3000+ Venice Overclocking Help Please

[Zhut]

Hello masters of the clock! I am new to overclocking and was looking for some help. I have been doing some research on overclocking my 3000 Venice cpu. I have hit a wall, I think at 2.35ghz and was wondering if I am missing anything that I could do to improve this or if I should just call it a day and keep with this speed. Here is what I have to work with:

Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-K8NF-9 939 NVIDIA nForce4 4X ATX AMD
800 mhz hypertransport!! is this what is stopping me from attaining higher clocks?

CPU: AMD Athlon 64 3000+ Venice 1.8GHz 512KB L2 Cache Socket 939 0step
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128268

RAM: OCZ Platinum 2GB (2 x 1GB) 184-Pin DDR SDRAM DDR 400 (PC 3200) 2-3-2-5
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227210
I run all 4 dimms filled so 4 gigs, I run 2 or 3 gaming sessions sometimes 2 gigs does not cut it.

I use:
3xHTT
HT Link –(783) Is my max really only 800mhz?
9xcpu multiplier
vcore 1.5v Have toyed with this up to 1.7v so far
fsb/HT 261
2T (I can actually run 1T with 4 dimms filled at stock settings not overclocked.
Cas +.5 to 2.5 (have not messed with the other latencies yet)
+.1 to vdimm (this ram can be volt boosted well I read)

SuperPi at stock settings: 56 seconds 1M
SuperPi at 2.35: 39 seconds 1M
Running in complete sync seems to not be the best.

My temps stay cool, cooler with my above overclocked settings as opposed to settings my motherboard creates (aggressive auto settings) high 40’s C for auto-aggressive (1.9mhz) and only mid to high 30’C for my current max clock of 2.35 mhz. I use motherboard monitor, cpu-z, clockgen, and super pi so far. I still have yet to download prime 95. I have only run this with clockgen for a day or two, I have yet to hard set this in the bios. (I have gotten to be good at clearing the cmos and I have only had to remove the battery once)

Any ideas I can try to get more out of this chip? Thank you in advance I have much respect for the overclocking community. From what I can see my memory is sitting at 170ish/200 with my current above settings. I think the ram should run closer to 200. The board does not seem to like 8x multipliers or 2xHTT. Maybe I am doing something wrong. Please help.

 

[DragoXT]

First off, we need to know what kinda RAM you have before we can really do much to help you. When you overclock, you increase the speed of the ram causing the HT link to increase as well. The socket 939 boards HT speed should be 2000mhz so you could effectivly run the HT in your bios at 1000mhz to get the 2ghz HTT. It is good to drop the HTT down to 4x and 3x when you are overclocking to make sure you dont cause instability by going over the max htt.

The first thing you should do is find out the correct timings for your ram and manually set them in your bios. Once that is done, put your ram on a divider and keep it at or below the rated speed with the divider and keep pushing that cpu up and givng it and the chipset voltage as needed to try and get the clock speed up. Once you have found as far as you can go with the chip this way, then you drop the multi on the chip down to like 7x and then go about over clocking your ram and finding out what timings it runs at and at what speeds it can do with those timings. Once you have this info you should then be able to tweak your overclock to keep your latencies lowish for the RAM, and your cpu freq high.

Those venice cores could usually hit 2.7ghz or better, so hopefully yours can get on up there. A word to the wise, unless you have some phenominal RAM that is rated for a cas latance of .5, if that was ever made, i know 1cas was, the lowest mainstream ram will get is cas of 2. Idealiy when you overclock your RAM you leave it at stock latanceis and up it from there till you can no longer load windows or boot, back it down, load windows and then run a stability testing program. If all is well, be sure to write it down. My ram will do 220mhz @ 2-2-2-5 stock volts, but to up the ram speed higher i have to go to 2.5-3-3-7 to get up to 250mhz. Any higher and i have to up the timings to 3-4-4-8. You will need to spend the time finding out what speeds your RAM will run at and with what timings at stock volts. With this info and knowing how high your cpu clocks on a RAM divider gives you an idea of how fast it could potentially go. Usually tweaking the ram timings and clock speed you usually get a tad higher than what you seem to find as your max cpu clock when using the RAM divider only.

Overclocking is something that takes patience to really acomplish and usually several cmos resets. So have fun and make sure you have all your data backed up incase your overclock fubars your windows install.

 

[Zhut]

Thank you DragoXT. Here is my Ram

RAM: OCZ Platinum 2GB (2 x 1GB) 184-Pin DDR SDRAM DDR 400 (PC 3200) 2-3-2-5
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820227210
I run 4x1GB in my board. I have read that running 2 dimms improves clocks but I am hoping I am ok with my 4 filled slots.

Stock is 2-3-2-5 according to OCZ (board wants to run cas at 2.5 when "load optimized defaults" is selected in the Bios.

I have not been able to get my ram to show in cpu-z close to 200mhz with my above settings and it is rated stock for 200mhz (ddr400 if I am correct) At my overclock my ram is running only running at 170-172mhz so it would seem to me(being a beginner) that my ram has more to offer and is not my blocking point? These are with 2.5-3-2-5 timings. (I only bumped up the Cas to 2.5 since the PC was not liking 2 Cas at even low 2.0 ghz. Should I be raising each of my stock latency values by 1 and try raising the bus from there? ie. Change to 3-4-3-6 while keeping my other settings the same? When Latencies are changed must each of the 4 core latencies be changed by the same amount? I will read and read again your post many times. I feel I am “getting there” but have not reached the point where this new and interesting world makes complete sense to me. Which is fine, I love to learn and read and research. I certainly appreciate your help with this!!

I was under the impression that since my ram was my newest addition to my pc purchased a few weeks ago that it would not be my limiting factor. I really thought it was my cheap old board. The beginner in me is probably blinding me. Thanks again.

 

[DragoXT]

Pictures of your bios screens always help. I think though that if you read the following link it can give you some more insight into the bios overclocking options and such. It isnt for your board, but mine that i run and it has literally every setting you can imagine and then some. Names can change but things pretty much do the same deal. Your bios should have similar and most likely less options, but in general you dont need every option to overclock.

http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=329627

Really read up on running on a memory divider and the whole command rate deal. Some boards will not let you run a command rate of 1T with all slots filled, forcing you to run 2T. Some boards have an option to change this, some do it automatically. The other thing you want to make sure of is your voltage on your chipset and RAM are in order. If you hit a wall usually bumping the chipset voltage up helps, if you know your RAM is fine at what voltage and timings and speed it is running at.

 

[Zhut]

Thank you for that link DragoXT! Amazingly enough last night after work I set the Bios Ram timings to stock 2-3-2-5 and I was able to reach the exact same point again (2.343ghz) Yet, this time with stock timings and not 2.5 latency. I am not sure how or why, however, but I felt this to be a good sign! SuperPi would give me "not exact round/sq" messages at 1M test when I would run it with my 2.350ghz or higher settings. Again, seeming to cap me out at stable being 2.343 with those specific settings, at least.

I noticed my board in Bios only allows for dividers of 100, 133, 166, and 200. I am wondering if this is hindering my efforts? It feels like I should have some values in between those that may be preventing me from higher goals. I have not yet had the time to follow your recommendation but will certainly try what you recommended. (I am seeing the time consuming aspects you spoke of).

Is my HT Link ok up to 1000? (the box located under bus speed on cpu-z labeled) (I thought my board would limit me to 800 but I may be confusing that with something else, it seemed to go into the 900's with no problem.)

I have smart fan option in Bios but no option for "cool and quiet mode" is it ok to leave smart fan enabled?

I also have kept spread spectrum disabled.
I feel I am missing something, somewhere. Very interesting, like detective work. Are there any other "duh noob" things I may be missing that should be enabled/disabled/forgotten/found? Thank you again DragoXT!!

 

[Zhut]

For some reason I am not able to get my bus speed stable beyond 256. I have slowly added vcore voltage and crept the bus speed up but I cannot breach 250-260 bus speed raising vcore from 1.4-->1.5-->1.55--1.65(and pass 1M Superpi). Have I reached the limit for my bus speed? I know my ram is not holding me back since I have the divider set low and the ram is sitting at 123.8 mhz only at this time. (DDR400 Ram)

Currently a couple hourse into Prime95 cpu Temp 45--No errors
1.424v stock v
2309.2 core speed
256.6 Bus Speed
9x multiplier
HT Link 769.7 (3x)
CPU/18
2-3-2-5 stock timings
2T (Running 4x1gig sticks of ocz)

Am I missing some tweaks that will push me comfortably beyond 2.3mhz?
Thank you in advance! I am new to this and my scibbled papers and notes are all over the place, print outs everywhere, I think I am going to start writing on my walls soon.

 

[DragoXT]

Clock speed spectrum you do not need to touch, that is a very old way to deal with EMI interference and should never be used on todays hardware or anything in the last 5 years.

Only the socket 754 motherboards had the HTT link maxed at 800, all the socket 939 boards can do 1000 HTT or more if you overclock, though you try to keep it under that to keep it stable.

The RAM dividers you see are very common, and there arent usually more in between unless you have a board like DFI that gives you every option under the sun and then some.

Ok so you raised your vcore and it still doesnt want to pass that wall. You seem to have a FSB wall at 256mhz, so have you tried upping the chipset voltage, and the RAM voltage?

If that doesnt work, see what you can do by taking out 2 sticks of RAM and see if that alleviates the fsb wall that you are seeing now. Some boards have issues iwth overclocking and all the DIMM slots full. Also just for grins, loosen your RAM timings, even though they are on a divider, see if that helps.

Another stress testing tool that you can use is prime95, if it can run for 12 hours with no errors, then your system is usually stable. For quick goes, 1mb superpi should always be stable. If it can pass 32m pi with no errors, then it is usually stable, then when you have time run prime95 and see if you need to add some more vcore or drop that oc a bit.

500mhz is a nice oc, though those Venice chips usually go further than that like up to 2.7, so try to see if you can get that sucker up there. Keep us posted on your progress.

 

[Zhut]

I am now 5 hours into Prime95 at 2302.26 Mhz. No errors or test fails, good sign. I had to back off the bus a bit from 2350 or I was getting errors. Seems to be working great at the following current settings:

CPU-Z
Core Speed 2302.26Mhz
Multiplier x9
Bus Speed 255.8
HT Link 767.5

Dram Frequency 164.4 (no where near 200, upsetting lots of room here)
FSBram CPU/14
2-3-2-5
2T (4x1gig sticks)
1.424 vcore (lots of room here also it seems)
45C max while running Prime 95

I have done some raises with the ram timings and it really has not helped at all. I am thinking because I am far from the top end of my Ram still.

I have also taken vcore to 1.7 and +.2 on the vdimm and that has not helped me break the 260 bus barrier I am hitting. I have yet to adjust the chipset voltage, however. Is that setting important to possibly reaching the next level?

I recall from bios (sorry Prime still running, will let run overnight)
Vcore volt 1.4 stock--->1.75 I think
Vdimm volt +.1 or +.2
HT Link volt +.1 or +.2 ? Not sure on that one
There may be a chipset volt mode I have overlooked, perhaps it is a different name?

Oh, one final question for this post. I have experienced some trouble booting up with fbs set in bios. For exampled I have no problem "hard changing" the bios FBS to 220-225 range but beyond that I cannot get into windows. I then have been using Clockgen to boost only the FSB into the 250-260 range. Is this common? I feel that if Clockgen runs Prime stable I should be able to hard boot up at the same higher (250ish) FSB in Bios, is that correct?

If Prime is stable for 24 hours at my current settings should I set Clockgen to keep those settings next start up? I am weary about that selection from what I have read. I may have to do it this way since the Bios will not cooperate, seemingly.

DragoXT I bet you are correct that if I pulled 2 sticks out, dropped into T1 mode I could hammer out some bigger numbers, potentially. I need the 4 gigs though. I am hoping this elusive to me chipset voltage adjustment may help. This is addictive!

Thanks again for your help!!! I feel I am learning a great deal more than I knew 2 weeks ago.

 

[DragoXT]

With the venice chips bro, i wouldnt run them with 1.7+ volts for extended periods of time except for a suicide run at an oc. If your temps are fine, you should be ok, but those 90nm chips usually dont go above 1.6v without water due to the heat. Sounds like you have found a good stable overclock at 2300mhz. Really, up that chipset voltage, it helps alot, as long as you got decent cooling on the chip and some decent airflow in your case you should be fine to bump it up a few notches in voltage. If that doesnt do anything to that fsb wall, back the chipset voltage to stock, then go and take out 2 dimms and leave your ram timings and command rate alone. See if you can get past 260 from there. If so, go on and see what that chip can do, then up the volts on the vcore and chipset and RAM and burn it in for a few days. Sometimes this will allow you to get higher with lower voltages or get through a barrier. My chip has a barrier at 2.64ghz that i was able to get over for a while by running my chip at 1.8 vcore and chipset at 1.7 and RAM at 3.0. My chip is 130nm and stock volts is 1.5 so 1.8 is not unheard of, and that got me to 2.7ghz. I havent really tried to OC much since then cause i have needed my compy stable so i dropped everything back to stock, that and it is hot in Texas during the summer.

Usually when you can get a software overclock you should be able to do the same in Bios. If you cant then clear your cmos a few times then try again.

 

[eddyg519]

i had my old one up to 2.65 without doing much but changing the HT

 

[Zhut]

Excellent DragoXT. I will certainly try your recommendations this weekend, if not before. I do not think I was touching the chipset voltage so that may be my wall, I hope. Hopefully I can change my Ht to the 255 safely in Bios and boot in properly. I do not want to rely on Clockgen only but use it as a helping tool. Prime95 now still running no errors will turn it of when I get home from work (would be 27 hours running with no errors, temp right at 45C still this morning when I checked it.)

Eddyg519, I am curious, did you hit 2.65 stable with 4 dimms filled? I need to be stable with 4 dimms filled, I guess filled dimms are not as commonly OC'ed from what I have been reading, which makes sense. Leave it to me to make it more difficult on myself as a beginner. I admire the challenge. I would be real happy with 2.5-2.7 stable, myself. With Prime95 running I can feel the speed increase as is.

 

[DragoXT]

I know you need your dimms filled, but just for grins, see if with only 2 dimms your stuff overclocks better. That would at least let you know what your chip could really do. If you are running xp, you really dont need more than 2 gig since xp will not utilize 4 gig properly. The max MS recommends is 3 gig for xp. If you run vista then you should be fine with 4 gig. My point is, overclocking is an adventure, you might have a gem of a chip, and it is your duty to find out by pushing it to the limit and doing whatever you can to see how far you can push that silicon. Take 2 dimms out and see if that puppy can fly faster than 2.3ghz.

 

[Zhut]

Yes It looks like 2.3ish is the best I can get so far with 4 dimms filled. I stepped up the chipset voltage and other voltages and still it wants to stay right at 2.3 Still not bad. I will try some tests with 2 dimms and see what I can do this weekend, I hope. It will be interesting to discover if that makes the difference. Currently my temps are great, ram has a lot of room to run, I think I should give 2 dimms a shot. I will let ya know how it goes.

I will continue to research this 4 dimm situation also I think. If I can find some explanations, testimonials, etc. about the 4 dimms and overclocking I would feel better and not like I have given up. 2 dimms will be fun to play around with also. Not a hard switch out and many times I am fine with 2 gigs. Just unfortunately/fortunately I purchased 4 to keep my old system goin till next year when I build from scratch. Then I can keep this build as my 2 gig Oc pc.

I was also fine to boot into windows changing the fsb in Bios to 258 so that was nice also. I can bump clock gen in less time instead of creeping up from 1.8 by starting at a higher freq. I just wish I could find a way to make the 4 gigs fly. I will keep at it! fun stuff!

 

[Zhut]

I just wanted to give you all a little update, for those who may care or be reading. I jacked up my voltages and played with every setting in various combinations to push my 4-dimm (4x1gig) overclock on my 939 to the limit. I was able to reach 2.370 ghz stable and that is all I can do with the 4 dimms full. I also pulled out 2 of the dimms and found that I had a great deal more room to run and OC. I did not have the time to run tests, yet with 2 dimm but I could see the speed increases and a few seconds off my superPi runs with even 20 minutes of testing, running at T1 and overclocking the 2 dimms conservatively. When I have more time I would like to explore the 2-dimm set up more thoroughly. For a 4 dimm overclock I should be happy with my 500ish mhz 4 dimm oc, I think. (runs great and cool at 2.309 ghz)

I was restricted in many ways with 4 full dimms, however I was amazingly able to lower my ram timings from stock settings from 2-3-2-5 to 2-2-2-5 with 4 dimms I am guessing since my ram is running at a lower frequency. This small adjustment did allow me to get a second faster at superPi.

I was considering purchasing another cpu for this board since I am limited by the 4 dimms.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103571

Might this be a good option? If I could pull off another 500ish mhz overclock on a 30 dollar chip, might not be a bad idea? Or should I try and track down another specific 939 fitting chip that may have good potential to further push and overclock my 4 dimm? Getting married year end and holding off on a full build until next year. I just want to have some fun with my old system by spending little $$$. I figure an innately faster cpu would start me off a step higher. Whatever I get its getting overclocked.

I saw a brisbane 4000+ that had a lot of great reviews also but that chip seems to come and go on the egg. Any thoughts, ideas would be helpful. Thanks in advance.

 

[Zhut]

I am back from running more tests on my 4 dimm 939 venice 3000 overclock. I studied up more on ram timings and was able to get to 2485 mhz with 4 sticks and low voltage.

I was able to tighten my ocz stock ram timings of 2-3-2-5 to 2-2-2-5 and ended up running quite well at my previous solid 2304 mhz (504mhz overclock) with the tightened timings. I was also able to run my vcore at 1.35 instead of 1.4 which knocked down the temp a bit (though temp has not really slowed me down at all). I could get to 2485 mhz (685mhz overclock) end make it through 32m pi with the 4x1 gig sticks. My problem now is getting the system to boot into windows with the high frequency (well high for me, 276). 2.5-2-3-6 were the timings I used that felt solid. I was able to hit 2509 with 4 sticks but got Prime 95 error after about 5 mins. I am getting to the point where loosening my timings more may not be worth it.

Any ideas on things I can adjust/try to help me to boot into windows with my fsb of 276? Perhaps there are some adjustments I can make to help me over the hump into windows. Once in windows I am fine, it seems.

Overclocking with the 4 dimms full has been challenging and I feel as if I am becoming much more familiar with my pc components. I think that burning in a bit may have helped, I think I will try to get solid at 2.45 and work from there up if I can.