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thats what I meant yerp.

the image is here and in the right format whenever it gets final anyhow.
the copy of the original at photobucket was a compressed version that made me think I needed an eye test :)

sure theres a joke in it here somewhere.... how many water coolers does it take to upload a picture? #Laughs#
 
Welcome to the much needed Water-cooling Heatload Explanation.

A water-cooled PC, or any pc, generates heat. Some parts produce massive amounts of heat due to the incredible number of calculations needed to give us what we crave, realistic games, Folding for our future, and decoding DVDs for our own personal use. I'm going to focus on two parts of your PC, the CPU and the GPU. These are the main hot parts we need to cool. I'll touch on a few other critical issues you need to understand as I hack my way through this.

Why Am I Doing This?

I used to teach electronics to young folks, I've been water cooling for a few years, so I think I can help get the concept of Heat-load across to any new person looking to expand their knowledge and build a really nice rig. Understanding the big picture, answering the eternal Forum question, "What stuff do I need to cool my rig"?

Most importantly, I must mention all the testers who post scientific tests and not hack reviews or this post wouldn't exist. These are people who for science and curiosity spent $100s++ of their own money and time building testing rigs, and COUNTLESS hours of their personal time to inform us, the uniformed public. I thank you Martin and Skinnee, you're an amazing part of our water cooling world. There are a few others, but they are leaders.

Done with the intro, on to the important stuff.

Okay, you've got an xx processor. How much heat does it generate under load? Heat is produced by the voltage and the amperage draw your CPU needs. Increasing voltage really increases your heat-load as do your overclocks. If a CPU uses 200 watts of power, about 80% to 90% will be lost as heat as the work is done in the CPU. It's deep electronic stuff, just go with it okay? You have to remove the heat.

You can describe your created heat-load in three ways (or activities):

1. Basic cruzin the web
2. Gaming
3. Benching for the best overclocks

Consider the following, all of them come into play when determining how to deal with said heat:

1. Your budget
2. Acceptable noise levels
3. What can you fit in your case
4. Expected cooling capability meaning low temps or acceptable temps.

Determining your heat-load isn't a perfect science.

You'll find numbers all over the place from what you have learned from reading lots of info, Googling terms like "heat-load i7 965", "AMD xxx", "Q6600 overclocked", etc. Reading 3-7 pages of Google, and following links within the Google links and the many links here, you should have an idea of what wattage you create in your PC furnace.

CPU heat-load

For example, I remember a Q6600 at 3.9 was 150 watts MAX. An i7 at 4.0 is 250 watts. Right now, as I type, my i7 965 stock is at 80 watts. My peak load is 340 watts, but for a very, very short time. So take the min/max with a grain of salt. These are max testing loads, so real world is a bit lower if you're a big gamer. I'm making a point, it's a lot of heat and you need to remove it. I use 250 watts as my stress wattage for calculations on MY chip.

GPU Heat-load

GPU's are a big issue now. Some are moving to water-cooling, having never done it before, just because their GPU screams like a undead banshee while gaming. I have these neat links from another forum. From what others have said these folks did a TON of work and are trusted. They were able to look at JUST the GPU heat-loads on many cards, not full system power, which really isn't what we need here.

Bookmark it!
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=635806


Please, I ask you to attempt to find out your heatload before we move on.

How basic WC works in relation to heatload.

We generate xx amount of heat. The heat is transferred to the water via the blocks on the CPU and GPU. The cooler the water, the more heat is transferred. As the water heats up the heat is removed by the radiator. The more efficient the fan/radiator combination is, the cooler the water. The cooler the water, the cooler your parts. So simple. Basic water-cooling uses a pump, res, a block, a radiator, AND ambient air temp. Our water can be no cooler than the air temp. A room at 12C will keep the chips much cooler than a room at 30C. Remember this!. Summers are much hotter and many back off on their overclocks in the summer. Funny thought, I just realized more people mention chilled water, mini fridges, etc., in the summer. And if you try to compare to someone else, remember ambient room temps and even the quality of the chip matters.

Delta T (DT) and why it's so important to understand it.

DT is the foundation of your WC loop. The better your DT, the cooler your chips are. In water-cooling DT is simply the difference between the ambient air temp and the water temp on the outgoing side of the rad. Room temp vs. water temp, that's it. You can't remove all the heat nor can you go below ambient room temp.

When you boot up a powered off, water-cooled PC, the water temp AND your CPU are at room temp. You boot the PC up, the chip gets hot FAST, almost instantly. The water moves over the chip, it begins to remove heat, the heat goes to the radiator, and SOME of the heat is removed. Not all can be removed. You have to know thermodynamics theory deeply (more than me) to know exactly why. The water begins to warm up slowly, and in time, the water reaches a balance, an equilibrium is reached. Heat is made and heat removed, the loop is stabilized, temps will not change.

If you change the room temp, the load, or your fan speed the loop needs to readjust. This is where we like to measure our cooling ability. usually 30 minutes at a stable load is long enough to begin to measure. If you increase your cooling capability, the water WILL get cooler.

Water temps in a stabilized loop, amazingly, are very similar anywhere in the loop. Only 2-3C MAX difference between the radiator out temp and the CPU out temp. Remember, the water can't remove all the heat, some is transferred to the air. Your radiator size, efficiency and fans play a big part in this. Look at it this way, it's a system built on many parts and within the laws of physics. Every part affects the other.

Let's talk about what a good DT is.

A CPU loop needs good DT. Under 10C is just fine, getting closer to 5C is very nice and important if you want big overclocks. Getting under 5C is just overdoing it, unless you're very extreme, need it for benching or just want to do it. On an average CPU loop shoot for under 10C and adjust your overclocks to be fine under the temps suggested by the makers.

A GPU loop used to be fine with a 15 to 20C DT. If you're a big overclocker on your GPUs, then shoot for 15C or lower. The Voltage Regulator Modules (VRM) on these new cards can be affected by temps. If you've got a GTX 280 like me, don't worry about it, it's the 5970s and the 480s and other really hot cards that can have this issue. So a lower DT for a GPU loop if your a big overclocker might be needed. Thats up to you as you design your setup.

So, how do you calculate all of this?

Use a bit of math, deciphering some graphs, it's easy! LOL, jk. Took me more than a few attempts to figure it out, but you can easily do it with help. Thanks to Martin (retired) and Skinnee we have the data. Bless them.

Let's go with my CPU standard of 250 watts and this chart from Skinnee's site. Hopefully you have the site bookmarked, if not, you will want all of his great test info.
http://www.skinneelabs.com/

This chart is the thermal test of a quality radiator with low fins per inch, great for low RPM, low noise fans.


HWLabs-SR1360_HeatLoadChart 2.jpg

Use the RED line. It's a good quality, popular, well performing fan at 1407 RPM, good middle ground. At the bottom of the chart find 250 watts, go up to the red line. WOW We have a 5.5 DT, very nice. Remember my comment about a CPU likes low DT but a GPU doesn't need it as much? Let's toss a 250 watt GPU into the same loop, your at 500 watts now. Res-Pump-Rad-CPU-GPU type loop. Look what happens to the DT, it's over 11DT now. Your CPU isn't happy anymore, but the GPU is just fine. In this case you're under radded and need to split the loop or get your DT under control with more fannage, better radiators/more radiators, better fans. More heat removal basically.

Remember this?

1. Your budget
2. Acceptable noise levels
3. What can you fit in your case
4. Expected cooling capability meaning low temps or acceptable temps

In many situations splitting the loop is so much easier to keep temps under control. You can only put so much in one loop. Splitting the loop means having one fully separate loop for the CPU and one for the GPUs. Two pumps, two rad setups, two reses etc. It was uncommon a few years ago unless you had 2+ GPUs. Now the GPUs are incredibly hot and it's slowly becoming the norm. It costs more, keeping the CPU temp low on it's own loop and having a higher DT loop just for the GPU.

Sorry, but many of us do have a massive GPU setup these days. You wanna play right with water-cooling? You pay. You can easily go past your budget once you start. It's amazing what a proper water-cooling setup costs.

Lots start out with the wrong radiator type or much too little radiator. Some think they can live with the high speed fans to compensate for too small rads, but end up buying another radiator and trying to fit it in the case. Many times you just have to accept your beloved case isn't going to work, or you're going to have to hang rads on the outside, or even make a separate rad box. You can't trick physics and think you don't need all the radiators you actually do need.

In summary, do your homework, plan for your rig and the 1 year out rig. You see another GPU in crossfire? Plan now.

Your DT matters, it's worth the effort to understand.

Thanks to all the input from many OCF members to get this cleaned up for Sticky use. I hope it guides many new folks to making the right choices.

Code:
[PLAIN][B][SIZE=4][COLOR=silver]Welcome to the much needed Water-cooling Heatload Explanation.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B]
 
[COLOR=silver]A water-cooled PC, or any pc, generates heat. Some parts produce massive amounts of heat due to the incredible number of calculations needed to give us what we crave, realistic games, Folding for our future, and decoding DVDs for our own personal use. I'm going to focus on two parts of your PC, the CPU and the GPU. These are the main hot parts we need to cool. I'll touch on a few other critical issues you need to understand as I hack my way through this.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Why Am I Doing This?[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]I used to teach electronics to young folks, I've been water cooling for a few years, so I think I can help get the concept of Heat-load across to any new person looking to expand their knowledge and build a really nice rig. Understanding the big picture, answering the eternal Forum question, "What stuff do I need to cool my rig"? [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Most importantly, I must mention all the testers who post scientific tests and not hack reviews or this post wouldn't exist. These are people who for science and curiosity spent $100s++ of their own money and time building testing rigs, and COUNTLESS hours of their personal time to inform us, the uniformed public. I thank you Martin and Skinnee, you're an amazing part of our water cooling world. There are a few others, but they are leaders.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Done with the intro, on to the important stuff.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]Okay, you've got an xx processor. How much heat does it generate under load? Heat is produced by the voltage and the amperage draw your CPU needs. Increasing voltage really increases your heat-load as do your overclocks. If a CPU uses 200 watts of power, about 80% to 90% will be lost as heat as the work is done in the CPU. It's deep electronic stuff, just go with it okay? You have to remove the heat.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver]You can describe your created heat-load in three ways (or activities):[/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]1. Basic cruzin the web[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]2. Gaming[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]3. Benching for the best overclocks[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver]Consider the following, all of them come into play when determining how to deal with said heat:[/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]1. Your budget[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]2. Acceptable noise levels[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]3. What can you fit in your case[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]4. Expected cooling capability meaning low temps or acceptable temps. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver][SIZE=2][B]Determining your heat-load isn't a perfect science.[/B][/SIZE] [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]You'll find numbers all over the place from what you have learned from reading lots of info, Googling terms like "heat-load i7 965", "AMD xxx", "Q6600 overclocked", etc. Reading 3-7 pages of Google, and following links within the Goggle links, you should have an idea of what wattage you create in your PC furnace.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]CPU heat-load[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]For example, I remember a Q6600 at 3.9 was 150 watts MAX. An i7 at 4.0 is 250 watts. Right now, as I type, my i7 965 stock is at 80 watts. My peak load is 340 watts, but for a very, very short time. So take the min/max with a grain of salt. These are max testing loads, so real world is a bit lower if you're a big gamer. I'm making a point, it's a lot of heat and you need to remove it. I use 250 watts as my stress wattage for calculations on MY chip.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]GPU Heat-load[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]GPU's are a big issue now. Some are moving to water-cooling, having never done it before, just because their GPU screams like a undead banshee while gaming. I have these neat links from another forum. From what others have said these folks did a TON of work and are trusted. They were able to look at JUST the GPU heat-loads on many cards, not full system power, which really isn't what we need here.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Bookmark it![/COLOR]
[URL="http://www.overclockers.com/forums/s...d.php?t=635806"][COLOR=silver]http://www.overclockers.com/forums/s...d.php?t=635806[/COLOR][/URL]
 
[COLOR=silver]Please, I ask you to attempt to find out your heatload before we move on.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]How basic WC works in relation to heatload.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]We generate xx amount of heat. The heat is transferred to the water via the blocks on the CPU and GPU. The cooler the water, the more heat is transferred. As the water heats up the heat is removed by the radiator. The more efficient the fan/radiator combination is, the cooler the water. The cooler the water, the cooler your parts. So simple. Basic water-cooling uses a pump, res, a block, a radiator, AND ambient air temp. Our water can be no cooler than the air temp. A room at 12C will keep the chips much cooler than a room at 30C. Remember this!. Summers are much hotter and many back off on their overclocks in the summer. Funny thought, I just realized more people mention chilled water, mini fridges, etc., in the summer. And if you try to compare to someone else, remember ambient room temps and even the quality of the chip matters.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Delta T (DT) and why it's so important to understand it.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]DT is the foundation of your WC loop. The better your DT, the cooler your chips are. In water-cooling DT is simply the difference between the ambient air temp and the water temp on the outgoing side of the rad. Room temp vs. water temp, that's it. You can't remove all the heat nor can you go below ambient room temp. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]When you boot up a powered off, water-cooled PC, the water temp AND your CPU are at room temp. You boot the PC up, the chip gets hot FAST, almost instantly. The water moves over the chip, it begins to remove heat, the heat goes to the radiator, and SOME of the heat is removed. Not all can be removed. You have to know thermodynamics theory deeply (more than me) to know exactly why. The water begins to warm up slowly, and in time, the water reaches a balance, an equilibrium is reached. Heat is made and heat removed, the loop is stabilized, temps will not change. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]If you change the room temp, the load, or your fan speed the loop needs to readjust. This is where we like to measure our cooling ability. usually 30 minutes at a stable load is long enough to begin to measure. If you increase your cooling capability, the water WILL get cooler. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Water temps in a stabilized loop, amazingly, are very similar anywhere in the loop. Only 2-3C MAX difference between the radiator out temp and the CPU out temp. Remember, the water can't remove all the heat, some is transferred to the air. Your radiator size, efficiency and fans play a big part in this. Look at it this way, it's a system built on many parts and within the laws of physics. Every part affects the other.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Let's talk about what a good DT is.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]A CPU loop needs good DT. Under 10C is just fine, getting closer to 5C is very nice and important if you want big overclocks. Getting under 5C is just overdoing it, unless you're very extreme, need it for benching or just want to do it. On an average CPU loop shoot for under 10C and adjust your overclocks to be fine under the temps suggested by the makers.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]A GPU loop used to be fine with a 15 to 20C DT. If you're a big overclocker on your GPUs, then shoot for 15C or lower. The Voltage Regulator Modules (VRM) on these new cards can be affected by temps. If you've got a GTX 280 like me, don't worry about it, it's the 5970s and the 480s and other really hot cards that can have this issue. So a lower DT for a GPU loop if your a big overclocker might be needed. Thats up to you as you design your setup.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]So, how do you calculate all of this?[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]Use a bit of math, deciphering some graphs, it's easy! LOL, jk. Took me more than a few attempts to figure it out, but you can easily do it with help. Thanks to Martin (retired) and Skinnee we have the data. Bless them.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Let's go with my CPU standard of 250 watts and this link. Link to it please, then go to page 4. Read it all when you get a chance.[/COLOR]
 
[URL="http://www.skinneelabs.com/hwlabs-sr1360.html?page=4"][COLOR=silver]http://www.skinneelabs.com/hwlabs-sr1360.html?page=4[/COLOR][/URL]
[COLOR=silver]This is a quality radiator with low fins per inch, great for low RPM, low noise fans.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Go to the second chart, use the RED line. It's a good quality, popular, well performing fan at 1407 RPM, good middle ground. At the bottom of the chart find 250 watts, go up to the red line. WOW We have a 5.5 DT, very nice. Remember my comment about a CPU likes low DT but a GPU doesn't need it as much? Let's toss a 250 watt GPU into the same loop, your at 500 watts now. Res-Pump-Rad-CPU-GPU type loop. Look what happens to the DT, it's over 11DT now. Your CPU isn't happy anymore, but the GPU is just fine. In this case you're under radded and need to split the loop or get your DT under control with more fannage, better radiators/more radiators, better fans. More heat removal basically.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Remember this?[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]1. Your budget[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]2. Acceptable noise levels[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]3. What can you fit in your case[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]4. Expected cooling capability meaning low temps or acceptable temps [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]In many situations splitting the loop is so much easier to keep temps under control. You can only put so much in one loop. Splitting the loop means having one fully separate loop for the CPU and one for the GPUs. Two pumps, two rad setups, two reses etc. It was uncommon a few years ago unless you had 2+ GPUs. Now the GPUs are incredibly hot and it's slowly becoming the norm. It costs more, keeping the CPU temp low on it's own loop and having a higher DT loop just for the GPU. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Sorry, but many of us do have a massive GPU setup these days. You wanna play right with water-cooling? You pay. You can easily go past your budget once you start. It's amazing what a proper water-cooling setup costs.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Lots start out with the wrong radiator type or much too little radiator. Some think they can live with the high speed fans to compensate for too small rads, but end up buying another radiator and trying to fit it in the case. Many times you just have to accept your beloved case isn't going to work, or you're going to have to hang rads on the outside, or even make a separate rad box. You can't trick physics and think you don't need all the radiators you actually do need.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]In summary, do your homework, plan for your rig and the 1 year out rig. You see another GPU in crossfire? Plan now.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Your DT matters, it's worth the effort to understand.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Thanks to all the input from many OCF members to get this cleaned up for Sticky use. I hope it guides many new folks to making the right choices.[/COLOR][/PLAIN]
 

Welcome to the much needed Water-cooling Heatload Explanation.




A water-cooled PC, or any pc, generates heat. Some parts produce massive amounts of heat due to the incredible number of calculations needed to give us what we crave, realistic games, Folding for our future, and decoding DVDs for our own personal use. I'm going to focus on two parts of your PC, the CPU and the GPU. These are the main hot parts we need to cool. I'll touch on a few other critical issues you need to understand as I hack my way through this.

Why Am I Doing This?

I used to teach electronics to young folks, I've been water cooling for a few years, so I think I can help get the concept of Heat-load across to any new person looking to expand their knowledge and build a really nice rig. Understanding the big picture, answering the eternal Forum question, "What stuff do I need to cool my rig"?

Most importantly, I must mention all the testers who post scientific tests and not hack reviews or this post wouldn't exist. These are people who for science and curiosity spent $100s++ of their own money and time building testing rigs, and COUNTLESS hours of their personal time to inform us, the uniformed public. I thank you Martin and Skinnee, you're an amazing part of our water cooling world. There are a few others, but they are leaders.

Done with the intro, on to the important stuff.

Okay, you've got an xx processor. How much heat does it generate under load? Heat is produced by the voltage and the amperage draw your CPU needs. Increasing voltage really increases your heat-load as do your overclocks. If a CPU uses 200 watts of power, about 80% to 90% will be lost as heat as the work is done in the CPU. It's deep electronic stuff, just go with it okay? You have to remove the heat.

You can describe your created heat-load in three ways (or activities):

1. Basic cruzin the web
2. Gaming
3. Benching for the best overclocks

Consider the following, all of them come into play when determining how to deal with said heat:

1. Your budget
2. Acceptable noise levels
3. What can you fit in your case
4. Expected cooling capability meaning low temps or acceptable temps.

Determining your heat-load isn't a perfect science.

You'll find numbers all over the place from what you have learned from reading lots of info, Googling terms like "heat-load i7 965", "AMD xxx", "Q6600 overclocked", etc. Reading 3-7 pages of Google, and following links within the Google links and the many links here, you should have an idea of what wattage you create in your PC furnace.

CPU heat-load

For example, I remember a Q6600 at 3.9 was 150 watts MAX. An i7 at 4.0 is 250 watts. Right now, as I type, my i7 965 stock is at 80 watts. My peak load is 340 watts, but for a very, very short time. So take the min/max with a grain of salt. These are max testing loads, so real world is a bit lower if you're a big gamer. I'm making a point, it's a lot of heat and you need to remove it. I use 250 watts as my stress wattage for calculations on MY chip.

GPU Heat-load

GPU's are a big issue now. Some are moving to water-cooling, having never done it before, just because their GPU screams like a undead banshee while gaming. I have these neat links from another forum. From what others have said these folks did a TON of work and are trusted. They were able to look at JUST the GPU heat-loads on many cards, not full system power, which really isn't what we need here.

Bookmark it!
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=635806



Please, I ask you to attempt to find out your heatload before we move on.


How basic WC works in relation to heatload.

We generate xx amount of heat. The heat is transferred to the water via the blocks on the CPU and GPU. The cooler the water, the more heat is transferred. As the water heats up the heat is removed by the radiator. The more efficient the fan/radiator combination is, the cooler the water. The cooler the water, the cooler your parts. So simple. Basic water-cooling uses a pump, res, a block, a radiator, AND ambient air temp. Our water can be no cooler than the air temp. A room at 12C will keep the chips much cooler than a room at 30C. Remember this!. Summers are much hotter and many back off on their overclocks in the summer. Funny thought, I just realized more people mention chilled water, mini fridges, etc., in the summer. And if you try to compare to someone else, remember ambient room temps and even the quality of the chip matters.

Delta T (DT) and why it's so important to understand it.

DT is the foundation of your WC loop. The better your DT, the cooler your chips are. In water-cooling DT is simply the difference between the ambient air temp and the water temp on the outgoing side of the rad. Room temp vs. water temp, that's it. You can't remove all the heat nor can you go below ambient room temp.

When you boot up a powered off, water-cooled PC, the water temp AND your CPU are at room temp. You boot the PC up, the chip gets hot FAST, almost instantly. The water moves over the chip, it begins to remove heat, the heat goes to the radiator, and SOME of the heat is removed. Not all can be removed. You have to know thermodynamics theory deeply (more than me) to know exactly why. The water begins to warm up slowly, and in time, the water reaches a balance, an equilibrium is reached. Heat is made and heat removed, the loop is stabilized, temps will not change.

If you change the room temp, the load, or your fan speed the loop needs to readjust. This is where we like to measure our cooling ability. usually 30 minutes at a stable load is long enough to begin to measure. If you increase your cooling capability, the water WILL get cooler.

Water temps in a stabilized loop, amazingly, are very similar anywhere in the loop. Only 2-3C MAX difference between the radiator out temp and the CPU out temp. Remember, the water can't remove all the heat, some is transferred to the air. Your radiator size, efficiency and fans play a big part in this. Look at it this way, it's a system built on many parts and within the laws of physics. Every part affects the other.

Let's talk about what a good DT is.

A CPU loop needs good DT. Under 10C is just fine, getting closer to 5C is very nice and important if you want big overclocks. Getting under 5C is just overdoing it, unless you're very extreme, need it for benching or just want to do it. On an average CPU loop shoot for under 10C and adjust your overclocks to be fine under the temps suggested by the makers.

A GPU loop used to be fine with a 15 to 20C DT. If you're a big overclocker on your GPUs, then shoot for 15C or lower. The Voltage Regulator Modules (VRM) on these new cards can be affected by temps. If you've got a GTX 280 like me, don't worry about it, it's the 5970s and the 480s and other really hot cards that can have this issue. So a lower DT for a GPU loop if your a big overclocker might be needed. Thats up to you as you design your setup.

So, how do you calculate all of this?

Use a bit of math, deciphering some graphs, it's easy! LOL, jk. Took me more than a few attempts to figure it out, but you can easily do it with help. Thanks to Martin (retired) and Skinnee we have the data. Bless them.

Let's go with my CPU standard of 250 watts and this chart from Skinnee's site. Hopefully you have the site bookmarked, if not, you will want all of his great test info.
http://www.skinneelabs.com/

This chart is the thermal test of a quality radiator with low fins per inch, great for low RPM, low noise fans.

HWLabs-SR1360_HeatLoadChart 2.jpg

Use the RED line. It's a good quality, popular, well performing fan at 1407 RPM, good middle ground. At the bottom of the chart find 250 watts, go up to the red line. WOW We have a 5.5 DT, very nice. Remember my comment about a CPU likes low DT but a GPU doesn't need it as much? Let's toss a 250 watt GPU into the same loop, your at 500 watts now. Res-Pump-Rad-CPU-GPU type loop. Look what happens to the DT, it's over 11DT now. Your CPU isn't happy anymore, but the GPU is just fine. In this case you're under radded and need to split the loop or get your DT under control with more fannage, better radiators/more radiators, better fans. More heat removal basically.

Remember this?

1. Your budget
2. Acceptable noise levels
3. What can you fit in your case
4. Expected cooling capability meaning low temps or acceptable temps

In many situations splitting the loop is so much easier to keep temps under control. You can only put so much in one loop. Splitting the loop means having one fully separate loop for the CPU and one for the GPUs. Two pumps, two rad setups, two reses etc. It was uncommon a few years ago unless you had 2+ GPUs. Now the GPUs are incredibly hot and it's slowly becoming the norm. It costs more, keeping the CPU temp low on it's own loop and having a higher DT loop just for the GPU.

Sorry, but many of us do have a massive GPU setup these days. You wanna play right with water-cooling? You pay. You can easily go past your budget once you start. It's amazing what a proper water-cooling setup costs.

Lots start out with the wrong radiator type or much too little radiator. Some think they can live with the high speed fans to compensate for too small rads, but end up buying another radiator and trying to fit it in the case. Many times you just have to accept your beloved case isn't going to work, or you're going to have to hang rads on the outside, or even make a separate rad box. You can't trick physics and think you don't need all the radiators you actually do need.

In summary, do your homework, plan for your rig and the 1 year out rig. You see another GPU in crossfire? Plan now.

Your DT matters, it's worth the effort to understand.

Thanks to all the input from many OCF members to get this cleaned up for Sticky use. I hope it guides many new folks to making the right choices.

Code:
[PLAIN][B][SIZE=4][COLOR=silver]Welcome to the much needed Water-cooling Heatload Explanation.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B]
 
[COLOR=silver]A water-cooled PC, or any pc, generates heat. Some parts produce massive amounts of heat due to the incredible number of calculations needed to give us what we crave, realistic games, Folding for our future, and decoding DVDs for our own personal use. I'm going to focus on two parts of your PC, the CPU and the GPU. These are the main hot parts we need to cool. I'll touch on a few other critical issues you need to understand as I hack my way through this.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Why Am I Doing This?[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]I used to teach electronics to young folks, I've been water cooling for a few years, so I think I can help get the concept of Heat-load across to any new person looking to expand their knowledge and build a really nice rig. Understanding the big picture, answering the eternal Forum question, "What stuff do I need to cool my rig"? [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Most importantly, I must mention all the testers who post scientific tests and not hack reviews or this post wouldn't exist. These are people who for science and curiosity spent $100s++ of their own money and time building testing rigs, and COUNTLESS hours of their personal time to inform us, the uniformed public. I thank you Martin and Skinnee, you're an amazing part of our water cooling world. There are a few others, but they are leaders.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Done with the intro, on to the important stuff.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]Okay, you've got an xx processor. How much heat does it generate under load? Heat is produced by the voltage and the amperage draw your CPU needs. Increasing voltage really increases your heat-load as do your overclocks. If a CPU uses 200 watts of power, about 80% to 90% will be lost as heat as the work is done in the CPU. It's deep electronic stuff, just go with it okay? You have to remove the heat.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver]You can describe your created heat-load in three ways (or activities):[/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]1. Basic cruzin the web[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]2. Gaming[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]3. Benching for the best overclocks[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver]Consider the following, all of them come into play when determining how to deal with said heat:[/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]1. Your budget[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]2. Acceptable noise levels[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]3. What can you fit in your case[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]4. Expected cooling capability meaning low temps or acceptable temps. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver][SIZE=2][B]Determining your heat-load isn't a perfect science.[/B][/SIZE] [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]You'll find numbers all over the place from what you have learned from reading lots of info, Googling terms like "heat-load i7 965", "AMD xxx", "Q6600 overclocked", etc. Reading 3-7 pages of Google, and following links within the Goggle links, you should have an idea of what wattage you create in your PC furnace.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]CPU heat-load[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]For example, I remember a Q6600 at 3.9 was 150 watts MAX. An i7 at 4.0 is 250 watts. Right now, as I type, my i7 965 stock is at 80 watts. My peak load is 340 watts, but for a very, very short time. So take the min/max with a grain of salt. These are max testing loads, so real world is a bit lower if you're a big gamer. I'm making a point, it's a lot of heat and you need to remove it. I use 250 watts as my stress wattage for calculations on MY chip.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]GPU Heat-load[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]GPU's are a big issue now. Some are moving to water-cooling, having never done it before, just because their GPU screams like a undead banshee while gaming. I have these neat links from another forum. From what others have said these folks did a TON of work and are trusted. They were able to look at JUST the GPU heat-loads on many cards, not full system power, which really isn't what we need here.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Bookmark it![/COLOR]
[URL="http://www.overclockers.com/forums/s...d.php?t=635806"][COLOR=silver]http://www.overclockers.com/forums/s...d.php?t=635806[/COLOR][/URL]
 
[COLOR=silver]Please, I ask you to attempt to find out your heatload before we move on.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]How basic WC works in relation to heatload.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]We generate xx amount of heat. The heat is transferred to the water via the blocks on the CPU and GPU. The cooler the water, the more heat is transferred. As the water heats up the heat is removed by the radiator. The more efficient the fan/radiator combination is, the cooler the water. The cooler the water, the cooler your parts. So simple. Basic water-cooling uses a pump, res, a block, a radiator, AND ambient air temp. Our water can be no cooler than the air temp. A room at 12C will keep the chips much cooler than a room at 30C. Remember this!. Summers are much hotter and many back off on their overclocks in the summer. Funny thought, I just realized more people mention chilled water, mini fridges, etc., in the summer. And if you try to compare to someone else, remember ambient room temps and even the quality of the chip matters.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Delta T (DT) and why it's so important to understand it.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]DT is the foundation of your WC loop. The better your DT, the cooler your chips are. In water-cooling DT is simply the difference between the ambient air temp and the water temp on the outgoing side of the rad. Room temp vs. water temp, that's it. You can't remove all the heat nor can you go below ambient room temp. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]When you boot up a powered off, water-cooled PC, the water temp AND your CPU are at room temp. You boot the PC up, the chip gets hot FAST, almost instantly. The water moves over the chip, it begins to remove heat, the heat goes to the radiator, and SOME of the heat is removed. Not all can be removed. You have to know thermodynamics theory deeply (more than me) to know exactly why. The water begins to warm up slowly, and in time, the water reaches a balance, an equilibrium is reached. Heat is made and heat removed, the loop is stabilized, temps will not change. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]If you change the room temp, the load, or your fan speed the loop needs to readjust. This is where we like to measure our cooling ability. usually 30 minutes at a stable load is long enough to begin to measure. If you increase your cooling capability, the water WILL get cooler. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Water temps in a stabilized loop, amazingly, are very similar anywhere in the loop. Only 2-3C MAX difference between the radiator out temp and the CPU out temp. Remember, the water can't remove all the heat, some is transferred to the air. Your radiator size, efficiency and fans play a big part in this. Look at it this way, it's a system built on many parts and within the laws of physics. Every part affects the other.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Let's talk about what a good DT is.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]A CPU loop needs good DT. Under 10C is just fine, getting closer to 5C is very nice and important if you want big overclocks. Getting under 5C is just overdoing it, unless you're very extreme, need it for benching or just want to do it. On an average CPU loop shoot for under 10C and adjust your overclocks to be fine under the temps suggested by the makers.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]A GPU loop used to be fine with a 15 to 20C DT. If you're a big overclocker on your GPUs, then shoot for 15C or lower. The Voltage Regulator Modules (VRM) on these new cards can be affected by temps. If you've got a GTX 280 like me, don't worry about it, it's the 5970s and the 480s and other really hot cards that can have this issue. So a lower DT for a GPU loop if your a big overclocker might be needed. Thats up to you as you design your setup.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]So, how do you calculate all of this?[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]Use a bit of math, deciphering some graphs, it's easy! LOL, jk. Took me more than a few attempts to figure it out, but you can easily do it with help. Thanks to Martin (retired) and Skinnee we have the data. Bless them.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Let's go with my CPU standard of 250 watts and this link. Link to it please, then go to page 4. Read it all when you get a chance.[/COLOR]
 
[URL="http://www.skinneelabs.com/hwlabs-sr1360.html?page=4"][COLOR=silver]http://www.skinneelabs.com/hwlabs-sr1360.html?page=4[/COLOR][/URL]
[COLOR=silver]This is a quality radiator with low fins per inch, great for low RPM, low noise fans.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Go to the second chart, use the RED line. It's a good quality, popular, well performing fan at 1407 RPM, good middle ground. At the bottom of the chart find 250 watts, go up to the red line. WOW We have a 5.5 DT, very nice. Remember my comment about a CPU likes low DT but a GPU doesn't need it as much? Let's toss a 250 watt GPU into the same loop, your at 500 watts now. Res-Pump-Rad-CPU-GPU type loop. Look what happens to the DT, it's over 11DT now. Your CPU isn't happy anymore, but the GPU is just fine. In this case you're under radded and need to split the loop or get your DT under control with more fannage, better radiators/more radiators, better fans. More heat removal basically.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Remember this?[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]1. Your budget[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]2. Acceptable noise levels[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]3. What can you fit in your case[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]4. Expected cooling capability meaning low temps or acceptable temps [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]In many situations splitting the loop is so much easier to keep temps under control. You can only put so much in one loop. Splitting the loop means having one fully separate loop for the CPU and one for the GPUs. Two pumps, two rad setups, two reses etc. It was uncommon a few years ago unless you had 2+ GPUs. Now the GPUs are incredibly hot and it's slowly becoming the norm. It costs more, keeping the CPU temp low on it's own loop and having a higher DT loop just for the GPU. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Sorry, but many of us do have a massive GPU setup these days. You wanna play right with water-cooling? You pay. You can easily go past your budget once you start. It's amazing what a proper water-cooling setup costs.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Lots start out with the wrong radiator type or much too little radiator. Some think they can live with the high speed fans to compensate for too small rads, but end up buying another radiator and trying to fit it in the case. Many times you just have to accept your beloved case isn't going to work, or you're going to have to hang rads on the outside, or even make a separate rad box. You can't trick physics and think you don't need all the radiators you actually do need.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]In summary, do your homework, plan for your rig and the 1 year out rig. You see another GPU in crossfire? Plan now.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Your DT matters, it's worth the effort to understand.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Thanks to all the input from many OCF members to get this cleaned up for Sticky use. I hope it guides many new folks to making the right choices.[/COLOR][/PLAIN]
 
Last edited:
anything for you conum :)

version two is the dislexic friendly version, I have trouble following lines and end up getting lost so a bit of colour in the formatting to me makes it look less like a barrage of eye bleeding clingon text :)

take your pick :salute:
 

Welcome to the much needed Water-cooling Heat-load Explanation




A water-cooled PC, or any pc, generates heat. Some parts produce massive amounts of heat due to the incredible number of calculations needed to give us what we crave, realistic games, Folding for our future, and decoding DVDs for our own personal use. I'm going to focus on two parts of your PC, the CPU and the GPU. These are the main hot parts we need to cool. I'll touch on a few other critical issues you need to understand as I hack my way through this.


Why Am I Doing This?

I used to teach electronics to young folks, I've been water cooling for a few years, so I think I can help get the concept of Heat-load across to any new person looking to expand their knowledge and build a really nice rig. Understanding the big picture, answering the eternal Forum question, "What stuff do I need to cool my rig"?

Most importantly, I must mention all the testers who post scientific tests and not hack reviews or this post wouldn't exist. These are people who for science and curiosity spent $100s++ of their own money and time building testing rigs, and COUNTLESS hours of their personal time to inform us, the uniformed public. I thank you Martin and Skinnee, you're an amazing part of our water cooling world. There are a few others, but they are leaders.


Done with the intro, on to the important stuff.

Okay, you've got an xx processor. How much heat does it generate under load? Heat is produced by the voltage and the amperage draw your CPU needs. Increasing voltage really increases your heat-load as do your overclocks. If a CPU uses 200 watts of power, about 80% to 90% will be lost as heat as the work is done in the CPU. It's deep electronic stuff, just go with it okay? You have to remove the heat.

You can describe your created heat-load in three ways (or activities):

1. Basic cruzin the web
2. Gaming
3. Benching for the best overclocks

Consider the following, all of them come into play when determining how to deal with said heat:

1. Your budget
2. Acceptable noise levels
3. What can you fit in your case
4. Expected cooling capability meaning low temps or acceptable temps.


Determining your heat-load isn't a perfect science.

You'll find numbers all over the place from what you have learned from reading lots of info, Googling terms like "heat-load i7 965", "AMD xxx", "Q6600 overclocked", etc. Reading 3-7 pages of Google, and following links within the Google links and the many links here, you should have an idea of what wattage you create in your PC furnace.


CPU heat-load

for example, I remember a Q6600 at 3.9 was 150 watts MAX. An i7 at 4.0 is 250 watts. Right now, as I type, my i7 965 stock is at 80 watts. My peak load is 340 watts, but for a very, very short time. So take the min/max with a grain of salt. These are max testing loads, so real world is a bit lower if you're a big gamer. I'm making a point, it's a lot of heat and you need to remove it. I use 250 watts as my stress wattage for calculations on MY chip.


GPU Heat-load

GPU's are a big issue now. Some are moving to water-cooling, having never done it before, just because their GPU screams like an un-dead banshee while gaming. I have these neat links from another forum. From what others have said these folks did a TON of work and are trusted. They were able to look at JUST the GPU heat-loads on many cards, not full system power, which really isn't what we need here.

Bookmark it!
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=635806



Please, I ask you to attempt to find out your heat-load before we move on.



How basic WC works in relation to heat-load.

We generate xx amount of heat. The heat is transferred to the water via the blocks on the CPU and GPU. The cooler the water, the more heat is transferred. As the water heats up the heat is removed by the radiator. The more efficient the fan/radiator combination is, the cooler the water. The cooler the water, the cooler your parts its so simple. Basic water-cooling uses a pump, res, a block, a radiator, AND ambient air temp. Our water can be no cooler than the air temp. A room at 12C will keep the chips much cooler than a room at 30C. Remember this!. Summers are much hotter and many back off on their overclocks in the summer. Funny thought, I just realized more people mention chilled water, mini fridges, etc., in the summer. And if you try to compare to someone else, remember ambient room temps and even the quality of the chip matters.


Delta T (DT) and why it's so important to understand it.

DT is the foundation of your WC loop. The better your DT, the cooler your chips are. In water-cooling DT is simply the difference between the ambient air temp and the water temp on the outgoing side of the rad. Room temp vs water temp, that's it. You can't remove all the heat nor can you go below ambient room temp.

When you boot up a powered off, water-cooled PC, the water temp AND your CPU are at room temp. You boot the PC up: the chip gets hot FAST, almost instantly. The water moves over the chip, it begins to remove heat, the heat goes to the radiator, and SOME of the heat is removed. Not all can be removed. You have to know thermodynamics theory deeply (more than me) to know exactly why. The water begins to warm up slowly, and in time, the water reaches a balance, equilibrium is reached. Heat is made and heat removed, the loop is stabilized, temps will not change.

If you change the room temp, the load, or your fan speed the loop needs to readjust. This is where we like to measure our cooling ability. Usually 30 minutes at a stable load is long enough to begin to measure. If you increase your cooling capability, the water WILL get cooler.

Water temps in a stabilized loop, amazingly, are very similar anywhere in the loop. Only 2-3C MAX difference between the radiator out temp and the CPU out temp. Remember, the water can't remove all the heat: some is transferred to the air. Your radiator size, efficiency and fans play a big part in this. Look at it this way, it's a system built on many parts and within the laws of physics. Every part affects the other.


Let's talk about what a good DT is.

A CPU loop needs good DT. Under 10C is just fine, getting closer to 5C is very nice and important if you want big overclocks. Getting under 5C is just overdoing it, unless you're very extreme, need it for benching or just want to do it. On an average CPU loop shoot for under 10C and adjust your overclocks to be fine under the temps suggested by the makers.

A GPU loop used to be fine with a 15 to 20C DT. If you're a big over clocker on your GPUs, then shoot for 15C or lower. The Voltage Regulator Modules (VRM) on these new cards can be affected by temps. If you've got a GTX 280 like me, don't worry about it, it's the 5970s and the 480s and other really hot cards that can have this issue. So a lower DT for a GPU loop if you`re a big over clocker might be needed. That`s up to you as you design your setup.


So, how do you calculate all of this?

Use a bit of math, deciphering some graphs, it's easy! LOL, jk. Took me more than a few attempts to figure it out, but you can easily do it with help. Thanks to Martin (retired) and Skinnee we have the data. Bless them.

Let's go with my CPU standard of 250 watts and this chart from Skinnee's site. Hopefully you have the site bookmarked, if not, you will want all of his great test info.
http://www.skinneelabs.com/

This chart is the thermal test of a quality radiator with low fins per inch, great for low RPM, low noise fans.

HWLabs-SR1360_HeatLoadChart 2.jpg

Use the RED line. It's a good quality, popular, well performing fan at 1407 RPM, good middle ground. At the bottom of the chart find 250 watts, go up to the red line. WOW We have a 5.5 DT, very nice. Remember my comment about a CPU likes low DT but a GPU doesn't need it as much? Let's toss a 250 watt GPU into the same loop, your at 500 watts now. Res-Pump-Rad-CPU-GPU type loop. Look what happens to the DT, it's over 11DT now. Your CPU isn't happy anymore, but the GPU is just fine. In this case you're under radded and need to split the loop or get your DT under control with more fannage, better radiators/more radiators, better fans. More heat removal basically.


Remember this?

1. Your budget
2. Acceptable noise levels
3. What can you fit in your case
4. Expected cooling capability meaning low temps or acceptable temps

In many situations splitting the loop is so much easier to keep temps under control. You can only put so much in one loop. Splitting the loop means having one fully separate loop for the CPU and one for the GPUs. Two pumps, two rad setups, two reses etc. It was uncommon a few years ago unless you had 2+ GPUs. Now the GPUs are incredibly hot and it's slowly becoming the norm. It costs more, keeping the CPU temp low on it's own loop and having a higher DT loop just for the GPU.

Sorry, but many of us do have a massive GPU setup these days. You wanna play right with water-cooling? You pay. You can easily go past your budget once you start. It's amazing what a proper water-cooling setup costs.

Lots start out with the wrong radiator type or much too little radiator. Some think they can live with the high speed fans to compensate for too small rads, but end up buying another radiator and trying to fit it in the case. Many times you just have to accept your beloved case isn't going to work, or you're going to have to hang rads on the outside, or even make a separate rad box. You can't trick physics and think you don't need all the radiators you actually do need.

In summary, do your homework, plan for your rig and the 1 year out rig. You see another GPU in crossfire? Plan now.

Your DT matters, it's worth the effort to understand.


Thanks to all the input from many OCF members to get this cleaned up for Sticky use. I hope it guides many new folks to making the right choices.

Code:
[PLAIN][B][SIZE=4][COLOR=silver]Welcome to the much needed  Water-cooling Heat-load Explanation.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B]
 
[COLOR=silver]A water-cooled PC, or any pc, generates heat. Some parts  produce massive amounts of heat due to the incredible number of  calculations needed to give us what we crave, realistic games, Folding  for our future, and decoding DVDs for our own personal use. I'm going to  focus on two parts of your PC, the CPU and the GPU. These are the main  hot parts we need to cool. I'll touch on a few other critical issues you  need to understand as I hack my way through this.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Why Am I Doing This?[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]I used to teach electronics to young folks, I've been  water cooling for a few years, so I think I can help get the concept of  Heat-load across to any new person looking to expand their knowledge and  build a really nice rig. Understanding the big picture, answering the  eternal Forum question, "What stuff do I need to cool my rig"? [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Most importantly, I must mention all the testers who post  scientific tests and not hack reviews or this post wouldn't exist. These  are people who for science and curiosity spent $100s++ of their own  money and time building testing rigs, and COUNTLESS hours of their  personal time to inform us, the uniformed public. I thank you Martin and  Skinnee, you're an amazing part of our water cooling world. There are a  few others, but they are leaders.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Done with the intro, on to the important  stuff.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]Okay, you've got an xx processor. How much heat does it  generate under load? Heat is produced by the voltage and the amperage  draw your CPU needs. Increasing voltage really increases your heat-load  as do your overclocks. If a CPU uses 200 watts of power, about 80% to  90% will be lost as heat as the work is done in the CPU. It's deep  electronic stuff, just go with it okay? You have to remove the  heat.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver]You can describe your created heat-load in three  ways (or activities):[/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]1. Basic cruzin the web[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]2. Gaming[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]3. Benching for the best overclocks[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver]Consider the following, all of them come into play  when determining how to deal with said heat:[/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]1. Your budget[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]2. Acceptable noise levels[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]3. What can you fit in your case[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]4. Expected cooling capability meaning low temps or  acceptable temps. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver][SIZE=2][B]Determining your heat-load isn't a perfect  science.[/B][/SIZE] [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]You'll find numbers all over the place from what you have  learned from reading lots of info, Googling terms like "heat-load i7  965", "AMD xxx", "Q6600 overclocked", etc. Reading 3-7 pages of Google,  and following links within the Goggle links, you should have an idea of  what wattage you create in your PC furnace.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]CPU heat-load[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]For example, I remember a Q6600 at 3.9 was 150 watts MAX.  An i7 at 4.0 is 250 watts. Right now, as I type, my i7 965 stock is at  80 watts. My peak load is 340 watts, but for a very, very short time. So  take the min/max with a grain of salt. These are max testing loads, so  real world is a bit lower if you're a big gamer. I'm making a point,  it's a lot of heat and you need to remove it. I use 250 watts as my  stress wattage for calculations on MY chip.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]GPU Heat-load[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]GPU's are a big issue now. Some are moving to  water-cooling, having never done it before, just because their GPU  screams like a undead banshee while gaming. I have these neat links from  another forum. From what others have said these folks did a TON of work  and are trusted. They were able to look at JUST the GPU heat-loads on  many cards, not full system power, which really isn't what we need  here.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Bookmark it![/COLOR]
[URL="http://www.overclockers.com/forums/s...d.php?t=635806"][COLOR=silver]http://www.overclockers.com/forums/s...d.php?t=635806[/COLOR][/URL]
 
[COLOR=silver]Please, I ask you to attempt to find out your heatload  before we move on.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]How basic WC works in relation to  heatload.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]We generate xx amount of heat. The heat is transferred to  the water via the blocks on the CPU and GPU. The cooler the water, the  more heat is transferred. As the water heats up the heat is removed by  the radiator. The more efficient the fan/radiator combination is, the  cooler the water. The cooler the water, the cooler your parts. So  simple. Basic water-cooling uses a pump, res, a block, a radiator, AND  ambient air temp. Our water can be no cooler than the air temp. A room  at 12C will keep the chips much cooler than a room at 30C. Remember  this!. Summers are much hotter and many back off on their overclocks in  the summer. Funny thought, I just realized more people mention chilled  water, mini fridges, etc., in the summer. And if you try to compare to  someone else, remember ambient room temps and even the quality of the  chip matters.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Delta T (DT) and why it's so important to  understand it.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]DT is the foundation of your WC loop. The better your DT,  the cooler your chips are. In water-cooling DT is simply the difference  between the ambient air temp and the water temp on the outgoing side of  the rad. Room temp vs. water temp, that's it. You can't remove all the  heat nor can you go below ambient room temp. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]When you boot up a powered off, water-cooled PC, the water  temp AND your CPU are at room temp. You boot the PC up, the chip gets  hot FAST, almost instantly. The water moves over the chip, it begins to  remove heat, the heat goes to the radiator, and SOME of the heat is  removed. Not all can be removed. You have to know thermodynamics theory  deeply (more than me) to know exactly why. The water begins to warm up  slowly, and in time, the water reaches a balance, an equilibrium is  reached. Heat is made and heat removed, the loop is stabilized, temps  will not change. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]If you change the room temp, the load, or your fan speed  the loop needs to readjust. This is where we like to measure our cooling  ability. usually 30 minutes at a stable load is long enough to begin to  measure. If you increase your cooling capability, the water WILL get  cooler. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Water temps in a stabilized loop, amazingly, are very  similar anywhere in the loop. Only 2-3C MAX difference between the  radiator out temp and the CPU out temp. Remember, the water can't remove  all the heat, some is transferred to the air. Your radiator size,  efficiency and fans play a big part in this. Look at it this way, it's a  system built on many parts and within the laws of physics. Every part  affects the other.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Let's talk about what a good DT  is.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]A CPU loop needs good DT. Under 10C is just fine, getting  closer to 5C is very nice and important if you want big overclocks.  Getting under 5C is just overdoing it, unless you're very extreme, need  it for benching or just want to do it. On an average CPU loop shoot for  under 10C and adjust your overclocks to be fine under the temps  suggested by the makers.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]A GPU loop used to be fine with a 15 to 20C DT. If you're a  big overclocker on your GPUs, then shoot for 15C or lower. The Voltage  Regulator Modules (VRM) on these new cards can be affected by temps. If  you've got a GTX 280 like me, don't worry about it, it's the 5970s and  the 480s and other really hot cards that can have this issue. So a lower  DT for a GPU loop if your a big overclocker might be needed. Thats up  to you as you design your setup.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]So, how do you calculate all of  this?[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]Use a bit of math, deciphering some graphs, it's easy!  LOL, jk. Took me more than a few attempts to figure it out, but you can  easily do it with help. Thanks to Martin (retired) and Skinnee we have  the data. Bless them.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Let's go with my CPU standard of 250 watts and this link.  Link to it please, then go to page 4. Read it all when you get a  chance.[/COLOR]
 
[URL="http://www.skinneelabs.com/hwlabs-sr1360.html?page=4"][COLOR=silver]http://www.skinneelabs.com/hwlabs-sr1360.html?page=4[/COLOR][/URL]
[COLOR=silver]This is a quality radiator with low fins per inch, great  for low RPM, low noise fans.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Go to the second chart, use the RED line. It's a good  quality, popular, well performing fan at 1407 RPM, good middle ground.  At the bottom of the chart find 250 watts, go up to the red line. WOW We  have a 5.5 DT, very nice. Remember my comment about a CPU likes low DT  but a GPU doesn't need it as much? Let's toss a 250 watt GPU into the  same loop, your at 500 watts now. Res-Pump-Rad-CPU-GPU type loop. Look  what happens to the DT, it's over 11DT now. Your CPU isn't happy  anymore, but the GPU is just fine. In this case you're under radded and  need to split the loop or get your DT under control with more fannage,  better radiators/more radiators, better fans. More heat removal  basically.[/COLOR]
 
[SIZE=2][COLOR=silver][B]Remember this?[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]
 
[COLOR=silver]1. Your budget[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]2. Acceptable noise levels[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]3. What can you fit in your case[/COLOR]
[COLOR=silver]4. Expected cooling capability meaning low temps or  acceptable temps [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]In many situations splitting the loop is so much easier to  keep temps under control. You can only put so much in one loop.  Splitting the loop means having one fully separate loop for the CPU and  one for the GPUs. Two pumps, two rad setups, two reses etc. It was  uncommon a few years ago unless you had 2+ GPUs. Now the GPUs are  incredibly hot and it's slowly becoming the norm. It costs more, keeping  the CPU temp low on it's own loop and having a higher DT loop just for  the GPU. [/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Sorry, but many of us do have a massive GPU setup these  days. You wanna play right with water-cooling? You pay. You can easily  go past your budget once you start. It's amazing what a proper  water-cooling setup costs.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Lots start out with the wrong radiator type or much too  little radiator. Some think they can live with the high speed fans to  compensate for too small rads, but end up buying another radiator and  trying to fit it in the case. Many times you just have to accept your  beloved case isn't going to work, or you're going to have to hang rads  on the outside, or even make a separate rad box. You can't trick physics  and think you don't need all the radiators you actually do  need.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]In summary, do your homework, plan for your rig and the 1  year out rig. You see another GPU in crossfire? Plan now.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Your DT matters, it's worth the effort to  understand.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR=silver]Thanks to all the input from many OCF members to get this  cleaned up for Sticky use. I hope it guides many new folks to making the  right choices.[/COLOR][/PLAIN]
 
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pasted the whole thing into ms word and poked the grammar. no massive changes just the odd subtle mistakes :)
also put a double space after the full stops but the forum formatting seems to remove them after posting - my last IT trainer would be dooin a blue funk at that #Laughs# (we parted sure that I wasnt safe in an office enviroment #Laughs#)
 
I'm working on putting this into a front page article in Conumdrum's name. Editing now, then will get some other eyes on it. Hoping to get it out early'ish next week and added to the sticky post. Great work fellas!
 
I think we are mostly good to go for the frontpage, except we need to find support for the heat output claims since we are stating exact numbers. Stating exact numbers, and not having a reference to support the numbers, is not something we want to do:

for example, I remember a Q6600 at 3.9 was 150 watts MAX. An i7 at 4.0 is 250 watts. Right now, as I type, my i7 965 stock is at 80 watts. My peak load is 340 watts, but for a very, very short time. So take the min/max with a grain of salt. These are max testing loads, so real world is a bit lower if you're a big gamer. I'm making a point, it's a lot of heat and you need to remove it. I use 250 watts as my stress wattage for calculations on MY chip.

If its not right, people will use us as a reference, and we'll be misleading people - if it is right, we should be able to offer supporting evidence, and make it a stronger statement.
 
Here is the crux of the matter. Every chip has a different heat output. The readers have to work it out a bit. I did state it's not an exact science by any means. If you want to go with some specifics, you'll have to know the votages, the overclock (if one, I don't), and the chip itself. Watercooling isn't an exact science, and there is some fudging on the exact heat created. The folks who did the GPU wattage lists we link to here did a fine job, but I don't know of one for CPUs.

....................................................

Determining your heat-load isn't a perfect science.

You'll find numbers all over the place from what you have learned from reading lots of info, Googling terms like "heat-load i7 965", "AMD xxx", "Q6600 overclocked", etc. Reading 3-7 pages of Google, and following links within the Google links and the many links here, you should have an idea of what wattage you create in your PC furnace.


CPU heat-load

for example, I remember a Q6600 at 3.9 was 150 watts MAX. An i7 at 4.0 is 250 watts. Right now, as I type, my i7 965 stock is at 80 watts. My peak load is 340 watts, but for a very, very short time. So take the min/max with a grain of salt. These are max testing loads, so real world is a bit lower if you're a big gamer. I'm making a point, it's a lot of heat and you need to remove it. I use 250 watts as my stress wattage for calculations on MY chip.

..................................

I use 250 watts as my stress wattage on MY chip.
 
Alright, so there isn't math which can be used to calculate those CPU Heat-load numbers with a sense of accuracy?

That's fine. However, in the article we want to say this part differently:

for example, I remember a Q6600 at 3.9 was 150 watts MAX. An i7 at 4.0 is 250 watts. Right now, as I type, my i7 965 stock is at 80 watts.

"An i7 at 4.0 is 250 watts" is saying that's what the values are, and thats not really what the values are. That's an approximation that you've observed to be generally accepted as somewhat accurate.

Prior to publishing, we want to make sure on things like that we are presenting it for what it is - an approximation. I don't think that is clear with the current wording - you are an authority, so if you say it is something, I'm going to believe it is something because I don't know how to confirm it for myself. But if you say exactly "its an approximation", I'll understand there's some fudge factor in there and take it for what it is without any misconceptions.

Capiche?
 
Yep! Let it sit a day or two, I got a few PM's out and maybe we can get some references. Or a better way to say it. Almost there.

Hehe, I might know how to read a chart, but I'm not an expert on the heatloads. It's from many years on forums, reading and jelling it all together. You know what I mean, we all get that mass of jelly in the head where answers can be spit out and they are kinda correct.

Your right, saying i7 at 4.0 IS 250 watts should not be included, it is a statement, and inferred to be right.
 
Cool - I think the point you make is demonstrated well there, but if the wording is just tweaked the meaning is preserved while being much more clear... While not saying anything inaccurate. Glad you "get it".

This article is shaping up to be something I'd really LOVE to see a lot more of on the frontpage - and not just from watercooling. Good how-to and explanatory content is what the forum is great at, and its something we can do better in layman's terms than most any site out there. A single writer would be hard pressed to produce something as high quality and vetted as this article. It's really a good read. :thup:
 
no worries. you've always helped me with my watercooling questions so it was a pleasure to be able to help you.
 
Alright, so there isn't math which can be used to calculate those CPU Heat-load numbers with a sense of accuracy?

There is... (flow rate * dT across the component * 265), and we (SL) are making sure we have the instrumentation in place to accomplish this for all future testing, something we just plain overlooked prior.
 
you mean no more sticking your pinky finger in the rad and "approximating" it?!?!?!??!!!!!!

ok so after working a double and then going to the gym my sense of humor only gets worse!
 
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