New Build Questions

[MrDrudgeon]

As you can probably tell, I am quite new around here and I have joined looking for a community of people who care about the craft and are willing to offer feedback on potential builds. Beyond feedback for my build, I am looking for a community willing to assist me when I fell confident enough to overclock. I did some research as well as read through some forum posts and you guys seem to have exactly what I am looking for. So congrats on having a strong community feel. Now to the meat and potatoes. I am looking to purchase and build my own computer for the first time. My background is that in high school (I'm only 22 so not that long ago) I took vocational classes in Computer Systems Technology where we focused alot of our efforts on Hardware. I have unboxed and built new computers before, but never for myself and they were always spec'ed by the school. We always had a project every year to spec a computer given a budget ranging from 500USD to 3500USD, one year we even had an unlimited budget, some crazy rigs came out of that.. So working inside a computer is familiar territory, as well a researching parts. I am now at a point in my life where the amount of money I am making is beyond my cost of living so I finally have the opportunity to complete my dream for the last 8yrs and build my own rig. I have set a limit of 3500USD dollars and priced one out for near that and I would like to seek feedback on what I could do better on so Here is my List:

Case: Thermaltake Level 10 GT (VN10001W2N) Black SECC / Plastic ATX Full Tower Computer Case with Four Fans-1x 200mm Colorshift

PSU:COOLER MASTER Silent Pro Gold Series RSA00-80GAD3-US 1000W ATX 12V v2.3 / EPS 12V v2.92 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS GOLD Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply

Mobo: ASUS Sabertooth X79 LGA 2011 Intel X79 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard

CPU: Intel Core i7-3930K Sandy Bridge-E 3.2GHz (3.8GHz Turbo) LGA 2011 130W Six-Core Desktop Processor BX80619i73930K

RAM: CORSAIR Vengeance 16GB (2 x 8GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model CMZ16GX3M2A1600C10B

SSD: Crucial M4 CT256M4SSD2 2.5" 256GB SATA III MLC Internal Solid State Drive

HDD: Western Digital WD Black WD2002FAEX 2TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive - OEM

Optical: ASUS Black Blu-ray Burner SATA BW-14D1XT

Monitor: BenQ RL2450HT Black-Red 24" 5ms (2ms GTG) HDMI Widescreen LED Backlight Height & Pivot Adjustable LCD Monitor (x2)

The PC I have spec'ed I to serve two purposes, to be a gaming rign and have an easy time slicing up any game I throw at it, but more importantly a production rig. I currently do a little freelance video work as well as photography on a crappy Mac Book Pro (I hate it). I am building a rig that will greatly increase my productivity as well as to show my bosses (I work as a broadcast engineer daytime) how much more affordable Custom building should be compared to the overpriced Mac Pros they are currently using. Three things are staying and this is based off my research into some of this stuff, a six-core processor is a must as well as 32 GB of RAM. The specifics dont matter as much so if you have a suggestion other than what I spec'ed please feel free. The NVIDIA GeForce GTX TITAN is the last required piece. I know that the GTX690 still out performs it graphically but I went with this card for 2 reason, first is that it is based off the TESLA gpu line and for rendering and transcoding, nothing beats TESLA cards and I am looking for that kind of reliability and speed as my first priority, second is that I read a few forums posts of people having trouble with the 690s dual GPUs and some reliability issues there. What I am just way over paying for and what would you do differently given my budget? Lastly I have some questions about cooling, a lot of what I spec'ed is with the idea of eventually overclocking, as stated above so I want to pursue liquid cooling and here is where I am at a huge loss, as well as what I want to most help with, and sadly it gets the least info. Mostly whats recommended and after I have a solution, how do I test as to not flood my computer with coolant on its first go.

 

[NiHaoMike]

The 3930k takes quad channel memory. Other than that, it looks good. You'll need a good CPU cooler (212 Evo or better) and some good fans (I recommend Deltas or Nidecs with PWM) to get the most out of that 3930k.

 

[modd]

Like nihaomike said I would make sure you get 4 sticks of ram to use quad channel, and are you going to try over clocking? If not you really don't need to water cool just waste of money if not over clocking a large amount, a good air cooler will handle a a nice oc just fine.

 

[MrDrudgeon]

What do you mean by Quad channel memory. I do realize now that I didn't say that I will be getting two of the 16GB Ram Kits, so 4 8GB Sticks. Will this be enough or is there another spec I am missing? On the subject of cooling and over clocking, I would like to try and start around 4.5GHz and maybe go as high as 5GHz. Would this be possible with this setup assuming I have a liquid cooling solution and if its not possible (or advisable) to take this processor to 5GHz, would an air cooler work well enough for the 4.5GHz.?

 

[ThorV2]

You do not have to have quad channel. Which quad channel is factors of four. While it may help with what you do you do not have to have it for ot to work properly. Also if you plan to overclock your RAM I would recommend against the vengeance sticks. I would get crucial ballistix low profile yellow heat spreader ram. Yes a good.air.cooler.will be enough for 4.5ghz. Also I'd get the Asus P9X79 or Gugabyte UP4 the X79 Sabertooth is over priced and the same as a P9X79. I would go with the Gelid Black Edition HSF and some PK1 TIM. If you plan on WC or air cooling get a.different case. The Level 10 GT is overpriced and not worth it. If you want an expensive case foe EPeen get a 900D or a Mountain MODs. Back to the RAM. Do you know how much your syatem uses? You might only need two sticks of ram.

 

[EarthDog]

Personally, I dont even see the point in going X79 at this time for several reasons.

1. Its price for what you are using it for. Unless the application you use to manipulate video can use 6+ cores and doesnt/cannot use the GPU, then I would go that route.
2. The X79 sabertooth is a ripoff. About the only thing going for it is the 5 year warranty over other boards that are 3. That armor is marketing BS. You can find the same or better quality boards for less.
3. +1 for quad channel ram. Though its not needed and you really dont get many/any performance benefits with it now or in the future, you should at least use it if you are getting it.
EDIT: I see you are sticking with that CPU, my bad...but you can get great productivity done with less and prove your point even more to your bosses.

Here is what I would get if I was in your shoes...

First, wait a couple weeks until Haswell comes out (newest CPU from Intel).. and likely get that... but if you cant/dont want to wait:

3770k
Asrock Z77 Extreme 6
2x8GB DDR3 1600Mhz
OCZ Vertex 4 or OCZ Vector or Samsung 840 Pro (faster than M4 by far in writes)

So I guess since you are stuck on the hex core... GO 4x8GB DDR3 1600Mhz ram, and upgrade that SSD to one of the ones I listed above.

As far as 4.5Ghz+ on a 3930K, you will need something more than the Hyper 212 IMO... I also wouldnt put any Delta's/Midec's on there either as they can be VERY LOUD. I would get a cooler that does a better job with lesser fans for noise. Something like the NHD-14 or w/e the hell it is are one of the best air coolers out there.

Again, sabertooth, solid board, but paying for gimmicks there and I would avoid it. Either Giga UP5 or Extreme 6 or P9X79 Pro are solid choices for a bit to a lot less.

 

[Theocnoob]

+1 for the Noctua NHD14 cooler. It's very good. I've been using one since 2010. Just the fans it comes with are worth like $40 retail.

 

[Knufire]

What programs and versions are you using for editing purposes?

Do you live nearby a Microcenter?

If you want to pursue liquid cooling, I would recommend that you choose all your parts except your case and liquid cooling components first. Then, after we've decided what main components are good for you here, probably start a new thread in the liquid cooling section of the forums just for advice on the custom loop.

 

[MrDrudgeon]

To answer some questions:

Personally, I dont even see the point in going X79 at this time for several reasons.

The X79 sabertooth is a ripoff. About the only thing going for it is the 5 year warranty over other boards that are 3. That armor is marketing BS. You can find the same or better quality boards for less.

Either Giga UP5 or Extreme 6 or P9X79 Pro are solid choices for a bit to a lot less.

I'd get the Asus P9X79 or Gugabyte UP4 the X79 Sabertooth is over priced and the same as a P9X79.

Thanks for the MOBO suggestions, I have pretty much abandoned the Sabertooth X79 and I am currently researching these other boards and will make a decision.

Its price for what you are using it for. Unless the application you use to manipulate video can use 6+ cores and doesnt/cannot use the GPU, then I would go that route.

What programs and versions are you using for editing purposes?

I will be using the Adobe Creative Suite (soon to be Creative Cloud). All the reading I have done suggests that Premiere CS6 does "noticeably" benefit from a 6 core processor. This coupled with the MRE (Mercury Rendering Engine) that utilizes CUDA Architecture, I should be able to completely blow away the stock systems at work as well any with any that have NVIDIA quadro cards (both 4000 and K5000). I will also be experimenting with Davinci Resolve Lite and Avid Media Composer. After quadro and the necessary fibre cards (ATTO FF-NS12 for 10GigE and LSI 4GB Fibre channel) the Mac Pros at work easily cross the $10K mark, I really want to prove my point to these people.

Wait a couple weeks until Haswell comes out (newest CPU from Intel).. and likely get that.

Thanks for the info. My estimated build date is Aug. 30 so I am giving myself all summer to secure funds and work out all the details, hence my joining here now. I really want to be over prepared as to not mess anything up. I am prepared to do some research again if this ends up threating the MOBO I pick, I have forgotten which cycle of Ticks and Tocks Intel is currently on.

Do you live nearby a Microcenter?

If you want to pursue liquid cooling, I would recommend that you choose all your parts except your case and liquid cooling components first. Then, after we've decided what main components are good for you here, probably start a new thread in the liquid cooling section of the forums just for advice on the custom loop.

Unfortunately the closest micro center is the 5hr drive to Dallas or Houston so its not very realistic. I have seen you recommend them on some other posts for the benefit of saving money by purchasing the CPU and MOBO together there. As for Liquid cooling, I really want to try this as I have installed fans before and I want to advance my knowledge. As stated above, my ETA for this build is end of summer so I have given myself plenty of time to get this right before initial purchase and I wanted to consult a respected community to do this.

 

[Robert17]

to OCF. I've got nothing to add to the good advice you're getting. Except don't be afraid to take a weekend or a Saturday in Houston. The Microcenter there could be a neat stop as you take in some sights or grub, visit the Fry's on the NASA side of town. Make it worth the gas, get your eyes full. Nothing like them in S.A.

 

[PolePosition]

@MrDrudgeon

Just curious, but what was it that had you originally thinking about the Sabertooth x79?

I know people do their best here (especially the patrol) to trash Asus and steer everyone towards ASRock, which I have nothing against their boards, but most all motherboards are somewhat equal other than what you'll pay for them, but to say a cheap one is twice as good and better quality as an expensive one sounds a bit ridiculous to me. Perhaps it is the warranty, but it should be noted that the Sabertooth is the coolest running of all X79 boards, and therefore the quietest too, since noisy fans don't have to blaze along to keep it cool running.
Several members here own the Sabertooth X79, but we're pretty much a quiet bunch and don't get into too much persuasion, fanboyism, and sales pitches.

Like I said, I'm just curious what had you selecting the Sabertooth originally as opposed to other boards and makes. I also usually never second guess myself or rely only on one or two opinions when deciding computer parts. I do my research and homework, check out reviews, and check out several forums. After all, you're the one who has to live with it, not us.

EDIT: I'd consider maybe ditching the plastic case for one of aluminum or steel, especially if you're going to get into building your own rig now and into the future.

 

[MrDrudgeon]

Honestly, and I hate to admit this, because I had been so long (four years) out of the know, I started with the base of my build from youtubers freddiew and corridordigital. They did a build last august on the Node channel and that is what really got me thinking. From there I read reviews on all the gear they showed us they spec'ed and modified their build to fit my needs. I have the same mobo and case specifically. So I used my knowledge base and their parts to make strat line and then searched for notable forums to crowd source what I could/should change. Now I know that may not sound ideal, but I liked their build and just wanted a baseline.

 

[PolePosition]

Fair enough, and I can certainly relate, since I was outside the loop since 2004 before last June, when I found myself needing a new desktop, and was determined to build my own for a long time, but had not had the need. I pretty much had all my components selected before I found this place, and gave considerable thought to advice here, but stuck with my original plan. Since then, this place has been a wealth of information and helped me select a great monitor too, that being an Achieva Shimian QH270 Lite I ordered from Korea through an Ebay seller. Many here have purchased their monitors this way. I just wish I could put it in my sig, but the site says it has too many lines.

EDIT: Watercooling, depends on what you plan to actually use this rig for mostly.
1. The good; Great idea especially if you want to become a test junkie and getting hooked up with the benching team and others, and do a lot of heavy overclocking.
2. The bad; Its costly, requires a good deal of parts, space, and a larger case, especially if you want the loop inside the case, though some manage with standard ATX cases.
3. The ugly; Regular routine and extensive maintenance, which means you'll be breaking the rig down every 6 months to flush the system and clean waterblocks, so if you like tinkering inside the box quite often, go ahead, but if you prefer a stand alone system without the need for devoting time to meticulous cleaning, you might want to steer away from it and just get an adequate air or sealed water cooler unit and forget about it.

 

[Conumdrum]

You can make your lines longerrrrrrrrrr.

 

[EarthDog]

I know people do their best here (especially the patrol) to trash Asus and steer everyone towards ASRock, which I have nothing against their boards, but most all motherboards are somewhat equal other than what you'll pay for them, but to say a cheap one is twice as good and better quality as an expensive one sounds a bit ridiculous to me. Perhaps it is the warranty, but it should be noted that the Sabertooth is the coolest running of all X79 boards, and therefore the quietest too, since noisy fans don't have to blaze along to keep it cool running.
Several members here own the Sabertooth X79, but we're pretty much a quiet bunch and don't get into too much persuasion, fanboyism, and sales pitches.

The 'patrol'? What kind of a dig was that? Persuade, fanboyism, and sales pitches? Seriously??!!!! You are a real piece of work PP...

Nobody trashes ASUS (at least not 'the patrol'), they make GREAT boards! A lot of those 'in the know' are just aware there are similar or perhaps even better boards for less/same than the Sabertooth is all. The cost of the board isn't everything as far as quality. Bells and Whistles do not make a quality board. Is it a bad board? Nope, quite the contrary. Are there boards of similar or better quality out there for the same cost or less, absolutely. All 'the patrol' tries to do is educate the poster on their options. There isnt a hint of fanboyism or sales pitches to posters as I could care less what they choose. My job as a poster her is to inform people with the facts and it is their job to make a choice based on the information given.

Can you source websites that state the Sabertooth (or any board) is the coolest running board? Where did you get that information from?
Can you also source where anyone said a board is twice as good as another (how the hell does one quantify that?!!)?

I'd like you to think about something RE: any board with two fans (like Sabertooth). Most boards do not have a fan on the VRM area, some with none, period. So answer this...which board would be quieter, one without fans which makes NO noise what so ever, or one with 2 fans?

Sure the fans are quiet on most boads (though I have to admit, without adjusting the one on my Z77 OC Formula it was definitely audible over 3 Yate Loons at 1k RPM, the little 40mm jobber), but is it the quietest board? Not compared to the passively cooled ones, or boards with one fan that also run cool. This is what I mean by getting the facts out and what you seem to misconstrue as fanboyism or persuasion. Your statement is misleading, especially since you haven't experienced other boards like others (including myself) have. So how do you know its the quietest? How do you know its the coolest running board? I dont care if it was the Sabertooth or a tingamajobber board, 2 fans are generally louder than one and I would bet my life 2 or 1 are louder than NONE.

Please be careful with your thinly veiled barbs calling people 'fanboys' as that is pretty insulting, antithetic, and a bit ironic too.

 

[PolePosition]

FYI, it was Knufire who I learned the term "fanboyism" from and have seen it used by him on many more occasions than the one or two times I've ever posted it, so take your accusations and claims up with him, not me, if you think its an insult, or is this something senior members are allowed but none others?

I just so happen to own and use a Sabertooth X79 for close to a year now, while you may have had one for a short time to test and review, so I ought to know something about the equipment I've been using. The two fans you mentioned on the board are so quiet you'd need a stethoscope to hear ANY noise from them as they are very small and isolate cooling at the VRM to help assist and keep other case fans from running higher rpm to draw outside air in and heat away from the system. The board also has sensors at critical points along with AI software to help monitor temps,voltage, at and by components and case fan speeds. Some might call that a gimmick, but I call that an added feature you don't find with most boards.
The source for coolest running board can be found here
and a more informed review of the Sabertooth X79 can be found here

On a side note, I'm not here to argue with you or debate your claims. I'm just providing MY OWN insight to the ORIGINAL POSTER / THREAD STARTER
That is what makes this a community and not just one on one consulting.

EDIT:

2. The X79 sabertooth is a ripoff. About the only thing going for it is the 5 year warranty over other boards that are 3. That armor is marketing BS. You can find the same or better quality boards for less.

Could you please source this ? Unless it is perhaps a personal opinion?

 

[EarthDog]

LOL that was from ASUS, ROFLMAO... I also have the biggest... unit... says me. Believe me? I said it, its on the internet. Has to be true right?

LOL, he isnt the one that called a 'patrol' I am no doubt a part of, fanboys. Not sure what he as to do with anything. You used the word to disparage our efforts, not him.

A lot (all?) of boards have sensors on them in strategic locations, and all have software to monitor them. Its a feature you find on most boards, actually. Perhaps not B75 low end type things but any enthusiast level board sure does.

I also never mentioned anything about your lack of experience with a Sabertooth, but clearly spoke to your lack of knowledge of the OTHER boards that you havent used. Are you paying attention when you read and reply?

I agree with your last point but when its facts and opinions that do not defy laws (quiet as those fans may be, they are still louder than none). Not ASUS marketing . Am I splitting hairs, a bit, certainly. But I don't want someone buying any board on claims that are not true is all.

/threadjack... enjoy.

EDIT: I dont want to have to correct and subsequently argue either, note. But I do feel the need to correct things, especially when I know damn well I am grouped in that disparaging comment you made earlier. Perhaps stop throwing back door barbs towards people and we can have a semi intelligent discussion at some time about boards merits and otherwise. I suggest you come with a more open mind to it however...

Could you please source this ? Unless it is perhaps a personal opinion?

1. Ripoff - is essentially my opinion. However it was made with knowing there are boards that have as many/more power phases and features at the same cost or less. Ripoff is an incredibly strong word though. Overpriced is more accurate and I will use that going forward so as not to dramatize the issue.
2. 5 year warranty only thing going for it - Can you name me something that no other board has that that board offers? Dual fans.. not needed. Armor... not needed so why pay for it?
3. Armor is marketing BS - Educated opinion in that its the only board with it. If it was actually needed, other boards would be using it. NONE do. There are a couple reviews that question its effectiveness/need.
4. You can find the same or better quality boards - Look at other boards is all I have to say there. Again power phases, and features it has very little that others do not have for the same price or less.

Let's agree to disagree since there is seemingly no chance you will open your mind up. Again, take it to PM, you are off ignore so I can accept them now.

 

[PolePosition]

LOL that was from ASUS, ROFLMAO... I also have the biggest... unit... says me. Believe me? I said it, its on the internet. Has to be true right?

You're not selling products on a global website, ASUS is, and there is such a thing called false advertising where a company can be sued.

EDIT: I dont want to have to correct and subsequently argue either, note. But I do feel the need to correct things, especially when I know damn well I am grouped in that disparaging comment you made earlier. Perhaps stop throwing back door barbs towards people and we can have a semi intelligent discussion at some time about boards merits and otherwise. I suggest you come with a more open mind to it however...

Perhaps if people will choose their words wisely and not call my motherboard "a ripoff" or "gimmick", it won't incline me to respond with supposed disparaging comments for which one feels offended, because I feel the need to correct things too.
Mom always told me if I can't say something nice, say nothing at all, because you don't see me trashing other people's components or brands in a deliberate attempt to discourage others without any source or facts to back up those claims.

 

[EarthDog]

I'm just going to let this go before I get banned... See you around the forums.

 

[Knufire]

Really? You feel offended because we feel like the motherboard in your computer is a tad overpriced and a tad overmarketed? This is precisely why I don't recommend products I own. That it all. Nobody said was a bad board and I haven't met anyone with a Sabertooth who was dissatisfied. But when they could be equally satisfied with a cheaper board, why pay more? I'm sorry you feel like we're personally attacking you, but your personal experience doesn't change the specs on paper and the specs say I can get an equally performing board for less money.

Also, FYI, common knowledge that an company given statistic is BS. Why don't out see us quoting CPU benchmarks from AMD or Intel or GPU benchmarks from AMD or NVIDIA is because statistics are easy to manipulate when the source has an agenda to follow.

Yes, I have called you a fanboy in the past because you continually to solely defend ASUS, but I see that I was wrong, and you just take your computer a bit too personally. If you started trashing all the parts in my rig, frankly, I wouldn't care. I had my reasons for buying what I did and I don't expect those reasons to be applicable to anyone else because they're my own reasons.