Surround headphones - 5.1 vs 7.1, what should I get anyway?

[Groov3st3r]

Now the Vengeance... that does look quite appealing, both price-wise and the fact they are supposedly able to tell me where sounds are coming from in games. Hmm, might be onto something.

But I fear that due to the sheer size of my GPU and the tiny case my Franken-rig is crammed into, I can't have a Xonar. If it could use the PCIe slots, maybe, but that could compromise the GPU cooling.

 

[Mjolnir]

Well. Your motherboard has 2 pcie slots under the graphics card. So you'd have one slot free for airflow. Assuming your case is well ventilated your temps really shouldn't alter with the addition of a small sound card right at the bottom. I've heard the corsair 1300 to be a little flat without an amp though. But this is just hearsay and reading on forums and such. I've personally never used the set.

 

[Groov3st3r]

I was going to post a picture of my PC to answer the ventilation question, but then I realised that it looked like a mess so I will leave it at that.

It has no left side and all front bays for optical drives are taken out creating a direct tunnel to the cpu fans. The GPU obscures the PCI port required by that Xonar you presented. this wouldn't be an issue If I could mount the card lower, but it takes up two slots and there isn't any space for cooling left beyond the bottom edge of my motherboard - which is where the fans would be. So I need a PCIe card if anything, to fit below the card on the bottom slot with relatively little to no impact on cooling.

http://sound-cards-review.toptenreviews.com/asus-xonar-essence-st-review.html This caught my attention.

 

[Mjolnir]

The DGX I linked is a PCIE 1x card. It'll work in any PCIE slot. 1x, 4x, 8x, 16x. So you could put it in the very bottom slot. . Larger PCIE slots all accept smaller PCIE cards.

The ST is a very expensive higher end model of the DGX. And it's also a PCI card, not PCIE. It won't even work on your board; period. The STX is the PCIE model.

Don't get me wrong; the ST/STX models are awesome. I used to own the ST model myself, on my old X58 system with a PCI slot. Then when I swapped over I had to drop it as my current board only supports PCIE. PCI is considered a legacy slot. It's dying out. And like I mentioned your board doesn't even have any PCI slots ^^. But the STX is well out of your price range.

 

[Groov3st3r]

In that case, I still have a SB VX 5.1 buried somewhere

And yeah, I just realised that it's a bit out at 160 gbp....
Ill search ebay for Xonars and report back


EDIT:
Yeah, it looks like Xonar and Vengeance would be the way to go here, just about within budget and promises gaming competitiveness.

 

[Mjolnir]

I'd argue your onboard would sound better than that 20 dollar sound card . I've got that card because my brothers computer at one point when I first built it for him had no working onboard sound. Was decent for 20 bucks; but not really any better than onboard. Maybe a little more flexible with EQ's/effects but that's about it. Won't affect headphone performance.

 

[Groov3st3r]

Hmm that sounds about right.

I wonder if I should save on that card and just get the slightly bigger Vengeance 1500?
It connects VIA usb which would bypass the card anyway. Only reservation I have is how loud the headphones will be without an AMP...

 

[Mjolnir]

Thing about USB headsets is that they'll never ever sound any better. You can't pair them with a DAC/Amp or a sound card because they bypass all of that. So if you're not happy with it.. That's basically it. You've gotta buy something new. There's no improving the sound.

I'm not sure how good the 1500's sound, if at all. Again I'm not a fan of headsets. I'd look up several reviews I guess or wait for some others to chip in here on them.

 

[Groov3st3r]

See what you can make of this: http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Genera...0-and-1500-Headset-Review/Audio-Testing-Games

The 1500 can be adjusted via its own EQ, so I could bring it up to standard (in theory) and it is only a little bit more than the 1300.

 

[Mjolnir]

See what you can make of this: http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Genera...0-and-1500-Headset-Review/Audio-Testing-Games

The 1500 can be adjusted via its own EQ, so I could bring it up to standard (in theory) and it is only a little bit more than the 1300.

Like I said; as demonstrated there; the 1300 lacks the 'power' without an amp of some sort. It won't hit as hard running off your onboard. I still dislike virtual surround as well as USB headsets. TBH I'd avoid the USB headset but that's me.

"Got the Vengeance 1300 and it is great well worth getting

reply

July 19, 2012 | 12:51 PM - Posted by Tim Verry
neat, did you pair it with a dedicated sound card?

reply
January 17, 2013 | 04:25 AM - Posted by UE (not verified)
I hope so the 1300 are horrible before pairing with a soundcard... that said the XonarDX is great value and when paired with the Unixonar drivers fantastic.

A good set of cans, but yeah... soundcard is needed."

Quoted from someones comment on that site. So if you go the 1300, get a DGX. Otherwise avoid the 1300 as well. IMO.

 

[txus.palacios]

Or use a cheap amplifier (think cMoy?).

 

[Mjolnir]

I was thinking about a fiio mini amp too. Not sure which one though.. Haven't heard of cmoy. I'll look that one up for myself

 

[Aynjell]

Fiio amps are garbage.

 

[Mjolnir]

You bring very strong opinions with blunt words without explaining yourself a lot. Ive quite enjoyed both the fiio amps that I've used. And they were only lower end models. Not the greatest for sure. But to call them garbage is a little much.

 

[Aynjell]

You bring very strong opinions with blunt words without explaining yourself a lot. Ive quite enjoyed both the fiio amps that I've used. And they were only lower end models. Not the greatest for sure. But to call them garbage is a little much.

On this we differ. If you think they sound okay then the burden of research lies on you. What empirical evidence could I provide you that would confirm they indeed were garbage? I'd rather have a diy cmoy over any fiio offering. I'll stand by that statement until I've heard something that doesn't sound terible from them. Having been to head-fi meets, I've heard many offerings, hell I've even organized a head-fi meet.

As an enthusiast in headphones, and a VERY proud head-fier I stand by fiio products being absolutely garbage. If you don't believe me, listen to it for yourself and compare any of their offerings to the single most basic implementation of an amplication circuit ever made (literally a textbook implementation of an op amp, and an op amp that sounds like trash in most gear to boot), aka the CMOY, and you'll agree with me. Fiio is garbage.

if I have to explain it, you wouldn't understand. That's just how audio is; if you own a fiio with little to no experience with other products, you'd probably defend it avidly and angrily; if you'd heard it and then heard anything worth a crap right after you'd discard the fiio like the garbage it is. Personally there isn't a single headphone that benefits from the E5 or E3 sufficiently enough that it's better than without. iPod with line out into an E5 to a pair of UM1's, or MDR-V6's, and with both cases it sounds better without the line out and E5. How does that work? How does an E5 sound worse than the ****ty amplication circuitry in the ipod it was DESIGNED to replace? how is that not garbage? Oh and before the argument starts about their other products, better can be had for less once more.

I'd argue your onboard would sound better than that 20 dollar sound card . I've got that card because my brothers computer at one point when I first built it for him had no working onboard sound. Was decent for 20 bucks; but not really any better than onboard. Maybe a little more flexible with EQ's/effects but that's about it. Won't affect headphone performance.

My testing confirms this even with an x-fi titanium. The sound is better with onboard. I feel like creative is coloring their sound even with digital output because there's a audible difference between the two and I hate the way the x-fi sounds now, even through optical.

 

[Mjolnir]

I see your point. I used the E5 and E6. I felt they added a little warmth, but that's about it. Though they completely pale in comparison to my old Xonar ST and current Audioengine D1 .

Yes I can see you're VERY proud. Perhaps a little too much . (Just saying, I get your point, just relax a little lol).

For reference my current setup is in my sig for my computer; and my portable setup is Shure SE215 IEMs and a Cowon J3. Nothing extra because I don't feel I need it at current. One day I'll buy more expensive IEMs, but these will do for now. I used to own Ultimate Ears UE700's but my left channel cord went fuzzy.. Thin cables do that. Grr.

I've always avoided ipods myself.. So no comment on those.

As for the Creative crap, completely agreed. I've never liked creative soundcards. And found X-fi to be more about simulation/virtualization than an actual improvement in sound quality.

 

[Aynjell]

I see your point. I used the E5 and E6. I felt they added a little warmth, but that's about it. Though they completely pale in comparison to my old Xonar ST and current Audioengine D1 .

Yes I can see you're VERY proud. Perhaps a little too much . (Just saying, I get your point, just relax a little lol).

For reference my current setup is in my sig for my computer; and my portable setup is Shure SE215 IEMs and a Cowon J3. Nothing extra because I don't feel I need it at current. One day I'll buy more expensive IEMs, but these will do for now. I used to own Ultimate Ears UE700's but my left channel cord went fuzzy.. Thin cables do that. Grr.

I've always avoided ipods myself.. So no comment on those.

As for the Creative crap, completely agreed. I've never liked creative soundcards. And found X-fi to be more about simulation/virtualization than an actual improvement in sound quality.

If you've never heard a cmoy you should make one. While the process may seem daunting at first, the only problem I had was soldering the pot wrong. I had it backwards... and it did wierd things... but as long as you follow the instructions in the link below, it's painfully easy and inexpensive. I suggest you try it!

http://tangentsoft.net/audio/cmoy-tutorial/

As a note, if you pursue this, read the instructions several times before doing so. Really research the process, it seemed to help me avoid making many mistakes. Unfortunately this project can be downright impossible to troubleshoot without help, but there's lots of diy'ers on head-fi.

(for me, it was a relaxing evening culminating in my first amplifier, which as you can imagine made it even better!)

My current setup is the onboard, leading into a Audio-GD NFB-2, outputting via ACSS to my audio-gd C-2. Then it ruins my hearing with a pair of Grado SR325i, or a pair of Sennheiser HD650. =)

(about 1600$ or so worth of gear that I've collected over time, and man do I love me some AGD stuff, in fact my AGD amplifier is more or less my reciever. It also is tasked with pre-amping to my speakers, which are just klipsch promedia 2.1, but the end result is a well balanced sound. I love it!)

 

[TollhouseFrank]

check our frontpage reviews. I've done quite a few on surround sound headsets for OCF in the past few months.

The set I am currently using is the Coolermaster CMStorm. It can hook up either via analog or a dual-usb connector. The big difference that I noticed between the hookups was that analog 5.1 gave better surround response, the dual-usb hookup had a lot better equalizer and tweaking capability as opposed to my onboard Realtek HD audio.

 

[noxqzs]

I looked at the guide posted by Knufire and I see that AKG is the brand to go for when doing surround headphones. But at prices between 200-330 GBP, that's a tad out of my budget. I could raise that money, obviously, but I don't want to spend more on my headphones than I did on my graphics card... It is a large expenditure.

The two items I have spent the most money on for my computer are the monitor and headset. After 5 generations of cpu sockets, those two items are still at the front line.