Upgrading 775

[kommanderkodiak]

kommanderkodiak, why are you coming into the post and then making it sound like everyone who's trying to help so far are "incompetent" by "forgetting the most important thing". If you read everything we have already found out quite a bit even without asking that question. He's on an E6300 with DDR2 ram that runs at CL7 and is running a Radeon 5770. His current MB has no memory dividers for helping with OCing and he's currently stuck with a FSB of 310Mhz making his E6300 run at 2.17ghz which isn't much over his default. Maybe you didn't mean to but when you posted it that way it came across (at least to me) as a little "passive aggressive" and snippy.

Groov3st3r it sounds like you should have no issues with a Q6600 in your current setup. I'd honestly just get that and then have fun. You know you can hit 310FSB with your current setup, and a Q6600 at a 300FSB will run at 3Ghz, a hell of a lot faster than your current one + quad vs dual. For the price you can't go wrong.

YOU said incompetent not me dont put words in my mouth. My point was no1 bothered to ask an important question it was future reference and every1 was quick to recommend something they didnt bother asking him he had the money for. Arguing on these forums is frowned upon, you didnt understand my point clearly

 

[azuza001]

I'm not trying to argue, I'm simply saying that your post seemed insulting to me.

Anyways like I said the general consensus has been either go to a Q6600 or go to a socket 1155 board and new processor. The Q9550 is not worth the cost and the OP has said that after further review it's not worth it.

 

[kommanderkodiak]

I'm not trying to argue, I'm simply saying that your post seemed insulting to me.

Anyways like I said the general consensus has been either go to a Q6600 or go to a socket 1155 board and new processor. The Q9550 is not worth the cost and the OP has said that after further review it's not worth it.

and i said it wasnt meant to be taken that way only YOU took it that. Ill be very clear DROP IT.

 

[ivanlabrie]

Now, I have to agree with azuza001, your posts have a not-to-adequate ring to them, some may perceive them as aggresive or even insultant.
Re read what you posted. I know it's a forum, but if you take good measures you can avoid coming off as arrogant.
My two cents...

 

[kommanderkodiak]

Now, I have to agree with azuza001, your posts have a not-to-adequate ring to them, some may perceive them as aggresive or even insultant.
Re read what you posted. I know it's a forum, but if you take good measures you can avoid coming off as arrogant.
My two cents...

were all gonna drop this right here an now.
I never meant to come off as arrogant if you go through my posts you see thats not me at all. I got blunt with him when he put words in my mouth I NEVER called anyone incompetent if it appeared i was very cool with him after that, thats because i WAS to get the point across i will not tolerate it further Im not gonna go back any edit what was said its pointless hed have ot edit his regarding it and it would change nothing.

My intent was from the beginning was to bring awareness to the fact no one asked the very first question that should be asked when the persons hardware isnt listed so they do not have the persion theyre assisting buy something that ends up not working with their set up because they didnt know his powersupply his board or his ram etc. He took offense to it.

No one was singled out as doing anything wrong, yet he took to it as if i pointed him out.
He then singles me out and throws accusations my way (saying i basically called everyone incompetent, i did not) I gave the aforement future reference for helping people. he could of said hey that came off a little strong could you edit down a bit? id have gladly obliged and done so, instead he forced me to clarify my position and state my intent and then HE CONTINUES. reread the whole exchange and youl lsee that as the case.


Thats it, this ends right here do not continue. Allow the op to post so we can help get his upgrade done.

 

[RJARRRPCGP]

Actually, the Q9550 pwned the i3 2100 in a fair amount of tests and it wasn't even OC'ed yet!
The i3 2100 will lose to many benches with a tweaked 775 setup! O_O


The Q9550 pwned the i3 2100 in x264 encoding!

Because Intel crippled the i3 2100 badly, it's basically today's Celeron!

The contrast of Sandy Bridge vs. Yorkfield isn't quite as high as Thuban vs. Agena & Deneb.
And of course, not as a high contrast as Conroe vs. Prescott.

 

[Groov3st3r]

Actually, I cam SO CLOSE to buying a Q6600 for 27 GBP (40$), but I got snipped at the last minute by about 10$ and that was my limit for that particular core since it was listed as *not-tested*. Maybe a god thing I didn't get that one.
Cheapest one I could find was around 45 GBP + P&P, but thats okay. Next friday I should be getting one.

I have a Conroe Tbh I wouldn't have bothered with anything had my E6300 been the 2.8ghz version. Or just one notch higher up, the one after had more cache and things that just give it the edge.

Overall, Intel is a solid performance core manufacturer in my opinion. It works, its fairly cheap to get performance, I can't complain. I was looking at AMD phenom range but that would still require me to buy a brand new board and doing that I wouldn't bother equipping it with mediocre hardware.

So Q6600 it is. Assuming my budgeting is correct, next friday + time for delivery will be it.

Also, I know all components inside my computer. I dismantle it on nearly regular basis ;P Perks of an open case setup and dust allergy.
Glad to have a solid 775, even cheap mediocre components perform well against any modern setups. Looks like power IS cheap

From there, I have an option of saving up and either upgrading the board to P45 and decent ddr3 or start collecting parts for a new rig.
For that I am still unsure which way to go.

I5 is better priced for the performance it delivers. I7 can handle a lot more but at a premium and isn't always used to its full capacity.
Because I am a bit stuck in ye olden days, I'm gonna need some guidance here on what is best. So far I know that:
i5 can push higher for less
i7 can have HT disabled to push it up + is equipped with more Cache and is generally more pumped with features and speed at a cost
Ivy bridge is better than Sandy bridge

How are they for oveclocking? Which generation is best for that, which compensates the need for O/C with sheer power?

 

[MongGrel]

and i said it wasnt meant to be taken that way only YOU took it that. Ill be very clear DROP IT.

You do come off as a bit defensive a lot, drink a beer now and then or just chill out a bit occasionally and don't hit send too fast sometimes

 

[ivanlabrie]

Actually, I cam SO CLOSE to buying a Q6600 for 27 GBP (40$), but I got snipped at the last minute by about 10$ and that was my limit for that particular core since it was listed as *not-tested*. Maybe a god thing I didn't get that one.
Cheapest one I could find was around 45 GBP + P&P, but thats okay. Next friday I should be getting one.

I have a Conroe Tbh I wouldn't have bothered with anything had my E6300 been the 2.8ghz version. Or just one notch higher up, the one after had more cache and things that just give it the edge.

Overall, Intel is a solid performance core manufacturer in my opinion. It works, its fairly cheap to get performance, I can't complain. I was looking at AMD phenom range but that would still require me to buy a brand new board and doing that I wouldn't bother equipping it with mediocre hardware.

So Q6600 it is. Assuming my budgeting is correct, next friday + time for delivery will be it.

Also, I know all components inside my computer. I dismantle it on nearly regular basis ;P Perks of an open case setup and dust allergy.
Glad to have a solid 775, even cheap mediocre components perform well against any modern setups. Looks like power IS cheap

From there, I have an option of saving up and either upgrading the board to P45 and decent ddr3 or start collecting parts for a new rig.
For that I am still unsure which way to go.

I5 is better priced for the performance it delivers. I7 can handle a lot more but at a premium and isn't always used to its full capacity.
Because I am a bit stuck in ye olden days, I'm gonna need some guidance here on what is best. So far I know that:
i5 can push higher for less
i7 can have HT disabled to push it up + is equipped with more Cache and is generally more pumped with features and speed at a cost
Ivy bridge is better than Sandy bridge

How are they for oveclocking? Which generation is best for that, which compensates the need for O/C with sheer power?

Cool that you made up your mind...
For the time being the q6600 should do.
When the time comes and you want to upgrade, who knows, maybe we'll reccomend Haswell to ya
Well, I'd avoid anything AMD with a ten foot pole (except perhaps a trinity laptop), and the chip to get if you're mostly gaming and not working with your pc doing rendering and heavy multithreaded stuff, is any of the Sandy/Ivy I5's.
If you want to OC the 2500k is a great buy, if not perhaps i5 3550.
Cpu is not so important, cause, when comparing these latest generation Intel chips, most of them should be able to power any single high end card solution for some time.

 

[tachi1247]

budget for a completely new build. don't put any money into a 775 system at this point. the performance increase you are going to get is insignificant when measured on the scale of the latest enthusiast equipment. whatever slight boost you get today will be long forgotten when next years games come out. Your going to spend 20-25% of the cost of a newer build so the value really isn't there.

 

[azuza001]

budget for a completely new build. don't put any money into a 775 system at this point. the performance increase you are going to get is insignificant when measured on the scale of the latest enthusiast equipment. whatever slight boost you get today will be long forgotten when next years games come out. Your going to spend 20-25% of the cost of a newer build so the value really isn't there.

Nah, the Q6600 is a great choice for 50-60$. He'll get a boost in his gaming performance and won't spend much. On top of that the Q6600 is still a decent processor for games, I'd say OCed it is faster than a majority of the I3's out there now for gaming. And if he wanted to continue to OC then he'd have to get a K chip now days, which means a pretty big investment against the Q6600.

I'm glad to see you figured out what you wanted to do Groov3st3r. You can get some really good stuff used sometimes. Let us know how it gos.

 

[Groov3st3r]

Will do Thanks everyone

I did some reading and wanted to find out more about the 3rd gen 3770K. After looking at some articles online on TH, I saw that its absolutely pointless to O/C 3770k because any gain in speed will be negated as soon as the chip starts running too hot. Which it will, apparently hitting 4.5 or 4.6 is easy but it throttles back to stock 3.5 when it goes to 100 degrees. And it will go to 100 degrees with any o/c....

Starting to think that technology is going backwards 0.0 Would it be better to get an older generation i-series core or a newer one? Any specific speed difference other than clock speed?
Say how much better is 2600k over 970? Because the new tech is really confusing...

All this talk about how they don't use FSB anymore but something-or-other clock speeds and multipliers and its difficult and after increasing clock speed from 100 to 110, nearly no system works properly. It all sounds like doom-and-gloom frankly. From what I read anyway. People saying tiny performance increase breaks the stability.
No wonder 775 boards can still be bought brand new.

Can someone shed some light on this new hardware issue for me? Because them ore research I do, the more confused I get 0.0

 

[ivanlabrie]

In a nutshell, Sandy Bridge is miles ahead any older gen Intel (or any brand lol) cpu -at least for gaming-
Your best bet is the i5 2500k unless you do stuff that requires more threads.
You now overclock with the cpu multiplier (and at times boosting the base clock, which is tied to the pci-e frequency...hence you cannot go nuts with that, or else everything in your pc starts to die )
A quad core like the I5 2500k can be had for less than 180usd new and used for 125 at times, and it's almost guaranteed to do 4.5ghz with a $20 cooler, which is an insane level of performance.

 

[Knufire]

Will do Thanks everyone

I did some reading and wanted to find out more about the 3rd gen 3770K. After looking at some articles online on TH, I saw that its absolutely pointless to O/C 3770k because any gain in speed will be negated as soon as the chip starts running too hot. Which it will, apparently hitting 4.5 or 4.6 is easy but it throttles back to stock 3.5 when it goes to 100 degrees. And it will go to 100 degrees with any o/c....

Starting to think that technology is going backwards 0.0 Would it be better to get an older generation i-series core or a newer one? Any specific speed difference other than clock speed?
Say how much better is 2600k over 970? Because the new tech is really confusing...

All this talk about how they don't use FSB anymore but something-or-other clock speeds and multipliers and its difficult and after increasing clock speed from 100 to 110, nearly no system works properly. It all sounds like doom-and-gloom frankly. From what I read anyway. People saying tiny performance increase breaks the stability.
No wonder 775 boards can still be bought brand new.

Can someone shed some light on this new hardware issue for me? Because them ore research I do, the more confused I get 0.0

Someone's is feeding you a lot of really bad and completely wrong information.

The simple fact is that Ivy Bridge runs hot compared to Sandy Bridge. There's no other difference. It still runs cooler than my i7-920 does. Sandy Bridge was special in that you could OC to 4.5GHz with a $20-30 heatsink and keep temperatures under control. Now you just need a $50 heatsink to hit 4.5GHz and keep temps under control. Yeah, if you're going to try to hit 4.5GHz on the stock cooler, it's going to throttle, but that's what aftermarket cooling is for.

In general, the clock speed of your CPU is the FSB or BLCK (goes by several names) times the CPU multipler. In general, the multiplier is locked on a CPU unless you buy a special unlocked version. Any Intel CPU that ends in a -K or is designated a "Extreme Edition" CPU has the multiplier unlocked. On older platforms, where you had to shell out $900-$1000 for an unlocked CPU, most people just OCed by increasing the FSB. However, on Sandy Bridge and Ivy Bridge, FSB is tied to the PCIe slot frequency. This REALLY doesn't like being changed, and things will get unstable if quickly if you increase the FSB (which stock is 100, 110 is like the absolute max you can get if you're lucky before things start crashing). However, in order to counter this design, Intel made unlocked CPUs much more affordable (like the 2500K and the 2600K).

This has multiple benefits, as before, everything was derived off the FSB frequency. Meaning that when you OCed your CPU, you also had to keep your RAM speed and your Uncore frequency and a whole bunch of other things in check. Now, since all the OCing is just done by increasing the CPU mulitplier, it doesn't affect ANYTHING else and makes OCing much easier.

In general, 775 is so outdated and so old now, that it's just not worth investing more money in. Just stay with it as long as you can, and save up for a new board/CPU/RAM.

 

[azuza001]

Knufire has it right. On Ivy or Sandy bridge you can only overclock your system by changing the multiplier, you really don't want to mess with the Bclk on those systems. With the older I7's/I5's and socket 775's your basically stuck with a single multiplier and have to change the FSB/Bclk to gain any kind of overclock.

When it comes to upgrading to one of these new systems from an old system it's hard to because it's more than just a processor swapout. you need a new processor, new ram, and a new motherboard. And going to sandy/ivy means you have to spend at least 200$ to get a processor that can overclock as well as an additional 100$ to get a motherboard that supports overclocking. Is this bad? Yes and no, its bad that it would require you to double your budget to get a new system that would overclock and be worth it vs just grabbing a new processor like you decided to do. Its good however in it does give a major speed boost going to sandy/ivy.

As for sandy vs ivy, well, thats a different issue. Sandy typically clocks higher but Ivy is more efficient. An Ivy at 4.5 is about the same as a Sandy at 4.8.

In short, the days of buying a cheaper processor and OCing it to match the performance of a better one are over. You have to buy a board and a processor that are both by design set up for overclocking to do it with Intel anymore. But in all honestly isn't that what we as enthusiasts have always done anyways?

 

[Knufire]

Little bit off on on the prices. $220 for a CPU and $130 for a motherboard. Plus $30-50 for a heatsink.

Sandy and Ivy clock about the same, both hit around 4.5GHz as the average OC.

 

[azuza001]

Yea, I was. Thats about 400$ just to have a setup that can overclock. Just not right.

<Rant>

DAMN IT AMD! WHY CAN'T YOU PERFORM RIGHT? Even if they could get a processor that defaults at the old I7's (not even the 2 series) but could OC no matter the processor/motherboard (obviously better board works better) it would give people a choice. We shouldn't have to spend at least 400$ just to get a setup that we can further tweak / push the design further.

</Rant>

lol

 

[Knufire]

Yeah, I hear you. It's kinda sad that my 920, released in 09 or something, is still more powerful than anything AMD has out...

 

[wingman99]

Yea, I was. Thats about 400$ just to have a setup that can overclock. Just not right.

<Rant>

DAMN IT AMD! WHY CAN'T YOU PERFORM RIGHT? Even if they could get a processor that defaults at the old I7's (not even the 2 series) but could OC no matter the processor/motherboard (obviously better board works better) it would give people a choice. We shouldn't have to spend at least 400$ just to get a setup that we can further tweak / push the design further.

</Rant>

lol

That's why intel locked all the BCLK's and cpu's except the k's, so you can't overclock for cheap anymore.

 

[azuza001]

I know. And it is only going to get worse. Look at gaming performance between the Core 2 Quad 9550, Core I7 870 / 920, Core I7 2600k, and Core I7 3770k. When you put a high end video card in there the difference between the processors from a "generation to next generation" boost is getting worse and worse for gaming.

I mean the difference between the 2600k and 3770k is little to nothing compaired to the jump between the Core 2 Quad and the original Core I7's (which I got about a 10% boost from at the same speed) in gaming. There isn't any real reason for Intel to cater to us, the enthusiasts because they've already got such a huge lead that even if everything AMD has said about Piledriver is 100% true it still isn't enough to catch up.

The future does not look rosy to my eyes. I may be using this Core I7 for a long time....