First time setting up watercooling, question about fans

[DeathScytheVT]

Hey guys, I've been reading around a bit on watercooling since it caught my interest a while ago, and am working on making a new computer at the end of the summer or so and am planning to watercool it.

System specs:
CPU -> AMD A64 3500+ Venice Core @2.2Ghz
GPU -> ATI Radeon X800XL (Unless somebody can convince me NVIDIA is better, I like my ATI's so far)
Case -> Looking at getting a modded Chenbro Genie , the mod being the 2 120mm fan holes in the front. Any thoughts?

I've pieced together this so far:
Rad -> Black Ice Extreme II
Res -> 5 1/4" Bay
Pump -> Swiftech MCP350 (Is there a difference between this and the DD pump?)
CPU Block -> Swiftech MCW6000-64
OR
DD TDX block
GPU Block -> DD Maze-4-1 GPU block

Few questions about it:
-First, is there any difference between the Swiftech pump and the DD pump? The pics and specs all look very similar, for about the same price.
-Which is the better waterblock? The Swiftech is cheaper, though kind of bland looking (looks aren't everything though, I want functionality). I've also heard that the lucite tops for waterblocks can be a bit weaker, and while they look cool, will give out eventually.
-Is there an advantage to having a 3 barb block instead of 2?

And finally the fan questions:
-For the radiator fans: 2 or 4? I've heard some people say to have a fan on each side of the radiator, one to push and one to pull... is there any real advantage to this?
-Is there an easy way to control all the fans? I would like to be able to turn the fans down when the comp isn't in use, unless i'm mistaken in thinking that 4x120mm fans will get a bit loud.
-3-pin fan plugs or 4-pin? I don't see any 3-pin on my PSU, so i'm wondering what the practicality of having a 3-pin is? MoBo plugs?

Hope you guys can help ^_^

 

[Acurax]

-First, is there any difference between the Swiftech pump and the DD pump? The pics and specs all look very similar, for about the same price.

No difference...

-Which is the better waterblock? The Swiftech is cheaper, though kind of bland looking (looks aren't everything though, I want functionality). I've also heard that the lucite tops for waterblocks can be a bit weaker, and while they look cool, will give out eventually.

The swiftech block has the edge in performance, but it sure is ugly.
See here: http://www.procooling.com/html/pro_testing.php

Get a fan controller. Check around, lots of places have em (frozencpu, svc, etc.). Find one with like 18W+ per channel and you can run 2 120mm's per channel. Provides control to adjust noise level, and a place to plug them all in.

 

[Craptacualr]

This Site provides an awesome tool for comparing blocks. Lower DeltaT is better on that graph . Go ahead and compare some curves and see for yourself.

There is no advantage to a 3-barb block other than they are somewhat more of a pain in the arse to route the tubes

As for the radiator, it depends on what youre trying to accomplish. If you just want a good overclock with good temps and low noise, 2 fans is plenty. But if you're a tweaking perfectionist which wants to really push the envelope then go for 4 fans. Bottom line, its a lot of hassle for a not very significant performance gain (~1-3C change probably with the blocks and radiator sizes you're talking about).

Always use 4-pin connecters wherever possible, and you can drop the voltage with Rehostats that you can buy at Radio shack, or you can look around for fan controllers pre-made, theres a lot out there.

 

[Senater_Cache]

except more noise, a push/pull (4 fan) setup wont do much...mayeb 1C at best.
There was an established number for the difference between push/pull and single fan setups...IIRC it was under .5C ...someone else please step in with the proper data, thanks.

SenC.

 

[Fighter2a]

That case looks good for a 120mmx2 radiator . If you want low noise get the black ice pro 2 and then a fan controler to turn down your fans.

 

[DeathScytheVT]

Why the Pro instead of the Extreme? Not 100% sure on the differences.

Also, will that waterblock work on the ATI video card? I read somewhere that the X800XL doesn't have many waterblocks that fit it.
Edit:: The problem i'm seeing with the ATI cards is the "all-in-wonders", however I've got no idea what an AIW card is. Anybody able to tell?

 

[Craptacualr]

Its my understanding that ATi still uses the 2 year old standard 2-mounting holes they always have for their blocks... Most watercooling retailers make you select your block type and fittings when purchasing either through searching, or in configuring the options for it. DangerDen has it as a configuration option on their maze4 gpu block and the swiftech mcw-50 comes standard with the ATi version with other mounting kits optional.

 

[Craptacualr]

AIW cards means "all in wonder". Those cards have an integrated TV tuner, dual monitor support, and lots of other goodies. If you just have a straight x800XL, go ahead and get either the DangerDen Maze4.

 

[DeathScytheVT]

Ok, so the ones that just have the normal VGA output, S-Video and the funny-lookin one (Honestly forgot what its called, little square pin-holes instead of round ones) should be fine?

 

[Craptacualr]

yup, DVI is the funny lookin one . what model x800XL do you have, or where did you buy it?

 

[DeathScytheVT]

Haven't bought it yet, I'm doing research and planning for one. Have to earn some money over the summer before I can actually begin building. (Poor college student and all).

Was looking at This Rosewell one and this one , if I can ever find out what the difference between them is (and thus which I should purchase).

 

[Craptacualr]

Those are regulars. If you're looking at newegg stuff, down in the spec sheet below the item description there is a column that says VIVO. VIVO = video in video out, which all All in Wonders (AIW's) are. If you're a poor college student dont worry, VIVO's and AIWs wont get past your keen sense for cheaper cards

 

[MVC]

except more noise, a push/pull (4 fan) setup wont do much...mayeb 1C at best.
There was an established number for the difference between push/pull and single fan setups...IIRC it was under .5C ...someone else please step in with the proper data, thanks.

SenC.

You're probably thinking of this chart by pHaestus http://phaestus.procooling.com/shrouds-BIX.GIF where combinations of push/pull and shroud/no shroud were actually tested. The data clearly show what is gained or lost with each configuration--and it isn't much!

 

[Craptacualr]

Thats the data we're looking for

 

[Achilles17]

btw, I wouldnt get the Rosewill card, just because theyre kind of a no-name brand. Spend the extra $6 on the ATI one. For a fan controller, I wholeheartedly recommend the sunbeam rheobus. It doesnt look fancy like some of them do, but it can handle a LOT more fans, and can turn them down much further.

 

[DeathScytheVT]

Alrighty, thanks for all the tips.

As for a radiator, should I get a BIP, or should I go heater core? I'm looking for performance, but if a heatercore's going to be a pain to mount, I'd rather not deal with it.

 

[Knivez]

The difference between BIX's and BIP's are the thickness. BIX's are thicker. If you are looking for performance, and as you said, you are poor like I am. Check out www.voyeurmods.com, and pick up the dual 120mm heatercore. Its $40 I believe, rather than the $100 the BIX would set you back, and most likely has better performance.

 

[Craptacualr]

yeah, as far as performance is concerned, heatercores of the same size are nearly equal in performance. Sometimes the mounting hardware and looks are what people ae looking for in a BIX, but IMO, when you can get a same size heatercore for 1/2 the price, why not right?

 

[itchy5]

yeah, as far as performance is concerned, heatercores of the same size are nearly equal in performance. Sometimes the mounting hardware and looks are what people ae looking for in a BIX, but IMO, when you can get a same size heatercore for 1/2 the price, why not right?

heater cores rock cheap yet effective