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Metal Welder
- Thread starter Borisw37
- Start date
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2001
you might be able to. but it is going to be tough. most welders use 18-30 volts dc and 90+ amps. you are going to have to use a large transformer to step the voltage down. wiring up power supplies will not work since when you weld you are creating a short. you are also going to need some way to controll the amperage so that you can get a good strong weld without blowing through the metal that you are welding. if you are going to weld sheet metal, you might as well get a small wire-feed welder. most of them use standard houshold current (120v 15a). a good wire-feed welder will probably set you back $300-$400. kinda pricy if you ask me. also with thinner metal, you might have to go to a mig setup. most of the better wire-feed welders already have mig capabilities, you just need to get a tank of gas. with mig welding, there is an inert gas (usualy a mix of c02 and argon) that blows the oxygen away from the weld allowing you to weld thinner metal. kinda more info than you asked for, but i hope it helps.
OP
- Joined
- Aug 19, 2003
- Thread Starter
- #3
Thanks for you input.
another question. Is aluminum weldable? or is it only steel that can be welded?
and what about something like this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2560248590&category=34099
another question. Is aluminum weldable? or is it only steel that can be welded?
and what about something like this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2560248590&category=34099
Yes, you can weld aluminum. I've used a mig (wire feed) welder for it with aluminum wire. I understand that there's also a solder system for joining aluminum. You could try Googling for that.
Welding it is a serious pain though. The two pieces have to be very clean, and I mean clean. It only takes a few minutes for the oxide layer to start building up on it, which doesn't conduct an arc very well.
The other pain is that it needs to be preheated to start welding and flowing nicely, so you have a torch in one hand, and welder in your second hand, and a wire brush in your third hand.
Welding it is a serious pain though. The two pieces have to be very clean, and I mean clean. It only takes a few minutes for the oxide layer to start building up on it, which doesn't conduct an arc very well.
The other pain is that it needs to be preheated to start welding and flowing nicely, so you have a torch in one hand, and welder in your second hand, and a wire brush in your third hand.
Because of the heat conductivity of the aluminum, you can hold the flame anywhere in the vicinity. Holding it on the intended weld seam would be a bit counter-productive. Once the arc is started, that provides plenty of heat so you can put the torch down. You need the torch in the first place because the heat would move away from the arc so fast, you couldn't get a good penetrating weld seam, until the metal was pretty saturated with heat.
It's kind of neat when it gets going, it looks like soldering with an arc.
Still a pain in the arse though, I'd look into the aluminum soldering stuff. The reason we were welding was for the strength. We were repairing a bracket on a hydraulic cylinder that kept breaking bolts and dowels (3/4" stock). A case wouldn't need that kind of strength.
But you asked if it could be welded, yes. Is it practical for building a case? not really. You could buy a dozen LianLi's for the price of just the supplies, let alone the welder.
It's kind of neat when it gets going, it looks like soldering with an arc.
Still a pain in the arse though, I'd look into the aluminum soldering stuff. The reason we were welding was for the strength. We were repairing a bracket on a hydraulic cylinder that kept breaking bolts and dowels (3/4" stock). A case wouldn't need that kind of strength.
But you asked if it could be welded, yes. Is it practical for building a case? not really. You could buy a dozen LianLi's for the price of just the supplies, let alone the welder.
- Joined
- Jul 16, 2001
- Location
- Scotland - And don't you forget it!
For small scale stuff, you're better off brazing. Welding uses dangerously high currents, and would be more expensive to inaturise. Although, a small MIG welder is only £100 or so, cheaper second hand, if you really want to weld.......
- Joined
- Jun 9, 2001
- Location
- Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Borisw37 said:
It's almost (but, not quite) simmilar to soldering. usually done with brass rods. You could of course weld using a cheap oxy and MPS gas or propane set up. But, learing to do it without warping the metal takes a lot of patience, lots of practice, and lots of oxygen.
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2002
- Location
- Huffing Water Wetter
MIG = Metal - Inert - Gas. You can use a MIG for welding aluminum, but it's looks like hairy butt, and isn't the strongest weld. Since MIG's use a consumable wire that's made from steel, you wind up making a Steel-Aluminium alloy; not pretty. MIG's are best left to ferrous metals (steels & iron alloys).
What you want to use on Aluminium is a TIG, Tungsten - Inert - Gas. These use a non-consumable tungsten electrode and an inert gas, usually Argon (noble gas). Since the TIG isn't donating any material to the weld, you get a nice pretty bead that's really strong. TIG's are used for non-ferrous metals like stainless steel and Aluminium.
Contrary to popular belief, with a little practice and a good welder, you can weld really thin stuff. In high school I would reguallarly weld 20 guage sheet metal. Welding is a heck of a lot easier than brazing.
What you want to use on Aluminium is a TIG, Tungsten - Inert - Gas. These use a non-consumable tungsten electrode and an inert gas, usually Argon (noble gas). Since the TIG isn't donating any material to the weld, you get a nice pretty bead that's really strong. TIG's are used for non-ferrous metals like stainless steel and Aluminium.
Contrary to popular belief, with a little practice and a good welder, you can weld really thin stuff. In high school I would reguallarly weld 20 guage sheet metal. Welding is a heck of a lot easier than brazing.
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2002
- Location
- Huffing Water Wetter
Diggrr said:
You can... I wouldn't. It looks really bad and is a really crappy weld to boot. Found out about it on accident, actualy boredom. Just wanted to see what would happen.
UberBlue said:
According to my 2 year college welding class and any welding ive ever done.
Mig is fine for alluminum, aslong as you use the pure argon gas and alluminum wire. one thing to rember when mig welding alluminum is due to its nice thermal conductivity the max thickness of your material is halved. so if your mig can do 1/4 mild steel you can only do 1/8 alluminum without preheating it.
second to TIG weld alluminum you need an AC/DC TIG welder, because a cheaper DC only TIG welder cant do alluminum.
the cheapest miller ac/dc TIG is the Econotig ac/dc starting at $1,522.00
third MIG and TIG use consumable filler material, and with tig you need both hands to weld. one to hold the consumable rod and one to hold the tig gun. while mig only needs one hand to hold the gun.
fourth with a TIG welder you need to be concerned with Tungsten contamination of the weld if your welder uses Lift-Arc insted of HF arc starting method.
oh MIG is also fine for stainless as long as your using the correct gas and wire.
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2003
1 point left to make not every welder has the capabilities to weld aluminium it must be equipped with a high frequency device if you are doing seams(and want them to look nice) if you are just tacking then mig or tig will do but the looks wouldnt be as nice and welding seams with a non high frequency welder will produce a very brittle weld. Here is a product that might make things easier.
http://www.techno-weld.co.uk/home.html
http://www.techno-weld.co.uk/home.html
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2002
- Location
- Huffing Water Wetter
You guys win. I haven't touched a welder since high school six years ago. You know how high school metal shops are...
UberBlue said:
well my metal shop teacher cut his thumb off the first day when he showed us how not to use a band saw...... but the sub for the year was ok. but he didnt know how to weld and well we skipped that part....................
but it was fun.
(teacher got the thumb reattached and it worked ok after that)
- Joined
- Oct 11, 2002
ehhh i need to learn how to weld and work with metal.....ive been trying to find classes, but I dunno what to look under. Doesn't help that I'm at an engineering college....we have the facilities (do we ever), but I think they're for people who know how to use them....
Mebbe i'll check with my community college over the summer, see if they offer something....i was going to take metallurgy last semester there, but when I went to register for it they had appearantly canceled it.
Mebbe i'll check with my community college over the summer, see if they offer something....i was going to take metallurgy last semester there, but when I went to register for it they had appearantly canceled it.
Black Ops, the thinner the material, the less likely you are to need a filler rod with TIG. I did fusion welding all the time (steel).
When you TIG a thick piece, you need to cut a V notch into the seem and use filler rod, building layers upon layers because a TIG doesn't penetrate much (nor do many hand held welders). You'd also need filler rod if your seems weren't that tight to begin with.
Fusion welding is pretty common in production because cost effectiveness, and very little cleanup needed for visible parts.
and deeman, I wish I could afford the Lincoln we used at work. It came about chest high (not including the argon tanks) and could MIG, TIG, and Arc, simply a matter of changing electrode sets and punching through a few pre-programmed menus.
Yes, it would do high frequency and square wave. I cannot remember what it cost, but at the time it was more than my new truck...
Pretty much what God would choose to weld with if he so chose.
Have a good one ya'll
When you TIG a thick piece, you need to cut a V notch into the seem and use filler rod, building layers upon layers because a TIG doesn't penetrate much (nor do many hand held welders). You'd also need filler rod if your seems weren't that tight to begin with.
Fusion welding is pretty common in production because cost effectiveness, and very little cleanup needed for visible parts.
and deeman, I wish I could afford the Lincoln we used at work. It came about chest high (not including the argon tanks) and could MIG, TIG, and Arc, simply a matter of changing electrode sets and punching through a few pre-programmed menus.
Yes, it would do high frequency and square wave. I cannot remember what it cost, but at the time it was more than my new truck...
Pretty much what God would choose to weld with if he so chose.
Have a good one ya'll
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