Getting away with a randomly placed radiator.

[yoadknux]

Just to follow up on some things that were discussed here: I have found that lowering the pump speed to 67% will make the noise disappear. At this point it did have some effect on the temps (went up by 5 degrees on Valley) so I did not continue those tests. I also tried controlling it through speedfan. I was unable to do so. I don't know if it's because Speedfan is a complete mess or because the pump is a 3 pin (instead of 4 PWM). I was able to control PWM fans in the past.

Overall I am happy with how it worked. The way I mounted the GPU cooler forced me to adjust the airflow in my case. I think I've done the logical things. Previously I had a standard airflow configuration: Front intake, side intake, top exhaust. I've changed it as will be described by the photos:


This is how I mounted the GPU radiator. Ziptie mode FTW. The Push-pull fans are 2x Phobya NB-eLoop, and they're dead silent at ~1000 RPM. Right infront of them (red) are 2x 120mm Corsair fans running at 900RPM. They exhaust hot air out of the case through the front. The air absolutely feels hotter when GPU runs under load, which is a good thing in my book.




The case has two options: magnetic door closed or open. With the door closed there's still enough airflow from the sides to prevent the fans from choking. However, when doing sustained gaming I definetly feel the door getting warmer, so I leave it open most of the time. It doesn't make a big difference.


This is the CPU cooler, the RAM and the GPU beneath it. Nothing special about those, but why not post it anyway?


This is the side intake. I think it mostly contributes to the fresh air that goes into the VRM cooler of the GPU as well as the GPU radiator. The fan runs at 600 RPM and is very silent. However, there is a noise disadvantage with this side fan, it's not the fan itself that is noisy but rather the sound isolation from the components inside the case. Currently the pump rattling sound is the loudest thing in the case. It's not terrible but noticeable if you sit close to the PC on a dead silent room.


This is the top intake, it used to be an exhaust. The thing is that right now most of the side intake contributes to GPU radiator cooling from the side. Also top intake is good if you don't have heat constantly building up in your case. In my situation all of the components are isolated from each other and do not put a lot of heat into the case: PSU has its own fan and a shroud, GPU has its own radiator that exhausts from front-bottom side, CPU has its own radiator that exhausts from top-rear. So the goal with the top exhaust is to cool the MOBO's VRMs, RAM, and help bring some air through the CPU radiator. The fan is in a decent condition but it intakes at 800 RPM through a shroud and a mesh and generates a bit of noise because of it. Sadly it's a molex fan so nothing I can do other than replace the fan. I can probably live without it and save the PC from some dust but I like the way it looks.

If you have suggestions on changing the airflow, let me know!

 

[Dermen]

Speedfan is odd sometimes, did you try a different header?

Speedfan can't control the Fan4 header on my motherboard for some reason (It also can't control CPU1). It works fine for CPU2, Fan1, Fan2, and Fan3 headers. Luckily I had one fan I just run at 100% all the time so I plugged that into Fan4.

 

[yoadknux]

Speedfan is odd sometimes, did you try a different header?

Speedfan can't control the Fan4 header on my motherboard for some reason (It also can't control CPU1). It works fine for CPU2, Fan1, Fan2, and Fan3 headers. Luckily I had one fan I just run at 100% all the time so I plugged that into Fan4.

Looks like you were right buddy! Speedfan can only control the FAN1 header on my motherboard, even though it has 4 + cpu fan. Now I adjusted the pump to be at 60% at 30c and 100% and 55c. Thanks! Now the pump is quiet.
As for the VRM fan, I have VRM heatsinks placed on all parts, I wonder if I can get away with the fan at 700-800 RPM constant. Do you have any experience with that?

 

[EarthDog]

Try it. Everyones enviro is different.

 

[yoadknux]

Try it. Everyones enviro is different.

It currently sits at 750 RPM, and it passed the usual gpu stress tests (valley, heaven, 3dmark...). I do remember that a while back some EVGA cards weren't getting enough cooling on the VRMs and they caught fire, is there a way to monitor VRM temps without reaching that state?

 

[EarthDog]

LOL, that was garbage... but, few GPUs monitor VRM temps...

 

[deathman20]

Considering that most vendors only supply a 120mm radiator with their water solution blocked to the card. Typically these setups do really well, considering how much heat output it can have with a GPU.
Glad results are doing good for you, I know I've considered doing something similar to my 1080TI.

 

[Dermen]

Looks like you were right buddy! Speedfan can only control the FAN1 header on my motherboard, even though it has 4 + cpu fan. Now I adjusted the pump to be at 60% at 30c and 100% and 55c. Thanks! Now the pump is quiet.
As for the VRM fan, I have VRM heatsinks placed on all parts, I wonder if I can get away with the fan at 700-800 RPM constant. Do you have any experience with that?

I ran the VRM fan at 100% because the PC was under my desk and I couldn't hear it (it was the fan plugged into the header speedfan couldn't control). The VRM fan is clicking so I ordered an Arctic F9 PWM fan to replace it and my plan is to have it adjust to temps since I got a new case and am change out most my fans and getting an AIO for the CPU.

I have a GPU fan adapter so I could plug regular PWM fans into the GPU. I was thinking about plugging the VRM fan and GPU radiator fan into it (both fans will be PWM now) but have to check on amperage first. Then mod the bios with a custom fan curve or run MSI Afterburner all the time. I will probably just use MB headers and speedfan though as it is easier.

 

[yoadknux]

I've got one thing to say to you guys... OVERKILL INCOMING. Got it used for 65$. I will mount it later and post results.

I ran the VRM fan at 100% because the PC was under my desk and I couldn't hear it (it was the fan plugged into the header speedfan couldn't control). The VRM fan is clicking so I ordered an Arctic F9 PWM fan to replace it and my plan is to have it adjust to temps since I got a new case and am change out most my fans and getting an AIO for the CPU.

I have a GPU fan adapter so I could plug regular PWM fans into the GPU. I was thinking about plugging the VRM fan and GPU radiator fan into it (both fans will be PWM now) but have to check on amperage first. Then mod the bios with a custom fan curve or run MSI Afterburner all the time. I will probably just use MB headers and speedfan though as it is easier.

I can hear it because it sits next to me. Anyway I was able to lower it to 1000 RPM and everything is fine (it probably was fine at 750 too with the 200mm fan blowing directly onto the gpu). VRM Fan + GPU radiator fan on same gpu header would probably be fine but if you want the safest choice then I recently bought a pretty cheap product that will fit your needs, it's a Noctua NA-FC1 mini-fan controller. The idea is that it can connect to up to 8 PWM fans, it connects to power via sata (or molex) and it also connects to a 4 pwm header, where the header can read any custom profile. This way you apply your pre-defined profile into any PWM fan without worrying about drawing too much current from the header. Additionally it has a built in knob that can be rotated for manual control.

 

[Dermen]

lol my H105 is arriving today, it is going on my CPU though.

I looked at my GPU stock fans and the two combined are .8A. My rad + vrm fan are .35a combined so there is plenty if I want to go that route. I'm guessing I could even run the pump as well and have all the GPU stuff running off the GPU header.

EDIT: The H105 pump is a lot louder than the H55 pump. Also the fans are crazy, because they are monster 2700RPM fans. 760RPM is the lowest they will run for me.

 

[yoadknux]

Yes, I connected it as well without mounting it and immediately noticed the water noise emitted from it and possibly a rattling noise, anyway it is indeed louder. The fans can be turned down pretty easily for me. As for mounting the H105 on my GPU, it's hard because if doesn't even fit where the former HDD bay used to be located. The only thing I can do is remove the side fan and somehow mount the radiator and even then it will not fully breath. I have to buy a new case or the H105 is gonna sit in a closet... I will probably still post some results on the H105 at some point.

 

[Tech Tweaker]

So... 1x120mm for a 250w card??? Not sure how well that will work out...

Better than you would think.

I liquid cooled my 250W EVGA SSC (ACX 2.0 cooler) GTX 780 Ti with a Corsair HG10 N780 with an H75 mounted to it (similar to H55, just with one more fan IIRC). Stock cooler it was at 77°C max when gaming, then with the H75 and dual-fans both at full speed I maxed out at 60°C while gaming. It's worth noting though that the liquid cooler doesn't cool the VRM, so that probably reduces the heat-load some.

 

[maxfly]

Yes, I connected it as well without mounting it and immediately noticed the water noise emitted from it and possibly a rattling noise, anyway it is indeed louder. The fans can be turned down pretty easily for me. As for mounting the H105 on my GPU, it's hard because if doesn't even fit where the former HDD bay used to be located. The only thing I can do is remove the side fan and somehow mount the radiator and even then it will not fully breath. I have to buy a new case or the H105 is gonna sit in a closet... I will probably still post some results on the H105 at some point.

thats a drag. ive gone thru trying to find enough room for rads(it sucks). i ended up going with the case in my sig and havent looked back. once you find the right case youll be golden. cases and monitors are the two components i dont scrounge on anymore. essentially your going to have those two components thru multiple builds if your like most of us at OCF so get what you want not what you have to settle for is my advice.
the good news is there are ton of really solid cases that will allow for multiple rads without breaking the bank. newegg is a good place to start looking. they have lots of pics and you can filter by price as well as a million other variables. look for Blaylocks sig. he has a list of really good cases and can tell you alot about them.

 

[Dermen]

The newer cases are great for mounting radiators. I don't know if the newer case designs without all the drive bays came about to fit AIOs or if it was because they finally realized people don't run a dozen drives. When I bought my last case I was frustrated that cases had all these drive bays blocking airflow and taking up 1/3 of the case when I only ran a single 3.5" HDD.

After running the H105 for a day I'm going to return it. If the pump was just humming along it would be fine but it makes a buzzing sound, which seems to be a common complaint with the H105.

 

[maxfly]

you might try a quick and dirty method of creating a duct for your gpu rad. leave your gpu rad where it is. take a piece of cardboard and just make a duct/tunnel from the top 120mm fan to your rad. wrap it in black duct tape. seal the ends up to the fan frames and boom your maximizing your cooling capacity for pennies and it wont look all that bad either.

The newer cases are great for mounting radiators. I don't know if the newer case designs without all the drive bays came about to fit AIOs or if it was because they finally realized people don't run a dozen drives. When I bought my last case I was frustrated that cases had all these drive bays blocking airflow and taking up 1/3 of the case when I only ran a single 3.5" HDD.

i think your on the money on both counts. they had to adapt to all of the aios people are now using and with the popularity of ssds. with ssds making up a majority of main single drives with another single large hdd for storage. they did away with most of the space eating hdd bays. or in the case of my x71. they allow you to easily remove all of them.

 

[yoadknux]

Guys, thanks for the comments.

I'm still considering whether I really want a new case or not. I can afford it, and I found some cases that look interesting and could fit a 280mm rad, such as Fractal Design R5 and Be Quiet 800. They also look nice and should give be much better at sound isolation.

But of course there is a trade-off here, I am sure without any doubt that the current cooling configuration is efficient because I can FEEL the hot air emitted out of the case both from the front (which exhausts the GPU rad) and the back (which exhausts the CPU rad). I don't think either of the new cases will be able to match those temperatures.

Then there's the rebuilding part, which is quite a lot of work. Getting a new case means you do not only have to build a new machine but take apart the older one. I'm usually fine with changes if they seem like the fundamentally right thing to do: For example taking the card apart and removing the air cooler and putting the water cooler took some work, but it obviously paid off. But changing the side fan into a blocked/windowed panel does NOT seem like cooling wise the right thing to do to an overclocked system.

There is also a final point here, which is: My current radiator keeps games at 55c. I haven't seen the core clock throttle once, well maybe during a 3h repeat run of 3dmark timespy extreme it peaked at 63c, but not at TW3, not at AC:O, and of course not on games like OW and HOTS. So there isn't a real problem to solve here, but I MIGHT create a new problem in placing the H105 in because it's a lot louder than the H55 and more difficult to quiet down. I'm not sure if the H105 overall thermal*noise beats the H55 thermal*noise, so I'm in for A LOT of work that will cost money and may not net better results.

Science wise it's the right thing to do, but going back to my current configuration will not be as easy

 

[Dermen]

I get it, rebuilding a PC takes some time. It probably took me 4 hours to get everything in my new Phanteks P300. Routing all the cables so they are hidden is a pain. Then I went and got an H105 and had to change it, then change it back when I removed it.

I got the H105 pump to be quiet by running it at 1500rpm (same as H55 stock), or about 55% speed on the header. Then I read Corsair says running it at less than 12v can damage the pump. I could have replaced the fans but I don't want to damage the pump just to have it not buzz. The newer H100iv2 has a PWM pump but Corsair only lets you run it at 2 speeds, it also isn't compatible with Kraken G10/G12. I think if I get another 240mm AIO it will be the Fractal Celsius S24. It has a completely controllable PWM pump, built in PWM fan header on the radiator, fans will run as low as 500rpm, has great reviews, 5yr warranty like Corsair, and even has standard fittings so you have the option to open the loop to add to it. It also uses the standard mounting so it could be used with the Kraken G10/12 bracket.

 

[yoadknux]

I get it, rebuilding a PC takes some time. It probably took me 4 hours to get everything in my new Phanteks P300. Routing all the cables so they are hidden is a pain. Then I went and got an H105 and had to change it, then change it back when I removed it.

I got the H105 pump to be quiet by running it at 1500rpm (same as H55 stock), or about 55% speed on the header. Then I read Corsair says running it at less than 12v can damage the pump. I could have replaced the fans but I don't want to damage the pump just to have it not buzz. The newer H100iv2 has a PWM pump but Corsair only lets you run it at 2 speeds, it also isn't compatible with Kraken G10/G12. I think if I get another 240mm AIO it will be the Fractal Celsius S24. It has a completely controllable PWM pump, built in PWM fan header on the radiator, fans will run as low as 500rpm, has great reviews, 5yr warranty like Corsair, and even has standard fittings so you have the option to open the loop to add to it. It also uses the standard mounting so it could be used with the Kraken G10/12 bracket.

Damn, that sucks, that's exactly what I'm afraid of, doing a lot of work for the H105 just to change it back because it's too loud.
There is also a tricky part here, I need a case that can fit a large GPU such as the 1080ti in length, but also fit a front 240mm radiator, but it cannot be too big because the H105 tubes aren't very long and the waterblock is located on the back of the card. Fractal R5 I think is just right in terms of size, but it doesn't have a side intake/window. Be quiet is excellent in terms of noise isolation but front rad will be blocked. Finally the last case I've been considering is nzxt phantom 820, that can support a... wait for it... bottom 240mm radiator. It does raise some questions however as to whether it can efficietnly exhaust through the bottom, but compatibility wise I think that's exactly what I need.

By the way, for those wondering about overclocking:


2063 (core)/5805 (memory) stable. Superposition is a very soft benchmark, so I stress tested 3dmark TimeSpy extreme - usually a good indicator to a gpu stability - passed. Temps were higher though, 64 max, i could feel the heat coming out of the case.

 

[yoadknux]

Got an update. I stayed home today, and I saw the H105 box looking at me, and I looked back, and... one thing led to another... err...


which of course became...



Looks good on paper. Not so much in practice. Might have to use the G word...



I plugged 3 fans: Push-Pull where I could and push on the other side. Obviously not an optimal configuration... but the results were even more disappointing than I thought.

1. This thing makes more noise than a garden hose!!! It's even worse than I thought. I have to say that A LOT of it depends on the orientation of the tubes and how much pressure is applied on them. I think this pump hates being directed downwards (on a GPU) and does better when it's vertical (on a CPU).
2. Thermal contact was a lot worse, not sure if I haven't mounted it properly or not enough/too much compound or something else... temps were sky high, jumped to 60 within seconds when the benchmark started, so I quit at that moment.

There were also a lot of "GPU is dead" moments, i.e. no signal, then the I got it to post after a few resets and I saw artifacts on the POST screen, a white screen, etc... I think that this cumbersome tubing/radiator have interfered with the GPU power cables or even sagged the GPU to the point it held firmly by the motherboard.

Anyway, plugged the H55 back, everything is working. Disappointing but there's that. Not gonna switch a case now

 

[Dermen]

I would guess you had air in the pump. The coolers have a little bit of air in them and you have the pump as the highest point so the air will collect there. That would explain the noise and the poor results. I read a few stories of people having problems trying to mount an AIO on the bottom of the case with a G10/12.

I would say the optimal setup would be to have a case with room to put the CPU rad on top and the GPU rad on the back both as exhaust. Then have front/bottom intakes. Or have two 120mm rads and mount them both on the front.