Network + Certification, How to get it? Trainsigna;

[SuperDave1685]

lol its just for us Marines brother ... sorry

 

[TempliNocturnus]

How did this work for you? Did you just watch the Videos for the CCNA, or you did some book reading with it? & is 397 a good price for these videos? The Network + Videos only cost me 297.

I went through most of the CCENT vids right before I deployed. Didn't get a chance to take the exam before I left. I know Cisco put out a new CCNA exam that's a bit harder than the old one; I know two people who've taken it and failed.

As for the trainsignal CCENT videos, I'm positive that you can watch them all and still fail the exam. But if you actually listen to what Chris Bryant says and practice all those subnetting exercises religiously, then you shouldn't do too bad. There are two ways to get CCNA: take the CCNA exam or take the two ICND exams. I'd suggest doing the two ICND. The price for the trainsignal videos are pretty steep. I'd suggest trying to get your employer to get them or split the cost with a friend.

If you're in the military or work for the government, you probably have access to similar stuff SuperDave has. In the Air Force, we have access to Skillsoft for training videos/interactive courses, and Books24x7 for online reading material.

 

[dropadrop]

but I might try Security + first.

I've done Security+ and got through with fairly good results.

However I found it pretty confusing. Seems no textbook contains all the information needed in the exam, most people recommend reading two books (I only read one but have quite long experience in IT). I did not find the exam to be especially difficult, but it requires you to remember a lot of information that I find pretty useless - that is, you will forget it pretty quickly after the exam, and find it with google when you need it. A lot of the questions where also worded in a very strange way.

Note, I did the old exam, I don't think that's an option any more, the new one might be more sensible. I also think the exam covers quite a lot of good general knowledge and recommend it to somebody interested in working in security but not having a good picture in what kind of things are involved.

 

[MechX2]

Wow thanks for all the great responses, Seems like whatever I choose to do, I'm gonna have to do some serious studying before taking the exam. I think Security + Will be easier than CCNA, just because since I will go for it immediately after Network +, things might be easier to stick. Thanks for all the help!

 

[TempliNocturnus]

Wow thanks for all the great responses, Seems like whatever I choose to do, I'm gonna have to do some serious studying before taking the exam. I think Security + Will be easier than CCNA, just because since I will go for it immediately after Network +, things might be easier to stick. Thanks for all the help!

Sec+ will help you out if you plan on doing IT work for the government/DoD, but I doubt it's nearly as useful in the private sector. If you really want to get into networking, go for your Net+ for now then dedicate a huge chunk of your time for the next 6 - 12 months on studying for the CCNA. Sec+ will probably slow you down more than anything right now.

If you're pretty knowledgeable with computer hardware already, I'd suggest getting your A+. Having Net+ and A+ should help you get an entry level IT job which will get you valuable experience. Then you could knock out the CCNA and get a better job or a raise.

 

[SuperDave1685]

I think thats what my plan of action is going to be Templi. I'm going to get my Certificate in Infrastructure Security Systems and then my Bachelors in IT. While working on my certificate, I plan on also starting on my CompTIA Net+. Maybe even A+, as I'm fairly knowledgeable with hardware.

 

[dropadrop]

Yeah, security+ does not have very much useful info for IT, rather general knowlage for Security. It's kind of a mini CISSP covering a lot of the same topics (without as much depth) but leaving a few areas out.

The IT part is more about learning what ports different services use, differences in encryption etc. It's stuff you will mostly forget unless you are actually working with it frequently, and stuff you will find out with Google fairly quickly if need be (part of the encryption stuff in interesting though).

I recommend it to somebody interested in Security as a field but without a lot of knowledge as it's still fairly easy and covers a lot of stuff (even if it's just skimming). However if somebody wanted to learn IT related things I would look at something more practical. I guess the certificate could be useful elsewhere (actually more useful outside the security field since it's regarded as a very "newbie" cert in regard to security).

 

[SuperDave1685]

Thanks dropadrop. I'm just wanting to get into the IT industry period. Not sure if I want to do security related things (such as work for the DOD) or network administrator type things. So I figured it'd be best get get a little of everything so I have a good base understanding and then I can branch off and build upon what I've learned to apply it to my field of choice.

Here is the link to the certificate course - undergraduate-certificate-in-it-infrastructure-security

and here is the link to the Bachelor's degree program - bachelor-of-science-in-information-technology

 

[dropadrop]

That "undergraduate certificate in it infra security" looks pretty interesting, and as something I would hold as a huge bonus for anyone applying for a job in our IT department.

 

[Jorlain]

Honestly, there's not much to the Net+ exam. Know your OSI model, and what works where. Have an understanding of of thinnet, thicknet, fiber, ethernet, et cetera, and their respective connectors. Get familiar with IP addressing and Subnetting. Know your topologies. Know your common ports, and what makes use of said ports. Get a book with a focal aim of taking the Net+. Mike Meyers is a great author, though I don't know how old his latest edition is.

Net+ is more or less theory and fundamentals. Don't let it scare you. Besides the A+, it's the easiest cert to acquire.

 

[MechX2]

Thats awsome Jorlain! You really just gave me a great glance at how prepared I should be for the exam, I just got a couple videos left and I'm done with the TrainSignal course for Net+, I think I might pick up Mike Meyers Passport Guide to Networking and skim through it, I remember reading one a while back and at the end of every chapter it had mini quizzes, Hopefully I should be ready by the end of next week to ace the exam. To me A+ seems to be a harder exam, not that anything in it is difficult to understand, but that you need to memorize old outdated technology that takes more effort to stick than Net+ yet again I could be wrong. Also I agree with SuperDave, Templi has a good point now that its mentioned, I though Security+ would be a good next step after Net+ but since you can probably get the same work in the private sector with just the Net+ Cert its probably not worth the trouble to get the Security+ unless called on.

 

[dropadrop]

Yeah, I'd say the only reason for the security+ might be if you where one of two people left running for a job. They might pick the one with a security cert if they felt all other things where equal (but could you get an even more useful cert with the same effort is the important question).

 

[Jorlain]

One thing to keep in mind, though, is that in industry they generally interchange certs for experience. For instance, if you have an AAS degree in an IT field (network administration for instance) and a Net+, they'd consider that 3 years experience. So, with the AAS, Net+, Security+, and A+, that could feasibly be 5 years of experience, depending on what they consider the A+ to be. If you're going to get into networking, the A+ is really only beneficial when trying to break into the industry.

For anyone trying to break into the industry, I'd suggest an A+, a Net+, and an MCTS in either Vista or Windows XP. Most of my friends and colleagues started with said certs, and have done very well. From that point, you need to determine whether you're going to go the Cisco route or the Microsoft route. Right now, Microsoft is in demand, but it flip-flops every so often. Likely in a few years Cisco will be the bigger demand again. Either way you choose, stick to one side or the other. Create a goal and stick with it.

After you break into the industry, and work your way up the chain by getting more certs, gathering more knowledge, and making more connections, you'll likely be in a position where you'll be working for a company that will either A) Reimburse you for the money you pay on your certs, or B) Pay for them flat out. This is where you should take the opportunity to max out as many certs as you can.

Another thing to note, that once you get to this point, don't be afraid to change jobs. If your current job doesn't want to pay you what you feel you are worth, there is someone out there that will. Do not be afraid to move. If you are willing to move, your payscale will continue to rise, and you won't be as restricted while moving up the chain of command.

 

[MechX2]

Theres alot of Certs out there, and I'm sure if I set a plan of action and stand by it that every few months I can obtain a new cert. As far as what you were saying as industry leaders, Microsoft vs Cisco, I think Microsoft is probably the more logical way considering they seem to have so much private business's backing them, but I feel Cisco would probably a little easier to obtain.

 

[Jorlain]

Cisco certifications are actually very, very difficult to obtain. I'd rather take 10 CompTIA certs than 1 Cisco cert. Cisco folk that have obtained their CCIE are some of the highest paid individuals in the IT field. However, approximately 20,000 people in the world have obtained a CCIE, likely due to the difficulty.

 

[MechX2]

Wow I would have never guessed. But if your one of 20,000 with a CCIE, than I guess that really opens up some SERIOUS doors for you. Maybe worth locking yourself in a room for 4-5 months.

 

[SuperDave1685]

lol a little more than a few months. Hopefully one day I can make that number 20,001 I cna't wait to get out and start my career in IT

 

[dropadrop]

Another thing to note, that once you get to this point, don't be afraid to change jobs. If your current job doesn't want to pay you what you feel you are worth, there is someone out there that will. Do not be afraid to move. If you are willing to move, your payscale will continue to rise, and you won't be as restricted while moving up the chain of command.

I have to disagree here. I prefer to work on interesting projects in a nice environment with less pay and no possibility for certification then on something boring or in a bad environment.

I was just offered a job paying 30% more then my current one with the possibility to get a few interesting certs but turned it down because I felt I would have less interesting challenges.

Think 10 years down the line.

edit:

I would also like to add, that I can't believe somebody is contemplating between Microsoft and Cisco certs and what jobs they will get you. The carrier paths are very different, the jobs you would work are very different. It's not quite like contemplating between a redhat or microsoft certification.

 

[MechX2]

That makes sense but lets be honest here, a job that pays more is most likely going to be more difficult? arise more situations, have a bigger network to work with? I dunno what kind of job you were offered and the difference in your current job from it but realistically how often does something like that happen?
Secondly your saying you don't know how something could be contemplating over CISCO & Microsoft, but again, someone who is new to the spectrum would not know the difference in the fields? Just because someone doesn't know doesn't mean much, obviously I would like to further my education, but I created this post to help guide me down the path of the rights certs to achieve. Right now to me the difference in career choices for CISCO vs Microsoft are nothing other than what your operating with, the job in my mind is similar.

I have to disagree here. I prefer to work on interesting projects in a nice environment with less pay and no possibility for certification then on something boring or in a bad environment.

I was just offered a job paying 30% more then my current one with the possibility to get a few interesting certs but turned it down because I felt I would have less interesting challenges.

Think 10 years down the line.

edit:

I would also like to add, that I can't believe somebody is contemplating between Microsoft and Cisco certs and what jobs they will get you. The carrier paths are very different, the jobs you would work are very different. It's not quite like contemplating between a redhat or microsoft certification.

 

[dropadrop]

Sorry, I did not mean for that to come out in a negative way.

Payment is not always related to how difficult the job is. I would actually say my current job is more difficult, but the one offered is just a different company (and more related to sales even if indirectly). It can be hard to get a big raise without changing to another company, and I've been with this one for a long time. However I'm not one to change companies just for a better pay. Even though I've been working in this field for a long time, I am convinced it's better to pick the job where you learn more rather then the one that pay's more. Once you feel you don't have a lot to give, then go to the one that pay's more (and again pick one where you get more out of the company then just compensation). Certs are nice, but you really learn from doing things so I won't pick a job based on that either.

I think networking is very interesting. There is however a risk of landing in a place that has a very narrow scope. Big enterprises tend to "departmentize" things quite efficiently, and if you are unlucky you'll end up in a team that just opens and closes switch ports all day long. However if you are lucky you will end up planning network architectures which is IMO more interesting then maintaining Windows servers (especially after the novelty runs out).

Most IT departments are strung pretty tight these day's. It's annoying when you don't have time to do things properly even when you would know how to... Anyway, sorry for the blabbering.