Ryzen2 rumoured to have up to 16 Cores

[Woomack]

I wouldn't call it beta testing. Maybe for the new materials such as the case for Zen 1 going to 14nm and Zen 2 going to 7nm. But outside of that, the logic and architecture is tested extensively during production phases. However, as we have made these newer processor architecture advancements, our ability to do full test coverage has dramatically decreased. I'm not aware of the coverage percentage Intel and AMD target for testing purposes on their new architectures, but from personal experience in hardware it could range from 60 to 80%. But I wouldn't be surprised if it is lower. Intel's Skylynx still has bugs coming up and its now 2 gens old.

Point is, we aren't really beta testing anything more than the new materials. The architecture is usually ok, but like you said Woomack, if they slowed down just a bit than we would see higher grade CPUs come out. Give me a $1000 CPU every 5 years but at least test it for several years before releasing it.

When I said about beta testing then I didn't mean technology in general. I know how it works. What just surprises me is how couple of years ago we could get quite good products with long internal tests ( Intel was testing some products for 18 months as their rep told me couple of years ago ) and now we get products like Ryzen line where a lot was promissed but we got most of that after 10 AGESA updates and additional fixes. I will only say memory compatibility and that Ryzen loves high memory frequency. Till this year we couldn't really see memory kits above 3200 on Ryzen or compatibility with non-Samsung IC above some frequency. Still 3600 is nearly impossible to stabilize on most motherboards.
The same is in Intel. Some updates were not tested right and some BIOS releases had to be removed because WiFi didn't work or were other issues. Some specifications were changed not long before premiere because not everything was working right. Functionality of some devices changed. Things like VROC were a total fail. Intel for a year since release couldn't say what works with what. In the end their partners were creating their own compatibility lists and said that only Intel SSD work so they won't have problems with returns.
I'm in contact with ASRock and some others regarding all that stuff so I sometimes hear things which are not meant to be spread in public. Each year we see more issues related to not enough internal tests and too fast premieres of hardware which is clearly not ready for that. So yes, we are testing many things because manufacturers had no time for that.
I can add AMD APU premiere to the list. Next fail and big problems for AMD partners. AMD didn't want to release AGESA earlier so users had problems with motherboards and partners wasted time and money on beta BIOS updates in last days before premiere. This BIOS was supporting APU but wasn't tunned right so on many motherboards were various problems.

So again. They could release less products and not so often but everything could be better prepared. There is barely any competition on the market so why Intel releases so many new processors in last years ? This is stupid. Last year we were in the point when in stores we could still see SL, SL-X, KL, KL-X, CL and some others. Really some stores were selling 6th, 7th and 8th gen chips in the same time.

Too much text, I bet that barely anyone will read that

Re new TR. You can expect OC the same as on Ryzen 2000. It's the same technology, just the same as in 1st gen TR, chips are a bit better so they can boost higher. Considering average OC of 2k Ryzen then I wouldn't count on more than turbo clock on all cores. I will be surprised if we see fully stable 32 cores at clock = turbo.

 

[mackerel]

Generally agree with Woomack's observations. I did read all that On releases, I think we as consumers are part of the problem. We want the new shiny toy, now! Look at the pent up hype for the next gen nvidia GPUs.

 

[Woomack]

Point is that we want because marketing is feeding us with all info about new toys. Additionally there is some competition but I also don't know why Intel cares so much... maybe they see what may happen in 2-3 years. At least I don't expect AMD to release anything that will really beat Intel in next ~2 years.
We want new toys but we don't need them. If these 2-3 manufacturers that count slowed down then we wouldn't see special difference and they could earn money on each product for some longer. Nvidia has now longer break and somehow they are still selling their GTX1000 series cards. We were expecting new GPU long time ago and we will wait for some more.
Intel literally kills their own products with new series and I think it's stupid. Warehouses were full of Z170 mobos, Z270 was released ... some Z270 mobos just had premiere, bang!, full line of Z370 on the market ... I literally got new Z270 mobos for review in one week and the next week were Z370 on the market.

X399 seems to stay on the market for some longer but I'm not sure if AMD had to release 2k TR right now. These chips, no matter how great they are, will not sell. Those users who needed more cores could buy 1k TR and it would cover all their needs. I just feel like AMD looks for attention to be on the front pages for as long as it's possible. Even if they lose on TR then they will sell many lower series products. Still their flagship product will beat Intel in many things ... for sure in price/multithreaded performance.

 

[mackerel]

We're playing on words, but I think anything will sell, just not necessarily in big numbers. They don't have to. These are halo products. They are to show off what is possible, and make the lower models more desirable by association. That is why AMD are making moar cores for everyone, and why Intel don't want to be seen lagging too far in that area.

As for the Intel gen thing, I guess I have that to thank for getting a cheap Z270 Apex. I suppose it is the highest end mobo I've ever owned, with my Z170 Hero a distant second. I look at the Z370 Apex, and think, who buys that? I'm sure it is a good board, it is rather expensive for anything outside extreme overclocking.

 

[EarthDog]

Plenty want overkill motherboards (less than 1% of those need it). Long gone are the days where motherboards really mattered for ambient overclocks.

There are exceptions, but for the most part, features, aesthetics, and price should be purchasing factors.

 

[mackerel]

Plenty want overkill motherboards (less than 1% of those need it). Long gone are the days where motherboards really mattered for ambient overclocks.

There are exceptions, but for the most part, features, aesthetics, and price should be purchasing factors.

Just realised most of the mobos I've bought are on the lower end of the price bracket. Z270 Apex as it was on sale as last gen, Asrock Z370 Pro4, Asrock B450I, X299 Tuf mk2, X370 Prime, well, you get the idea. I think the Z170 Hero was the last one I got that wasn't on the lower end of the price scale, but mobos were also cheaper then. I've found them all "good enough", I know they're not the best. Still need for things to get cooler so I can try doing silly things with the Z270 Apex though... that mobo also gets the award for most RGB lighting, of the ones I own.

 

[Woomack]

APEX is weirdly flashy for an OC board. I was surprised they focused so much on RGB lighting in a mobo like this ... there is even X shape of the PCB
I'm not really buying low-end motherboards. I got the X299 TUF because I haven't seen anything much better in more expensive boards but X299 is high-end even in the cheapest version. If I pick something from lower chipsets than X then I usually look at the general layout, specs and supported memory. Memory OC is one of the only things which are different in most motherboards besides additional devices (WiFi/other controllers).

 

[EarthDog]

I miss the first OC Formula.

 

[Dolk]

Point is that we want because marketing is feeding us with all info about new toys. Additionally there is some competition but I also don't know why Intel cares so much... maybe they see what may happen in 2-3 years. At least I don't expect AMD to release anything that will really beat Intel in next ~2 years.
We want new toys but we don't need them. If these 2-3 manufacturers that count slowed down then we wouldn't see special difference and they could earn money on each product for some longer. Nvidia has now longer break and somehow they are still selling their GTX1000 series cards. We were expecting new GPU long time ago and we will wait for some more.
Intel literally kills their own products with new series and I think it's stupid. Warehouses were full of Z170 mobos, Z270 was released ... some Z270 mobos just had premiere, bang!, full line of Z370 on the market ... I literally got new Z270 mobos for review in one week and the next week were Z370 on the market.

X399 seems to stay on the market for some longer but I'm not sure if AMD had to release 2k TR right now. These chips, no matter how great they are, will not sell. Those users who needed more cores could buy 1k TR and it would cover all their needs. I just feel like AMD looks for attention to be on the front pages for as long as it's possible. Even if they lose on TR then they will sell many lower series products. Still their flagship product will beat Intel in many things ... for sure in price/multithreaded performance.

Point, score, and win! Consumer industry is out of control in the electronic world. We can create so much but whos buying now? Its all inflated because we are told to buy just like the cell phone boom for the last 8 years. It will slow down but as far as I can tell, it won't be for sometime. Eventually we will get to the point where the best CPUs on 5nm or lower will be very expensive but worth to have, while everyday systems will get the 10nm or greater. Each company may be setting up for it, but Intel is absolutely going bonkers on getting new CPUs out. Even the inside groups are all like wtf Intel.

 

[notarat]

If I could get a good overclocking board without all the RGB BS I would jump on it in a heartbeat. Unfortunately, that's not feasible.

There are certain features that are "must-haves" and those are only available on the higher end boards.

Speaking of that...the main reason I wanted the Zenith Extreme was the DIMM-type socket where I could mount 2 SSDs. Now that I've seen the MSI Creation MEG X399 I believe I will get that instead since it holds up to 4 on that card. That necessitates a complete re-design of the cooling system so my "build" is on hold while I source new cooling parts..

 

[EarthDog]

All boards should be able to shut off all RGB.

 

[bigtallanddopey]

All boards should be able to shut off all RGB.

I thought that you could turn off the rgb on most if not all?

 

[EarthDog]

That sounds a lot better!