Solar panels, cheap!

[Evilsizer]

yea SSS i found them a while back, have you seen?
http://store.sundancesolar.com/smalsolpanfo.html
or
http://www.solarbotics.com/solar_cells/
or
http://www.hobbyengineering.com/SectionFS.html
and last
http://scientificsonline.com/category.asp_Q_c_E_421306_A_Solar+Cells
your might find these interesting
http://scientificsonline.com/product.asp_Q_pn_E_3052286
http://scientificsonline.com/product.asp_Q_pn_E_3081619

also you got PM incoming.

 

[Joeteck]

Many people seem to think that its a cheap solution. The 45w system I listed iis not a bad entry level system for $229, granted cheaper other places but is still low cost. The largest panels you can buy are 230 watt sharp panels. They're the most efficient as well. To be able to power your home, you're goning to need a bunch of them.. Lets say your house has a 100A service.. You have the ability to draw 12,000 watts.. 24K for 200A service. Not many people draw 100A @ once, however 5K watts is a more realistic number. If you got the 230 watt panels, you'll need 22 of them to make 5000 watts in full sunlight and @ $899 each, That's 20K just in solar panels... You still need inverters and a transfer box...

 

[krag]

Thanks for the awesome info and price guage. When I posted

if I can make it work in a relatively inexpensive way

in my mind I was thinking $10k, I should have typed it in. But, for me $10k (less is better) is workable "if" it pays for itself in 5 yrs or so. Yet, there is another potential attractive option about it. It could be used as a backup if the grid fails due to a natural and or social disaster, such as the current case with Hati.

TBH, I hate being so dependant upon the "utility pirates" that we have been so enslaved to for so long. My 2 cents...

 

[Evilsizer]

Thanks for the awesome info and price guage. When I posted in my mind I was thinking $10k, I should have typed it in. But, for me $10k (less is better) is workable "if" it pays for itself in 5 yrs or so. Yet, there is another potential attractive option about it. It could be used as a backup if the grid fails due to a natural and or social disaster, such as the current case with Hati.

TBH, I hate being so dependant upon the "utility pirates" that we have been so enslaved to for so long. My 2 cents...

could make it cheaper if you were to look into DIY-Wind energy. would be vastly cheaper $/W then solar, but thats for a different thread.

 

[rcillig]

I really like the win turbines at http://windenergy7.com/ wish I could afford a set up.

 

[Evilsizer]

I really like the win turbines at http://windenergy7.com/ wish I could afford a set up.

i know we should start a new thread but i cant resist atm.
one windmill/turbine
5KW

10KW

still a single but larger able to do 50KW-250KW

while the above listed ones from youtube, i looked at thier site no listed prices. they are all custom jobs, if they went into a retail with set prices they might be lower. IMO would be more cost effective then wind7 or the prop style windmills.

 

[krag]

could make it cheaper if you were to look into DIY-Wind energy. would be vastly cheaper $/W then solar, but thats for a different thread.

Dang it, I did it again. I live in WA state in the Pacific North West where it rains and blows much more than it shines. I am constantly getting more wind than I would care for. But, it seems to be a perfect place for a wind turbine as I stated in my above post in contacting my local city hall. A solar panel will not cut it here but a wind turbine will.

I was looking at SSS's link and the turbine he linked to looks awesome ascetically and practically for a roof top urban setting but the return was disappointing to me. It claims 18% return which made me think of getting 2...LOL! But I did not do enough research to get a price quote. Also the 42 MPH wind threshold is about 98% of the year here. WE reach gusts of 50-MPH at least once a year in my neck of the woods if not every other year. Trees get knocked down all the time here from wind.

But, this thread is a awesome start to my personal quest for a wind turbine.

 

[rcillig]

while the above listed ones from youtube, i looked at thier site no listed prices. they are all custom jobs, if they went into a retail with set prices they might be lower. IMO would be more cost effective then wind7 or the prop style windmills.

you ever watch that reality show Living with Ed, they had one episode where Jay Leno and him got air turbines and I cant remember the specifics but they weren't godly priced and they were more along the lines of the kind you posted instead of the propeller versions.

http://www.boingboing.net/2009/01/06/jay-lenos-wind-turbi.html

 

[Evilsizer]

Dang it, I did it again. I live in WA state in the Pacific North West where it rains and blows much more than it shines. I am constantly getting more wind than I would care for. But, it seems to be a perfect place for a wind turbine as I stated in my above post in contacting my local city hall. A solar panel will not cut it here but a wind turbine will.

I was looking at SSS's link and the turbine he linked to looks awesome ascetically and practically for a roof top urban setting but the return was disappointing to me. It claims 18% return which made me think of getting 2...LOL! But I did not do enough research to get a price quote. Also the 42 MPH wind threshold is about 98% of the year here. WE reach gusts of 50-MPH at least once a year in my neck of the woods if not every other year. Trees get knocked down all the time here from wind.

But, this thread is a awesome start to my personal quest for a wind turbine.

the video with the Blower blades says it all. what was it she said, not sure if factual but 200MPH winds it could handle. if that is the case would be way more then enough for your area. plus like she said at the end check you junk yard. with a bit of elbow grease you could have a high output windmill/turbine for a fraction of the cost of retail. that is if you dont count the time you put into it.

as a side note, you could look into Hydrogen production if you get alot of rain. use a mini wind mill to power the process of turning rain-water to hydrogen. might be worth looking into as well.

you ever watch that reality show Living with Ed, they had one episode where Jay Leno and him got air turbines and I cant remember the specifics but they weren't godly priced and they were more along the lines of the kind you posted instead of the propeller versions.

http://www.boingboing.net/2009/01/06/jay-lenos-wind-turbi.html

something about the way ed acts bothers me... i cant put my finger on it but i want to say he is borderline nuts... so no i never got into watching his shows but other ones that cover the same kind of thing in a way.

 

[Joeteck]

Wind turbines require a permit, and if you stand it 50 feet straight up, you'll need to have 50 feet in diameter around it clear of anything, just in case it falls... Plus if a blade comes off it will not kill anyone.. Ever notice windmill farms..how far apart each of them they are....

Most smaller wind turbines are made for marine type applications

 

[rcillig]

Wind turbines require a permit, and if you stand it 50 feet straight up, you'll need to have 50 feet in diameter around it clear of anything, just in case it falls... Plus if a blade comes off it will not kill anyone.. Ever notice windmill farms..how far apart each of them they are....

Most smaller wind turbines are made for marine type applications

go check out http://windenergy7.com/ they got rooftop designs so they are smaller now a days than they used to be.

 

[charmapsyche]

HF has them for $179 currently
http://www.harborfreightusa.com/usa...e&r=7560_878593&cust=77963248920&keycode=0000

I was going to mention this one as well.

Better deal with the coupon at HF than the one posted at Newegg.

Don't forget Solar-Thermal. Very inexpensive/easy to build, drastically reduce your energy consumption of your water heater.
If you're looking to invest a little more $, consider geothermal heating and cooling options as well.
I'm EE, and I've built homebrew Wind Turbines if any OC'ers have technical questions

 

[Shiggity]

A bank by my house has these nifty turbines.

http://www.mariahpower.com/

Vertical axis turbines ftw.

Also, +1 to solar thermal. By far the most viable money saving solar tech.

 

[krag]

Eeehh, side note. I think I kinda screwed up in calling my city hall about a wind turbine. They have called me back 3 times in the last week saying that they are researching. Aahhem, that means, they don't know a flipping thing about it and are making up some kinda stoopid tax or permitt fee. AHHAHHAHHahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

The only reason why I called them in the 1st place was because I knew i could never hide it from them.

 

[nyker]

just get a mini nuke generator, enough to power your house well after it's been eroded.

 

[krag]

Toshiba makes one that is 20'x6' and lasts for 40yrs before it needs to be maintained.

drool because I have... LOL I have thought about it for awhile now.

 

[Krogen]

What's the cost of that mini reactor?

The article says it costs about 5 cents per kilowatt hour, assuming it would power for 40 years.

40 years = 350 632.511 hours

350 632.511 hours * .05 dollars = $17 531.62

Only $17,000 for it? Am I getting something wrong?

It's a 200 kilowatt unit, way more than an average house would need. So assuming that a house needs only about 8 kilowatts,

200 kilowatts / 8 kilowatts = 25

Could power up about 25 homes?

If each house would pay its part for the reactor... $17 531.62 / 25 homes = $701

$701 for 40 years of electricity? Where do I sign up?

 

[krag]

What's the cost of that mini reactor?

The article says it costs about 5 cents per kilowatt hour, assuming it would power for 40 years.

40 years = 350 632.511 hours

350 632.511 hours * .05 dollars = $17 531.62

Only $17,000 for it? Am I getting something wrong?

It's a 200 kilowatt unit, way more than an average house would need. So assuming that a house needs only about 8 kilowatts,

200 kilowatts / 8 kilowatts = 25

Could power up about 25 homes?

If each house would pay its part for the reactor... $17 531.62 / 25 homes = $701

$701 for 40 years of electricity? Where do I sign up?

Yeah BUT... the government will make sure you pay in some way or another. Either by taxes, tariffs, permits, you name it...

I guess if you lived outside of town and had a secret sales agreement with Toshiba (so they won't have to pay sales tax too) you could make it work.

*edit...just think of the tax on the nuclear fuel that Uncle Prez would put on your reactor rods. Hmmmm...I guess you could get them from Iran. That is, if you had a submarine with cloaking devices and translators that were sympathetic to the cause. I don't know, just thinking out loud...

 

[Krogen]

Yeah, that's true. I think the installation would also cost a ton.

I think a better estimate would be close to $40,000, double the cost of the reactor itself. But at around $1500 / household it still seems like a really good deal.

I wonder what kind of safety procedures it would have in case of fire/tornado/flood etc.

 

[Drew@PSU]

$40K is a bargain, but then you have to add in insurance fees. No one is going to ensure your house if you live next door to mini-Chernobyl/3 Mile Island. That's what State Farm would say ( I would imagine ). Even 3MI was engineered to be failsafe.

On the solar front, I think the only way to get a decent investment back is to lay out the 20-30K when you buy the house to get a properly engineered set. That way you get a system with batteries, inverter and maybe even motorized mounts if necessary for one big ticket. Then you get to call it a home imporvement and add in tax write-offs, depreciation, etc, along with the lack of electricity fees. I recall it's supposed to be a long payoff time, like 20 years.