-
Welcome to Overclockers Forums! Join us to reply in threads, receive reduced ads, and to customize your site experience!
Advantages between a 780i vs x38 chipset
- Thread starter zonogon
- Start date
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2007
if your going with only the 1 gfx card then go with the x38, you will be able to get better ocing with the x38 chipset. but if you want TRI-SLI right now then grab the 780i, otherwise wait for the 790i if you still want TRI-SLI. the 790i will be completely redone and have 3 PCI-e 2.0 slots instead of 2 and a third fake like the current 780i.
780i
Pros:
·SLI (if you care)
·Works with Penryn out of the box
Cons:
·Retarded Bridge chip design for check-mark PCIe 2.0 Support.
- PCIe 2.0 Bridge chip connected to the PCIe 1.0 bus.... see a problem here?
·Southbridge contains PCIe 16x 1.0 slot... Note that the SB link isn't really designed for that + all other relevant IO.
·Really is just a 680i with a higher price tag and a whole bunch of things thrown onto it. See the SNL iRaq skit.
·Poor Latency due to bridge chips and shoehorned SB PCIe lines FTW
It really makes me wonder why they didn't just put an HT link on the NB (a la Apple/IBM's G5 northbridge) and connect it to a "southbridge" that incorporated the PCIe 2.0 lanes and IO hardware. They would have had to engineer two chips instead of 4 (counting the 790) and one chip would have just been the 680i + HT link circuitry and possibly minus it's own PCIe circuitry. The "southbridge" could have ended up being their next AMD chipset as well.
Pros:
·SLI (if you care)
·Works with Penryn out of the box
Cons:
·Retarded Bridge chip design for check-mark PCIe 2.0 Support.
- PCIe 2.0 Bridge chip connected to the PCIe 1.0 bus.... see a problem here?
·Southbridge contains PCIe 16x 1.0 slot... Note that the SB link isn't really designed for that + all other relevant IO.
·Really is just a 680i with a higher price tag and a whole bunch of things thrown onto it. See the SNL iRaq skit.
·Poor Latency due to bridge chips and shoehorned SB PCIe lines FTW
It really makes me wonder why they didn't just put an HT link on the NB (a la Apple/IBM's G5 northbridge) and connect it to a "southbridge" that incorporated the PCIe 2.0 lanes and IO hardware. They would have had to engineer two chips instead of 4 (counting the 790) and one chip would have just been the 680i + HT link circuitry and possibly minus it's own PCIe circuitry. The "southbridge" could have ended up being their next AMD chipset as well.
Last edited:
- Joined
- May 19, 2006
- Location
- Mother Russia
Tho I've not used a 780i, the Maximus has proven to be a much better experience than the EVGA 680i A1 was. RAID, NIC, stability w/ oc, and more when you're going Intel + Intel. Given the Crysis patch has been put off til next year, I pitched the idea of SLI. We'll have new cards out soon anyway.
- Joined
- May 10, 2002
- Location
- Los Alamos, NM
OK, I think most of the common points have been made and I agree with them.
BUT a few technical things I don't understand about the march to X38 around here (and note that I am running a X38 because the 680i doesn't run the Q6600 well).
1) if I have a CPU with a lower multiplier then I understand I need a higher FSB for a reasonable overclock but with something like a Q6600 and its 9 cpu multiplier, a 400 FSB does fine. I don't need a 500 FSB overclock and in fact ain't sure what I'd do with it if I could do it. If I run two tests with CPU at same speed but a different FSBs the performance doesn't improve for the higher FSB (the CPU speed is the controlling factor).
2) Intel chipsets don't underclock memory. So if I'm running a 500 FSB then slowest I can run the memory is 1:1 and that is 1000. I gota have pretty good memory to overclock too the high FSB levels. But a Nvidia chipset unlinks so that I can "affectively" run memory and CPU asyn (and there is really minimal performance hit for doing so).
The thing I like about the Nvidia chipsets has been the ability to unlink CPU and memory performance and tweak both to the max. I've tested this capability heavily and don't see any performance penality in taking that route. Personally I don't care about SLI and most likely never run SLI.
If I've missed something please help me understand. I am painfully aware that I don't know everything. BUT please remember I'm not interested in what your uncle's cousin's brother's best friend says they can do. Show me the real test results.
Merry Christmas to ALL!!!
BUT a few technical things I don't understand about the march to X38 around here (and note that I am running a X38 because the 680i doesn't run the Q6600 well).
1) if I have a CPU with a lower multiplier then I understand I need a higher FSB for a reasonable overclock but with something like a Q6600 and its 9 cpu multiplier, a 400 FSB does fine. I don't need a 500 FSB overclock and in fact ain't sure what I'd do with it if I could do it. If I run two tests with CPU at same speed but a different FSBs the performance doesn't improve for the higher FSB (the CPU speed is the controlling factor).
2) Intel chipsets don't underclock memory. So if I'm running a 500 FSB then slowest I can run the memory is 1:1 and that is 1000. I gota have pretty good memory to overclock too the high FSB levels. But a Nvidia chipset unlinks so that I can "affectively" run memory and CPU asyn (and there is really minimal performance hit for doing so).
The thing I like about the Nvidia chipsets has been the ability to unlink CPU and memory performance and tweak both to the max. I've tested this capability heavily and don't see any performance penality in taking that route. Personally I don't care about SLI and most likely never run SLI.
If I've missed something please help me understand. I am painfully aware that I don't know everything. BUT please remember I'm not interested in what your uncle's cousin's brother's best friend says they can do. Show me the real test results.
Merry Christmas to ALL!!!
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2006
Is that true? I did not know that. New (bad) info for me. Time for another evaluation of choices
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2005
- Location
- 46° 21' N 72° 35' W
i don t have any problem to run my system over 1:1 memory devider with my ix38 quad gt ... take a look !!!
500 fsb at 1:1 i think the cpu will be the hard thing to push to 500 fsb not the memory !!!
500 fsb at 1:1 i think the cpu will be the hard thing to push to 500 fsb not the memory !!!
- Joined
- May 10, 2002
- Location
- Los Alamos, NM
I just said that you had to have good memory. For those folks with 800 (PC2-6400) or less, it might be a problem. Good news is that memory is reasonably priced right now so getting memory to do 1000 PC2-8000 isn't too bad $-wise.
And why is the CPU hard to push above 500? Just drop the multiplier. I would think it is primarily a matter of the motherboard being able to do 500. Please explain, I'm always willing to learn.
By the way, 3916 very nice.
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2005
- Location
- 46° 21' N 72° 35' W
every time i try to drop teh multiplier ... my systeme don t wanna boot ... so i 'll try 500x7 ... no mather what i'm doing with voltage or what ... but no boot ... so tell me how i<and i will give it a try ...
- Joined
- May 10, 2002
- Location
- Los Alamos, NM
Do you have control of the memory strap on your board? Just got an Abit IP35 Pro but I'm not familiar enough with the bios to know if that's an option.
My P5E is picky about which strap I use when I'm pushing it. It won't even boot at 400 if I'm not up on a higher strap.
EDIT: you might have to up the NB voltage too since 500 will work it harder.
My P5E is picky about which strap I use when I'm pushing it. It won't even boot at 400 if I'm not up on a higher strap.
EDIT: you might have to up the NB voltage too since 500 will work it harder.
- Joined
- Jun 6, 2002
he might have also hit the cpu's fsb wall as well as it can vary widly with G0 steps. the lowest i saw was 480 or 490. For Deep what i mean by fsb wall is that no matter what multi you choose to try for a higher fsb. no matter what voltages you give it the system will not boot past that fsb...
- Joined
- May 10, 2002
- Location
- Los Alamos, NM
Understand Evilsizer but how do you tell if it is CPU or motherboard hitting the wall short of playing musical CPUs? And he appears to be running a dual, not quad, but assume it might happen there too?
- Joined
- Jun 6, 2002
well if the motherboard was having issues then it would still boot but report the fastest fsb it will go. IE if he selects 500mhz in the bios and then restarts, shows 480mhz instead on bootup. as is what happened with my Abit AB9-pro(p965). i could put in 500mhz in the bios or even uguru and the fastest the fsb would go up to was 380mhz.
though in the case of the IX38 the first bios was buggy. when ocing so its safe to say that even with further bios updates, im still going to say he hit the cpu's fsb wall.
- Joined
- Jun 6, 2002
it is they also had to add another chip to add the PCIE 2.0,that equals more heat in a already hot box if your running sli.
at the rate of GPU advances SLI and CF isnt much of a chioce. IMO its for people that can spend the money. now you could do 2 cheap cards but in a way that would just equal the price of that mid range or high end card in some cases. its better to have one faster one then to worry about gettting another to play nice in a dual gpu setup. i ran sli for a bit with some 7900GT KO, i would say at the res i played the 8800GTS 640mb would play the same for me. sorry no FPS numbers since it was NFSMW and it was by feel, in both cases the game was really smooth,like butta!
- Joined
- Nov 16, 2007
- Location
- Stockholm, Sweden
And why is the CPU hard to push above 500? Just drop the multiplier. I would think it is primarily a matter of the motherboard being able to do 500. Please explain, I'm always willing to learn.
By the way, 3916 very nice.
A few months ago i got the chance to test my friends e4400, just to see if that was the problem with my gigabyte p35-ds4.
And this is the results:
With the e2140 i couldn't boot past 420Mhz fsb, whatever voltages i had.
With the e4400 i could easily post @ 440Mhz fsb.
So i'd say it's the CPU that's the limiter!
EDIT: I = A
Last edited:
- Joined
- Jun 9, 2002
OK, I think most of the common points have been made and I agree with them.
BUT a few technical things I don't understand about the march to X38 around here (and note that I am running a X38 because the 680i doesn't run the Q6600 well).
1) if I have a CPU with a lower multiplier then I understand I need a higher FSB for a reasonable overclock but with something like a Q6600 and its 9 cpu multiplier, a 400 FSB does fine. I don't need a 500 FSB overclock and in fact ain't sure what I'd do with it if I could do it. If I run two tests with CPU at same speed but a different FSBs the performance doesn't improve for the higher FSB (the CPU speed is the controlling factor).
2) Intel chipsets don't underclock memory. So if I'm running a 500 FSB then slowest I can run the memory is 1:1 and that is 1000. I gota have pretty good memory to overclock too the high FSB levels. But a Nvidia chipset unlinks so that I can "affectively" run memory and CPU asyn (and there is really minimal performance hit for doing so).
The thing I like about the Nvidia chipsets has been the ability to unlink CPU and memory performance and tweak both to the max. I've tested this capability heavily and don't see any performance penality in taking that route. Personally I don't care about SLI and most likely never run SLI.
If I've missed something please help me understand. I am painfully aware that I don't know everything. BUT please remember I'm not interested in what your uncle's cousin's brother's best friend says they can do. Show me the real test results.
Merry Christmas to ALL!!!
Well the way the nForce platform handles memory speeds looks great on paper, but the reality is you end up with lots & lots of "holes" in the usefull FSB settings and it can be frustrating just trying to find a range of frequencies that actually work as advertised. So even though it claims it's unlinked and it appears you can select any FSB/memory speed you like the reality is (in my experience) very different. I've been on nForce chipset based mobos for years, but they STILL aren't very good with Intel CPUs unfortunately. I recently switched from the P5N32-E SLI PLUS to the P35 based Abit IP35 Pro and it's been alot better in almost every way. Stability, features, upgrade options...etc and I haven't even tried a C2Q in it yet.
- Joined
- Aug 24, 2007
I gotta call shenanigans here. I have a G33 based board, and it offers a 1.6 memory multiplier. I can run the FSB at 500, and the memory at 1.6x=800mhz.
- Joined
- May 10, 2002
- Location
- Los Alamos, NM
I'm always willing to be corrected but gota say this is first divider I've heard of (there could be more). Do other Gigabyte boards underclock?
Last edited:
