need help w/3dvision surround setup

[funsoul]

If you really want to benchmark:
Best motherboard you can get, ASUS ROG boards are very popular there.
Fast RAM
Water doesn't offer huge benefits over air as both are still limited by ambient temperatures. With benching, you usually want to use dry ice or liquid nitrogen. You obviously don't want to put that kind of stress/risk on your daily rig. That's why a lot of people have a separate daily rig. Benching, you typically buy hardware, bench it, sell it, and move on to other hardware.

2011 vs 1155 also depends on whether the benchmark is multithreaded or not. If it is, 2011 is probably going to beat 1155. If it's not, you probably want to stick to 1155. Sandy vs Ivy, Ivy had a 3-5% inherent lead over Sandy, so it depends if you can get Sandy to clock that much higher than Ivy to make up the difference.

thanks Knufire!

Guess I should clarify the benching comment...not looking to get too crazy ala LN2, etc...just want to place better than some other peer builds (still trying to get up to 20 points at hwbot hehe). Would try to go nice and high for benching but bring the components down to more reasonable levels for gaming.

Thoughts on nice ram?

The benchmarks are a mixed bag threading-wise and thinking to go broad rather than focus in on one or two specific benchmarks. This is primarily a rig for gaming.

Went with the Extreme9 board as it's got plenty of PCI-E slots and will let me run the 3 cards at PCI-E 3.0 x16/x8/x8 and still have room to add another card down the road (also at x8). That's the only 1155 mobo that I could find that can do that.

From what I've read, the Ivy's aren't the best overclockers which is why I'm now re-considering the cpu and socket choices. Ivy's 1155 only atm, 2011 only Sandy atm. If Sandy...then it's down to the 3820 or 2500K/2600K and the 2xxxK cpus seem to generally overclock much better than the 3820.

The ASUS Rampage IV Extreme and Formula boards look outstanding.

So...still stuck in the 1155/2011, Ivy/Sandy, 2xxxK/3770K/3820 decision :/

 

[Knufire]

Unless you go extreme cooling... you'll never really use any benching class hardware to its potential. Midrange boards will take the chip as far as reasonably possible on ambient cooling.

If you're primarily gaming, stick to the 1155 platform. 3D surround completely justifies tri SLI...you want as much GPU power as possible. Whether you go GTX670 or 680, make sure you get 4GB cards, you'll need the vRAM.

Here's the thing. All X79 boards can do tri SLI. The questions question what's cheaper, a Z77 Extreme9 or a X79 Extreme6? (point is high end 1155 vs midrange 2011, as both meet your needs). There might be a cheaper 1155 board that can do tri SLI...The scaling is so bad with the 4th card its not worth it. I would want another x1 slot though, in case you want to add a wireless card or sound card in the future.

Just a note... have you tried 3D gaming? Almost everyone whose tried surround loves it. Thing with 3D is that for a good amount of people, it's just not comfortable for long periods of time. I say this because if you realize you don't really want 3D, you can opt for some nice IPS (better color accuracy) screens. I don't think anybody has made 3D IPS panels yet.

 

[funsoul]

Thanks again Knufire

Ambient temp in the room where the pc's are stays around 68F. I know anything short of exotics will never get the cpu/gpu temps below ambient but the dual-loop setup should keep things +/-15 degrees cooler than air and will definitely produce significantly less noise overall (the 680's, although quieter than the 5 series still get pretty loud at higher temps....multiplied by 3 and it's almost like sitting next to some old vantec tornado screamers).

Yep..got the 4GB gtx 680's and agreed...4-way sli scaling just plain sucks atm. That said, do like having the expandability option and, if I play physx-enabled games, throwing in the old gtx 460 as a dedicated physx card might make sense. Also agree that it'd be nice to have another slot for a likely sound card.

Yes...been 3d gaming for a couple years now and love the effect when it's working right. Nvidia's tech is in 2nd generation now and shows a very significant improvement (switched from the alienware24 to the asus27 a few months back). Yeah...no 120Hz IPS panels out there (or even 1920x1200)

Will look again at the 2011 stuff. Play a lot of Skyrim so still thinking Ivy's the way to go for the PCI-E 3.0 support which, for Skyrim anyway, appears to make +/-5% difference ( http://hardocp.com/article/2012/07/18/pci_express_20_vs_30_gpu_gaming_performance_review/4 ). Measly difference, though so if I could o/c a Sandy (3820 or 2600K) to a higher frequency than the Ivy 3770K they'll be the same. From what I've been reading, seems all 3 of these cpu's get up in the 4.5-4.6GHz range.

 

[Knufire]

Yeah, the thing with Sandy vs Ivy is that if you put the same heatsink on both, the difference in the clock speed you could OC to pretty much canceled out the lead...so whatever you paid extra for Ivy was basically for 3.0 support and lower power draw. However, since you're under water...I would expect Sandy and Ivy to perform the same.

Pretty sure 2011 is PCIe 3.0 even though it's Sandy. Again...motherboard price difference is probably your deciding factor, since a 3820/2600K/3770K are all going to perform virtually the same in games. Any clue on what the Z77 Extreme9 is going to cost?

 

[funsoul]

Yeah, the thing with Sandy vs Ivy is that if you put the same heatsink on both, the difference in the clock speed you could OC to pretty much canceled out the lead...so whatever you paid extra for Ivy was basically for 3.0 support and lower power draw. However, since you're under water...I would expect Sandy and Ivy to perform the same.

Pretty sure 2011 is PCIe 3.0 even though it's Sandy. Again...motherboard price difference is probably your deciding factor, since a 3820/2600K/3770K are all going to perform virtually the same in games. Any clue on what the Z77 Extreme9 is going to cost?

Afaik, 3.0 is only currently supported by Ivy cpus. That said, have read that socket 2011 ivy bridge-e's are coming out later this year (and 'tocks' are good, too).

3770k-1155- Ivy- $339 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116501
2600k-1155- Sandy- $295 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115070
3820- 2011- Sandy- $300 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115229

Potential 1155 mobos:
ASRock Z77 Extreme9- $350 ($325 w/rebate) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157322
ASUS P8Z77 WS- $340 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131822
ASUS Maximus V EXTREME- $390 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131858


Potential 2011 mobos:
ASUS P9X79- $260 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131804
GIGABYTE GA-X79-UD3- $240 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128532
ASRock Fatal1ty X79 Professional- $280 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157288
ASUS Sabertooth X79- $320 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131801
ASUS Rampage IV Formula- $360 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131808
ASUS P9X79 Pro- $320 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131800

Dont know much yet about the 2011 mobos...

I tend to keep the mobo/cpu for 3-4 years with upgrades to other components along the way. Primarily gaming but like to get the most possible (given cooling) out of the pc. The pros/cons are only how I perceive them (as of the moment and without having done the full research on the socket 2011 mobos) given what I want.

1155 Pros
- supports ivy bridge
- full support for pci-e 3.0 (~5% faster with 3 cards vs. socket 2011)
- reduced overall system power draw

1155 Cons
- $84-$129 more expensive
- socket is potentially end of life

2011 Pros
- cheaper option
- more total pci-e lanes (but not relevant for this build atm)
- highly likely support for next cpus (possible ivy bridge-e's coming at the end of the year?)

2011 Cons
- doesn't support current gen cpus
- no current (afaik) true pci-e 3.0 support (?)
- highest power draw

Are there any others that anyone thinks is missing? Almost starting to lean toward the 2011 setup but it sucks because it means I'm already thinking of upgrading the cpu in like 6 months :\

Also...what about ram and ssd? Sounds like it'd be worth spending a few $ and getting better ram than what's up in my part list. Suggestions? For the ssd, I like the 2 in the list (sammy 830 and Crucial M4) but the Kingston HyperX 3K and OCZ Vertex 4 also look pretty sweet.

 

[Knufire]

It just uses a seperate chip/controller for PCIe 3.0 versus native from the CPU, it's still real PCIe 3.0. IB-E CPUs are Q2 2013 AFAIK, and will be LGA2011. Same as Z68 GEN3 boards.

Better RAM really isn't going to help you much in gaming. The Samsung's that were reviewed on the front page are a great deal seeing how high they OCed.

PCIe lanes do matter if you're going tri-SLI. Anything on LGA1155 is a lane splitter which introduces latency and cuts bandwidth.

SSD wise, Samsung 830, Intel 520, OCZ Vertex 4 would be my top three, in no particular order.

 

[funsoul]

Very torn now

Fastest cpu speed seems the biggest factor in overall gaming performance. Of the 2600k, 3770k and 3820...the 3770k seems underwhelming as getting it over about 4.5GHz-ish seems to require exotic cooling. The 2600k tends to o/c like a champ up to around 4.6GHz-ish. The 3820, although locked, seems to be getting up to around 4.8GHz on water. Clock for clock the IB cpu's are about 5% faster than the Sandy's so the 3820 seems, on average, the winner.

Still can't find anything that leads me to think pci-e 3.0 is fully functioning on non-IB setups and the 3.0 seems to deliver around a 6-8% performance gain. Here's a couple articles...
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Intel/Ivy_Bridge_PCI-Express_Scaling/1.html
http://hardocp.com/article/2012/07/18/pci_express_20_vs_30_gpu_gaming_performance_review/1

Looks like my system (tri-sli) would gain a few % using 3.0 but @5760x1080 the results from the hardocp review are a bit weird...they think this could be due to gpu ram saturation (I'm using the 4gb cards, not the 2gb one so this shouldn't be a problem).

Starting to lean toward the 3820.

Anyone here have experience with any of the listed mobos? Need minimum of 3 fast pci-e slots (ideally 4 so I could add a physx card or 4th gpu if it ever makes sense) plus a pci-e slot for a sound card. Want to do good overclocking...cpu will have a bix240 rad, the 3gpus will be on a loop with a bix360.

These look like the best for overclocking that have enough pci-e slots:
MSI Big Bang-XPower II - $390 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130626
ASUS Rampage IV Formula

 

[Knufire]

No need for those kind of boards if you only want to hit 4.8GHz.

Physics cards and 4th GPUs...not really necessary at all.

 

[funsoul]

No need for those kind of boards if you only want to hit 4.8GHz.

Physics cards and 4th GPUs...not really necessary at all.

Would like to get over 5 for testing but run around 4.8 for gaming. I like the ASUS P9X79 and GIGABYTE GA-X79-UD3 but read overclocking's a bit iffy with them. Know of any better?

 

[Knufire]

ASRock Extreme6 then? OCing should be fine on the ASUS/Gigabyte as well.

 

[funsoul]

ASRock Extreme6 then? OCing should be fine on the ASUS/Gigabyte as well.

That ASRock can only run x8/x8/x4 so not too keen on that one. Looking for others...

Back to the ram...wouldn't it be better to spend a few extra $ to get higher speed ram than overclocking the samsung 1600? Or...what about getting something that's the same speed but lower CAS? The samsung's CAS 11 but there's also a number of CAS 7 choices. Also...is 4 sticks a must have or will the rig generally run faster with just 2?

Thoughts?

 

[funsoul]

Thinking the Asus p9x79 ($260) should be fine. x16/x16/x8 with the possibility of adding a dedicated physx card should I play a game that uses it (have a gtx 460 768 which would be good for physx). Adds $30 to the price of the board (compared to the LE version). At least 1 of the pci-e x1 slots for a soundcard should be reachable between the waterblocks.

Downside is no usb3.0 internal headers which isn't a total dealbreaker for me (but does come with the LE...can the cost of adding 4-way sli be so much higher than removing internal usb3.0??).

Thinking it should be a decent enough overclocking board. Can't really find much on the 'regular' version of this board. Anyone know anything about it?

 

[funsoul]

OK...almost ready to place the order...woohoo!!

Still looking for feedback on the Asus p9x79.

Also wondering about the choice of ram. The samsung CAS 11 kit looks great but wondering if I'd be better off (at least from a benching perspective...wprime, pifast, etc) with CAS 7 memory?

Here are the ones that look like they SHOULD work with the motherboard:
- Corsair Vengeance 8GB (2x4) ddr3 1600 cmz8gx3m2x1600c7r $85 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233254&Tpk=cmz8gx3m2x1600c7r
- Mushkin Enhanced Radioactive CAS 7 997006 $70 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226221&Tpk=997006
- Mushkin Enhanced Redline CAS 7 996981 $70 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226178&Tpk=996981
- Mushkin Enhanced Redline CAS 7 996982 $70 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226179&Tpk=996982
- Mushkin Enhanced Redline CAS 7 997057 $80 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226311&Tpk=997057
- G Skill Ripjaws X CAS 7 f312800cl7d-8gbxm $80 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231536&Tpk=f312800cl7d-8gbxm
- Samsung MV-3V4G3D/US CAS 11 $50 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147096


None of the modules are listed in the asus QVL so also need to know if they'll actually work in the motherboard. Not sure about XMP support but would like that, too (greedy bastid, I know).

Thanks so much!

 

[Knufire]

Read the front page review on those sticks. I'd suspect they might be able to do CAS7 at 1.5V.

If you want to bench though...might want some 2133MHz or faster with relatively tight timings.

 

[funsoul]

Thanks Knufire. Re-read the review. With overclocking, the reviewer was able to get them to CAS 9.

Here are the reasonable 2133 sticks....all are CAS 9:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226200
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231476
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226199
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231518
This one: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231503 got a good review here ( http://www.overclockers.com/gskill-ripjaws-z-ddr3-2133-quad-channel-ram ) ...CAS 9. Runs up to 2340 and the newegg page even says "Quad channel kit for Intel X79 LGA 2011, XMP ready" so it should work in my setup.

Some 2400 CAS 10:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231585
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231587
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820313285

Thoughts? Again...no real idea if these sticks (except for the GSkill ripjaws Z) will actually work in my setup.

Thanks again Knufire...really appreciate your thoughts and guidance!

 

[funsoul]

PS- Found out that, yes, pci-e 3.0 is supported by socket 2011. Until IB-E cpu's come out, enabling the 3.0 support requires applying a registry patch.

 

[funsoul]

Also found this one that should work:
G.SKILL Ripjaws Z ddr3 1866 CAS 8
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231539