much progress drop down to the next lower paper. Remember to always clean the block/heatsink and work surface at the change of each grit of sandpaper.
8. Having 120, 220, 320, 400, 600, and 800 grit paper is all that is needed. Use the step method as you lap. Begin with the lower number grit paper and work up. Remember it is VERY important to clean the block/heatsink and work surface between grits. What will happen if you don’t, can ruin your day. Once you get to say 800 grit and there is particles left over from 400 you will be lapping/sanding this grit back into the surface and you will have to start all over again.
I hope that these tips will help you as well as others in obtaining great results.
1. First and most important item, you need a smooth and VERY flat work surface. You can use glass, granite, or a piece of ground flat metal. Make sure whatever you choose it’s thick and stable.
2. You want to use good quality wet/dry or waterproof sandpaper. 3M paper you can’t go wrong.
3. The use of water will aid in flushing out the particles as you lap the surface. It’s a good idea to wet the flat surface and the back of the sandpaper so that they make a bond and the sandpaper stays in place while you lap the block/heatsink. Also as you lap keep the sandpaper moist.
4. Depending on how smooth you what the final outcome and if you have some nicks or dings in the surface expect to spend 30 minutes or more.
5. There is a product called metal die that machinist use to layout and scribe marks on metal. This can be used to see just how flat the surface is. As you begin to lap/sand you will see how the surface looks after just a few minutes. You can also use a magic marker and do the same thing. Cover the entire surface and begin lapping.
6. Try to position the downward pressure on the block/heatsink at the center and move the block/heatsink in a figure-eight motion.
7. If the block/heatsink is smooth and flat, then begin with 400 grit sandpaper. After a few minutes you do not see much progress drop down to the next lower paper. Remember to always clean the block/heatsink and work surface at the change of each grit of sandpaper.
8. Having 120, 220, 320, 400, 600, and 800 grit paper is all that is needed. Use the step method as you lap. Begin with the lower number grit paper and work up. Remember it is VERY important to clean the block/heatsink and work surface between grits. What will happen if you don’t, can ruin your day. Once you get to say 800 grit and there is particles left over from 400 you will be lapping/sanding this grit back into the surface and you will have to start all over again.
I hope that these tips will help you as well as others in obtaining great results.
Last edited:
OP
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2003
- Location
- New York, NY
- Thread Starter
- #32
Okay, I think I'm just about lapped out
Here's what I'm going with
Thanks for the great tips everyone (especially DodgeViper) cleaning the paper and block after each grit really made a difference.
Here's what I'm going with
Thanks for the great tips everyone (especially DodgeViper) cleaning the paper and block after each grit really made a difference.
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2001
- Location
- WILDCAT COUNTRY
Looks like you have achieved your goal. Now use a very thin coat evenly placed ASlll on the CPU chip and mount that block.
- Joined
- Dec 8, 2002
- Location
- Suffolk, UK
hiya guys
welcome back DV. n get well soon you gotta get back to making them world famous shrouds and stuff
a couple of you asked about surface plates so i thought i would give you some more info.
There intended use is attualy to provide a level suface for use when marking out metal before machineing and stuff like that. but they make an great surface to lap on. i know that you can still buy them from a mahine shop supplyest or someone simlar. but you could have your own made if you could find a block of steel or iron and then get the top ground.
they can be made from steel but older ones are normaly iron another thing that you coluld use is ground granite but basicly it has to be a tough material that has a ground top.
hope that helps
oh and paper wize start wid the low numbers and go to 600 no higer no lower
welcome back DV. n get well soon you gotta get back to making them world famous shrouds and stuff
a couple of you asked about surface plates so i thought i would give you some more info.
There intended use is attualy to provide a level suface for use when marking out metal before machineing and stuff like that. but they make an great surface to lap on. i know that you can still buy them from a mahine shop supplyest or someone simlar. but you could have your own made if you could find a block of steel or iron and then get the top ground.
they can be made from steel but older ones are normaly iron another thing that you coluld use is ground granite but basicly it has to be a tough material that has a ground top.
hope that helps
oh and paper wize start wid the low numbers and go to 600 no higer no lower
OP
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2003
- Location
- New York, NY
- Thread Starter
- #35
why only to 600?
- Joined
- Dec 8, 2002
- Location
- Suffolk, UK
well the lower you go the more the paper will get clogged up and you will start to rub the grit that comes off back into your work. this will cause irregularilys in the flatness and you will have wasted your time.
now i think about it you could probably get away wiv 800
but anything passed 600 you will not be gaining anything at all
remember it dose not need to be shiney
now i think about it you could probably get away wiv 800
but anything passed 600 you will not be gaining anything at all
remember it dose not need to be shiney
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2001
- Location
- WILDCAT COUNTRY
Chief_Wiggum said:
600 grit will still leave an area on the face of the block/heatsink with microscopic grooves so that Artic Silver can adhere to. Those very small sand marks fill with ASlll and helps in keeping ASlll from being pushed out from the area.
- Joined
- Feb 18, 2002
- Location
- Fort Wayne, IN
Wangster said:
Surface plates come in many differenct sizes and are generally quite expensive. I'm not too familiar with steel...most of the surface plates I've used are granite. They come in grades A+(AA), A, B, and shop grade (I think). I don't remember what the tolerences are on each grade, but the higher grades are very expensive anyway. You might be able to get a used shop grade plate from a machine shop or an auction or something. High quality surface plates cost from a few $100 to thousands of dollars, but you might be able to find a shop grade plate for not too much or even free if a machine shop has a few laying around that they can't use anymore. Try gov't auctions too, the gov't seems to have lots of surface plates for some reason. If you're lucky you might be able to find an optical flat for cheap, so you can actually analyze flatness.
Bacchana1 said:
Only a few hundred eh?
Hmm, I don't see myself going into the business of prepping and selling mirror polished optically flat HS/WBs so what's another alternative.
Isn't granite tile that you see in tile shops flat enough?
- Joined
- Dec 5, 2001
- Location
- Canada/was England
this my prototype just off the mill just using a (FLY)cutter
(work stillin progress)
i still need to make it a bit deeper and then mill the dimples
heres a idea of what it will look like when done
handing being a prototype machinest
Borgy
(work stillin progress)
i still need to make it a bit deeper and then mill the dimples
heres a idea of what it will look like when done
handing being a prototype machinest
Borgy
