AHCI hard drive won't go away when power is switched off in Windows XP

Well at this point, SATA to eSATA I am assuming will give me a situation of powering the thing on/off at will and it appearing/disappearing from My Computer just as it if it were an external drive so really any other solution, especially the one that requires 6 seconds is worse than that, right?


So what do you do, disable in Device Manager first and do that *every time*?

well yes i disable a lot of stuff in there regulary not just drives.
but i use DEVCON.exe in a batch, attach a Icon to the batch, and click on the icon.
then make up a batch that swiches it off if it is on and on if it is off.

I shall explain.
after having found the devcon program, and not installing it its a single executable , just drop in the sytem path somewhere like windows system32.
(it is different one for 32bit or 64bit systems)

it starts out in the CMD console thing. command prompt , dos prompt , Psudo dos console.

I learn how to use Devcon by typing
DEVCON HELP <-- which is the help for it

look at all the fun things you can do
there is a FIND, and a STATUS and DISABLE and ENABLE
i just happen to know what those mean

So first i look at the List with the * wildcard (everything or nothing)
DEVCON FIND * <--- the ALL wildcard
and there is every device in the whole computer OMG!

So time to find a Label for the device, some way that devcon will know what i am talking about.
DEVCON FIND S* <--- wild cards, gonna need them because of the crasy names
and there is everything that starts with S

Hey isnt this just like talking to the computer
DEVCON STATUS *Lightning*
and there is one of my hard drive arrays.

DEVCON DISABLE *HID* <---- this does the same thing as when you disable in the device manager
poof all the mouses and keyboards are gone .
OOPs ok lets not do that again.

DEVCON FIND C627s hard drive <------ this is me being funny
Ahh stupid computer

DEVCON FIND *WD* <---- this tries to find any device in the list that has WD in it
ok there is more than one eeek lets not disable all my hard drives, that would be bad.

DEVCON FIND *WD15EADS* <---- this restricted the above find , tuning out other things it finds via the wildcards
cool the one 1.5t , and nothing else

DEVCON DISABLE *WD15EADS* <---- this disables the device the same way it does in device manager
ahh crud, so much for that, Says Reboot required

DEVCON STATUS *WD15EADS* <---- find out if its disabled and done
Device is disabled


weird it doesnt do that when i did it manually in the device manager.

ok it is working, and in a batch i dont see that it asks for reboot, it isnt a requester pop.
If you want to give it a try, its rather fun, then i can show you how to get status, and batch it.


now say i have 3 WD15EADS, but i only want to disable One
I just provide Devcon with enough information, from the Wildcard , to insure that only One will ever be in that wildcard
DEVCON STATUS *WD15EADS-0P8B0* <----this has added more of the ID info from that Device, further identifying it.
you will see the whole names of any device after you find or status any of them
you know you have the ID in correctally if you can do a FIND or STATUS on them and they show up.

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Funny stuff. I always appreciate when people post detailed instructions.

I spent some time switching to AHCI without reinstalling Windows XP, as detailed here:
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=648104

and hooking up an external power switch just to be able to do all this just by pressing a button and doing nothing else.

If a 99 cent cable is all that stands b/w me finally doing it, then it's hard for me not to go that route



I understand that this is not possible with SATA to SATA unless you do the extra work you outlined. I think some of us were not aware of that but now we know.

I had the same problem with PATA as long as the data cable was still connected.
internal drives i tried to power off, really bad idea, then i tried to disconnect parts of the data wire with switch and still didnt get it.

i dont know if being "external" without some sort of controller will fix that, someone here certannly should. many externals have port multiplyers controllers and such that power off too.
then to do it "safely" you still have to make sure nothing is going on via the drive, and flush the cache.
safe removal via the system is on any device that is tagged for being "removable".

most of us here would know if a device was being written to, and not turn off the power, then the system loves to do all sorts of things , that can access the drives.
if stuff like indexing, system restore, thumbnails, virus checking, is off then there is less things that might be written to the hard drive.
.

Well, my reasoning was that eSATA connector should behave like the USB connector right next to it on the outside of the case.

I do have a USB drive and can power it on/off. Now of course, you should safely remove it either in task bar or using

bing said:

How bout HotSwap program ? -> http://mt-naka.com/hotswap/index_enu.htm

Click to expand...

But the point is, and correct me if I am wrong, the only way you can safely remove then power off a SATA bare drive in WinXP without doing anything else is to use a eSATA to SATA cable.

it is not USB, USB has always been "transient" expected to be removable.
and hot swap is removing the data cable itself. That is where i think the big diff is.
But i donno and want to, so i did some searches and quickly scanned other users problems.

people who have those esata plug in cartriges, and plug in E-containers are doing ok
(you know they will be the ones saying whats the problem ;-)
people who are feeding an internal externally powered are not , untill they also pull the data cable.

then they still have same problems, it isnt concidered removable, so they dont get the safe remove easily , they dont get "eject" again because it is not tagged as removable.
without like you said some trick to get it.
in linux they run an UNMOUNT.

then Most external Sata are not the same controller, which complicates things more. so mabey some of them dont have the ACHI driver and switch correct on THAT controller the other controller.

then one warning from some guy , that we could fry the mutherboard, but just recognising that an Esata is supposed to be a powered connection should put that in mind.

and lest we leave out a Forced Spin-Down would power save, and save the motor, as long as it wasnt spun up and down like a yo yo. there are spin-down utilities that can work at the push of a button, and the power would just be far less, and wouldnt have to be turned off.
that works untill you try and run a refresh of "myComputer" or anywhere where you or the system pushes an access to that drive for mundane things, that we didnt even need access to it for.
.

What chipset are we talking about? Are you using the INTEL SATA ports on your MoBo - or possibly using the 3rd party SATA controller?

I can confirm that Hotswap works perfectly on the ICH10R via standard SATA connections. I use a 5.25" SATA Hot-Swap drive bay connected to the ICH10R with Intel's RST 9.6 software - I get a system tray "pop-up" when I insert a drive, and another pop-up when I remove the drive.

I don't get the "Safely remove hardware" option like with a USB drive - and I don't think you need it for the Intel Hot Swap to work correctly. Just don't yank the drive if writes are in progress - and wait about 10-15 seconds after the copy is finished before you yank the drive. I haven't has any issues of corrupt data following those simple guidelines...

So - I'd make sure you are plugging into the Intel ICH ports (check your MoBo's manual to be certain) - or if you don't have a free ICH port - make sure the 3rd party SATA controller is set to "AHCI" in your BIOS and that you have the correct drivers installed.

Should work like a charm...

and thats just the thing randyman, the cart pulls the whole drive, the power and the data cable.
and manually putting a drive in and out internally same thing we pull both items.

when you have an drive that you want to Power off easily and simply and leave the cable attached, ya wanna just power the thing down, without the system having a fit about it.
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Ah - Yes - that will pose a problem. I've even had systems hang at boot due to un-powered drives being connected. That is not how Hot Swap was designed to work

In this case - USB3 will be your ticket IMNSHO

The starting reason for all of this is 2TB drives being notoriously unreliable/quicker to die, and I thought I could prolong their life by switching them on, only in rare times when I want to watch a movie (I transferred them from DVDs because the picture is better PC to Plasma then Regular DVD to Plasma.)



Now, Randyman..., are you talking Windows XP? My system is ICH10R with 9.6 as you suggested.


Psycogeec, yes I have the cable permanently connected. This is about powering the SATA internal drive on and off with external power connected to an extension cord with a switch. So you're saying the nature of this problem is that the data cable is always connected? Even with the "safely hotswap" in the task bar, are you saying eSATA to SATA will not allow me to do what I want because the (e)SATA cable will be permanently connected?



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all information leads to that conclusion, the data line must be pulled/disconnected, or the device unmounted/removed in software first.
e-sata boxes with single drives in them, must electrically disconnect ? but most of them have controllers , so they have USB connect too

i dont know anything for a fact, just havent found proof that that it will work other ways, including W7
.

It's been so long since I used XP that I can't recall - but with the MoBo configured correctly, with the HD plugged into the Intel ICH Ports, and with the RST 9.6 installed - Hot Swap should work fine under XP.

As mentioned - you're not "technically" "Hot swapping" the drive as the SATA Data cable is not being disconnected ("Swapped"). I don't think an eSATA connector would handle this any differently.

I have an external SATA > SATA enclosure with an Oxford bridge chip that I could test real quick.

OK - With an external SATA enclosure - I can kill power to the drive enclosure and leave the SATA cable connected, and the drive still vanishes from My Computer and appears to remove itself correctly. Power it back on - and pops right back up. I get the "Drive on port 5 connected/removed" pop-up from the RST software in each instance.

Don't know if that helps or not - but there you go!

Yeah, I'm gonna have to spring for an eSATA to SATA cable and post back in a week or two.

Update - I just tested this with a drive connected directly to the ICH with a plain old SATA cable. I pulled the drive's power (yanked the SATA power plug) and left the SATA connected - the drive vanished in My Computer. Re-applied power and the drive came right back - I again received pop-up messages form the RST software in each instance.

So - you are SURE you are using the Intel ICH Ports and not the 3rd party SATA ports?

Also - how exactly are you killing power to the drive?

This should work

RST software , now that makes sence. the ever alert Intel storage watcher.

Psycogeec said:

RST software , now that makes sence. the ever alert Intel storage watcher.

Click to expand...

That's their most current - it simply replaced the older "Matrix Storage Manager" - it's where you build Matrix RAID arrays and such - it also updates you to the most current drivers (RE: Post #6 in this thread )

There isn't a reason not to run it if you have a compatible ICH running in AHCI or RAID mode (you'll actually see a performance hit until you install it under those circumstances )

I suppose XP could be part of the OP's problem - but the Intel RST and the Intel ICH will be handling the Hot Swap - not the OS itself...

I edited the original post to say this is about Windows XP. [Even though it's in the thread title man. ] I have a dual boot and I don't recall having these problems in Windows 7.

Can you test the system in question with W7? As everything I know suggests that XP should have no issues hot-swapping with the correct drivers, ICH running in AHCI/RAID mode, drive in question connected to the Intel ICH ports, and the RST Software installed.

If you want - I can install XP on one of my known-good W7 "hot swap" systems and give it a shot - but no promises on when that will happen

not sure if this was suggested, skimmed the thread. is it possible to change the option in device manager for that hard drive to "optimize for quick removal" from "optimize for performance" ?

Randyman... I did give it a shot in Windows 7, and it did work but I did notice some problems... at the time I was overwhelmed with other things and concluded that the best overall option for me was to simply buy an eSATA to SATA cable.


medo145, where in Windows XP's device manager is that option? Which TAB of Hard Drive's properties, I don't see it.