8800 Ultra at newegg....

[ViperJohn]

it is a waste of money both cards topped out on ln2 were within 500 points of each other in 05 almost 30k

good gtx on air is 675/2200 these do 700/2500

Suicide LN2 bench only numbers are meaning less in the real world and you know it. Lets keep it in a 24/7
operational perspective that 99.999...% of end users are running.

That my friend would be a miracle 8800GTX on stock air and stay clean doing it. There is no Ultra made that
will smell 1250Mhz memory usably clean unless the tester was Ray Charles and memory timings were
softened so much that bandwidth went through the floor. Thats assuming the cores memory controllers could
do it without locking.

The 8800Ultra is just a cherry cored, ultra low volume boutique card and nothing more. It's for those few with
money to burn that want to be able thump their chest while proudly shouting "I have an 8800Ultra" during a self
induced ego trip. They are not meant for everyday Joe and are priced accordingly. NV and it's partners will
have no trouble selling everyone of them lol.

Another thing on the Ultra's is you have no idea how much the vendors are tacking on in the typical limited
supply gouge. I can still remember when x800XT-PE AGP cards were selling for $700-$800 at many vendors
when they were almost non-existent in the retail channel. It simple supply and demand laws in action.

Viper

 

[ViperJohn]

wow thats a crazy price tag.... now see what needs to happen is prices need to drop to where the 8800gts 640mb is like 200 bucks, and then simultaneously nvidia needs to change their drivers to allow SLI on intel chipsets.... then i would be stylin.

And why on earth would NV want to make drivers that would allow SLI on a major competitors chipset. Marketing/Sales 101.

Viper

 

[Rattle]

Suicide LN2 bench only numbers are meaning less in the real world and you know it. Lets keep it in a 24/7
operational perspective that 99.999...% of end users are running.

That my friend would be a miracle 8800GTX on stock air and stay clean doing it. There is no Ultra made that
will smell 1250Mhz memory usably clean unless the tester was Ray Charles and memory timings were
softened so much that bandwidth went through the floor. Thats assuming the cores memory controllers could
do it without locking.

The 8800Ultra is just a cherry cored, ultra low volume boutique card and nothing more. It's for those few with
money to burn that want to be able thump their chest while proudly shouting "I have an 8800Ultra" during a self
induced ego trip. They are not meant for everyday Joe and are priced accordingly. NV and it's partners will
have no trouble selling everyone of them lol.

Another thing on the Ultra's is you have no idea how much the vendors are tacking on in the typical limited
supply gouge. I can still remember when x800XT-PE AGP cards were selling for $700-$800 at many vendors
when they were almost non-existent in the retail channel. It simple supply and demand laws in action.

Viper

well i was kinda using real world non ray charles type stuff I thought.

my gtx does 660/2200 on air so i wouldnt thinnk 700/2500 on air is not out fo the question is these are indeed cherry picked it should be at least as good if not better tham my above average gtx. likewise ln2 on each or max air on each 500 point spread in 3dmark 05 isnt fantasy land type stuff either I would imagine, so thats all i was trying to relay buddy.
I was going by kingpins 29686 run in 05 with ultra and hipros 29433 run in 05 with gtx.



http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=143117&highlight=8800+ultra

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=142691&highlight=8800gtx

so if I can hit 21k on air with relative ease i would imagine 22k with an ultra isnt that far of a stretch

still not worth the price premium

 

[ViperJohn]

well i was kinda using real world non ray charles type stuff I thought.

my gtx does 660/2200 on air so i wouldnt thinnk 700/2500 on air is out fo the question. likewise ln2 on each or max air on each 500 point spread in 3dmark 05 isnt fantasy land type stuff either I would imagine, so thats all i was trying to relay buddy.

That is a damn good 8800GTX you have there on stock AC. Few cards can smell 645 truely clean/stable on
the ROP clock with stock AC even when running an XFX bios with the shader clock delta dialed down.

On the Ultra 700 core maybe but 1250 (2500ddr) on the Sammy 1A's is dreaming. This would be especially
true if NV still has the memory Vdd and Vddq tied together off the same on card power supply.

It NV gave the Ultra's separate Vdd and Vddq power supplies (like they did on the 7800-512 cards which
memory OC'ed like cats with their *** on fire) then the Vdd could be run up without the memory chip I/O
buffers going dirty on voltage to high and 1200Mhz memory completely clean might be in had with some
cards using the 1.0ns Samsung spec timing set.

Viper

 

[ViperJohn]

well i was kinda using real world non ray charles type stuff I thought.I was going by kingpins 29686 run in 05 with ultra and hipros 29433 run in 05 with gtx.


http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=143117&highlight=8800+ultra

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=142691&highlight=8800gtx

so if I can hit 21k on air with relative ease i would imagine 22k with an ultra isnt that far of a stretch

still not worth the price premium

While I have great respect for KingPins and HiPros numbers they are a long way from anything real world.
Pure speed record numbers from LN2 or Cascade Phase bench cards in suicide runs with driver IQ at HP,
and running the right negative LOD bias does not fit "normal". The object there is to just make it through
the benchmark without locking and get a number. What the display looks like while doing that is of no
concern unless it is artifacting so badly it hurts the score. Having a extreme OC'ed QX quad core running
LN2 or Cascade phase doesn't hurt either.

When OPPAINTER showed me what the right negative LOD bias could do to the benchmarks numbers from
from a stock NV card I just about died lol. Of course the display was nothing to look at while doing it but oh
the numbers, the numbers!!!.

Viper

 

[Rattle]

I thought they had .8 ns on the ultras compared to 1.0 on the gtx.
Probably wrong there but I am sure you know.
I actually have a question for you about my gtx I may hit you up in a PM if you dont mind for some info.

 

[meionm]

im just waiting for ATi's offerings to drive the prices down across the board, then i'll jump in and buy a good bang for buck deal from either ATi or nVidia. I welcome the 8800 Ultra as a means to prompt a slight price drop in the GTX

ATi promises......... we see how far that goes.


Pricy little ultra. I wish the time where the high end gfx was at $300 was back.

 

[nd4spdbh2]

And why on earth would NV want to make drivers that would allow SLI on a major competitors chipset. Marketing/Sales 101.

Viper

because if im not mistaken they are in a lawsuit right now on just that... a monopoly of their products, when SLI came out it was stated that it would work on any board regarless of make. or nvidia could give just me the special drivers


... another thing to consider would be once the 8800 ultras come out i can guarentee there will be bios's available for every manufacture, then quite possibly one with a 8800gtx could flash with the ultra bios and WALLA... instant 300 dollar savings.

 

[meionm]

... another thing to consider would be once the 8800 ultras come out i can guarentee there will be bios's available for every manufacture, then quite possibly one with a 8800gtx could flash with the ultra bios and WALLA... instant 300 dollar savings.

Pray that gfx never dies out of blue and manufacture doesn't inspect rma card, instant $500 into garbage.

 

[ViperJohn]

I thought they had .8 ns on the ultras compared to 1.0 on the gtx.
Probably wrong there but I am sure you know.
I actually have a question for you about my gtx I may hit you up in a PM if you dont mind for some info.

All the info I have and have seen indicates the chips on the Ultra's are 1A's. That is the fastest speed
Samsung lists for GDR3 in their datasheets and that was just recently aknowledged.

Samsung does show GDR3 -08 (.83ns) as "Emerging" and the Die Rev "Under Developement" with
qualification samples and mass productions stated for Q1 '07 so it is possible -08 chips could actually
be used on the Ultra's. Those would allow for 1250Mhz speeds no doubt if the memory controllers will
run that fast. If -08 chips are used that helps to explain the high card cost (besides the no competition
and vanity factors) as they would be at least twice the price of 1A chips add a lot to the BOM cost of
the cards.

PM away but I prefer email instead.

Viper

 

[aaronjb]

because if im not mistaken they are in a lawsuit right now on just that... a monopoly of their products, when SLI came out it was stated that it would work on any board regarless of make.

NVidia is under no legal obligation to have SLI functional on boards with Intel chipsets. Lawsuit or not (I can't find a reference of this), it will not happen.

 

[ViperJohn]

because if im not mistaken they are in a lawsuit right now on just that... a monopoly of their products, when SLI came out it was stated that it would work on any board regarless of make. or nvidia could give just me the special drivers


... another thing to consider would be once the 8800 ultras come out i can guarentee there will be bios's available for every manufacture, then quite possibly one with a 8800gtx could flash with the ultra bios and WALLA... instant 300 dollar savings.

Well if the lawsuit is true that is the beauty of the American system. Any idiot can bring a baseless lawsuit
on damn near anything lol.

nVidia NEVER stated that SLI could or would work on any chipset. It will not even work on all of Nvidia's
chipsets. The SLI bridge functions are in NV's SLI enabled chipset (that is not to be confused with the data
bridge between the cards BTW). Without the SLI bridge function in the MB chipset, or a separate on-card
SLI Bridge chip like the 7850GX2's used, you can not SLI just with driver changes alone.

Intel stated a long time ago they would not license the SLI bridge function from NV to incorporate into their
chipsets even if NV would do it any more than they would buy NV chipsets outright for use on Intel MB's.
That was before the AMD/ATI get together. Intel and NV talked about it after the merge but I do not think
it went anywhere.

Needing an NV SLI chipset to run and SLI config is proprietary, not a monopoly. SLI is not needed to get
high performance...or even extreme performance graphics out of a system. It would only be a monopoly
if you had to have SLI to function at normal levels or at all, like in the case of MS and Windows Operating
System. Even their the courts have stopped short of calling that a monopoly.

It's not the bios that makes an Ultra. It is the GPU and possibly other on card hardware. Anyone with
RivaTuner, ATItool and other OC tools can set the Ultra clock speeds but it doesn't mean a given GTX
card can run them clean and stable. You can also edit the existing 8800 bios rather easily to get higher
perfomance from any GTX card and I do mean more than just changing the base bios clocks. That is all
part of a full card mod.

Viper

 

[nd4spdbh2]

you guys shhhhh your wrecking my dreams of sli on my P5W dh

 

[Oc1Kenube]

£749 here in the uk approximately $1400 us so maybe you shouldnt feel so bad.

And i too would love sli on my p5w...

 

[ViperJohn]

£749 here in the uk approximately $1400 us so maybe you shouldnt feel so bad.

And i too would love sli on my p5w...

I know the prices in the UK are higher than in the states but I would say a lot of that is the
vendor trying to shove a bloody 4x4 up your bumm!!!

Viper

 

[Hazaro]

I was betting on an 8900GTX, but the step-up has failed me. There's no way I'm shelling out an extra $300 from the 8800GTX for this Ultra model for no performance increase. My GTX already runs well at 690 / 1100.

Exactly, same amount of steam processors, just 612/1130
Not worth extra $300

 

[Mobious]

+$800, and production rates match that of the Wii, it's the new 7800GTX 512Mb. I can only hope this knocks down prices for the GTXs.

-Mobious-

 

[ViperJohn]

+$800, and production rates match that of the Wii, it's the new 7800GTX 512Mb. I can only hope this knocks down prices for the GTXs.

-Mobious-

It won't. The 8800 Ultra is just a very limited production card. There won't be many and when they are gone...well their gone lol.

The only thing that will bring the cost of the 8800GTX down is something coming out of ATI that can compete with it.

Viper

 

[Burninate]

All the articles I've read have said that the Ultra's presence will not affect prices of the 8800GTX at all. The ultra is supposed to be the ultra high-end segment as opposed to the GTX just being the uber-high end segment. They created the ultra to be a whole new segment, thus a whole new price point.