Still upgrading a 6 year old Dell - getting toasty.

[Mizzery]

So I bought a Dell Vostro 200 back in 2008. It was a budget machine at the time, 1.8G dual core (1/2 the cache of original core 2 duo) 2g of memory. I was going through a breakup and needed a computer. It fit the bill. 250G hd - 2g ram. Since then it's had a number of upgrades.

First upgrade (almost immediately) was a 1.5TB data drive. Lots of ripped dvd's - tens of thousands of pics - many tv shows etc. A couple years later the ram got maxed out to 4GB. A year or so later an ati 4770 was added with a new psu to fit the bill.

Forward to today - recently the os HD was cloned to a samsung SSD (major upgrade). I recently bought a gtx 470 to replace the ati card. CPU upgrade is in the mail (E4700 - 2.8G and double the cache - $22 - how could I not?). Hopefully pad modding to get 266fsb on the cpu if it will run that way.

I got the new vid card installed yesterday and when testing it with folding things got hot. Vid card temps were at 80c and rising, system was going higher than previously noticed. Started smelling that 'electonics' smell. Couldn't tell if it was plastics from getting warm or capacitor venting or both but I shut the folding down. I need to cool off.

Being a dell there isn't a lot of space. I had to move the hd to a higher bay and zip tie the ssd to make room (chipped an led off the card on a ram slot - oops - guess it wasn't important). Sata ports were obstructed. Airflow is not great. The psu is probably insufficient for long term use at full blast (plus one of its fans is failing). I plan on replacing the rear case fan with a higher flow model (suggestions for 4 pin compatible high flow fans wanted) and hacking bigger side vents (*excuse to use the angle grinder) near the video card. Possibly another fan in the front (none now) to move things along.

I need a new psu that can handle 550-600w well, is cheap, and has great airflow through it as the psu plays a decent role in overall system cooling in a box this small. Any all all help appreciated.

 

[Bobnova]

It's actually pretty difficult to find a good PSU that runs its fan full blast.
If your era of Dell is a standard ATX motherboard it might be worthwhile hitting Craigslist for a used case of some sort of another. Anything with a couple fan slots.
Alternatively, cutting into the case to mount more fans.

I don't think I'd run the GTX470 until you have a new PSU, odds are excellent that the Dell thing was specified pretty carefully for the GPU that was in there, and 470s eat more power than almost anything that existed in 2008. Certainly more than anything that would be put in a computer with a cut down core2duo CPU.

Fan wise, what sizes are you needing? 80mm? 120mm?


EDIT:
Hot electronics smell means things are about to go very very poorly for you. You made the right call pulling the plug. I strongly recommend not running it at all until you have a more capable PSU in there.

 

[RnRollie]

Still using the original Dell MB & PSU ?
If changing the PSU, check the pinout/wires first to see if they adhere to ATX standards... i trust Dell only as far as i can throw them
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dell#Criticism

see also this rant from the past
http://www.informit.com/articles/article.aspx?p=339053

 

[Mizzery]

I'm pretty sure the PSU is not original (edit: mobo is). I believe i upgraded it when I put the ati 4770 in there. Its a 450W (575max - whatever that means) logisys. I believe the rear case fan is 80mm. I also want to fit a 92 or 120 towards the front. It seems to run fine (no bad smell) as long as I don't load up the GPU.

 

[EarthDog]

No way in hell I would run a 470 on a "450W(if you are lucky) Logisys" PSU.

Friend, you need to upgrade for real. i like BoBN's idea as well.

 

[machausta]

I'm pretty sure the PSU is not original (edit: mobo is). I believe i upgraded it when I put the ati 4770 in there. Its a 450W (575max - whatever that means) logisys. I believe the rear case fan is 80mm. I also want to fit a 92 or 120 towards the front. It seems to run fine (no bad smell) as long as I don't load up the GPU.

Logisys has a reputation...and its not a good one. If you want, research some of their power supplies and don't take our word for it.

 

[Bobnova]

This is one of the best Logisys units out there: http://www.overclockers.com/logisys-ps480x2-review
The link is me doing a full on review of a PS480X2 Logisys unit.


They are universally junk at best. At best. On average they're dangerous to hardware and at worst they're fire hazards.

I would not even turn your computer on with a Logisys in it. Especially not one in the process of melting down.

 

[RnRollie]

no logisys review at Jonny's ?
http://www.jonnyguru.com/

 

[Bobnova]

Send OW one with a couple twenties inside it, and there will be.

 

[ATMINSIDE]

no logisys review at Jonny's ?
http://www.jonnyguru.com/

Too high of a risk of fire for his hotbox...

 

[Bobnova]

Nah, he's been doing gutless wonders.

The trick is, PSU reviewers don't generally get paid at all. The only profit in reviewing comes from selling the "free" units.
If the unit is unsellable, like a Logisys will be, it still takes the same 4-9 hours, but for no money. Add to that having to pay for the PSU, and forget it.

 

[NiHaoMike]

If that Dell is anything like the Dell towers I have opened up, it's possible to swap the CPU/case fan with something more powerful. Airflow is actually pretty decent, though you'll want GPU coolers that blow out the back.

 

[doyll]

When was the last time you cleaned your intake and exhaust fans? Just asking.

A good PSU is mandatory. Think 470's are 215w TDP. A good quality 450-500w PSU is fine, but it has to be a quality one.

You need at least as much air flowing though the case as the CPU & GPU fans combined use at full speed. If not they have to use their own heated air and just keep getting hotter.

I would suggest getting a newer case. Should be able to get a decent used one for about half of new prices. Might be able to find a PSU the same way.. and maybe a nice little CPU cooler too.

I use all PWM case fans and control them with motherboard PWM signal from CPU fan header (That is assuming your motherboard has PWM fan control) and sometimes GPU too. This makes it much easier to have a quiet system most if not all the time because the fans only spin as fast CPU / GPU need air to stay cool. Can supply more if you want.

 

[Mizzery]

I wish it were a matter of dust. I got a new psu - corsair cx600. I can't seem to get it to boot the computer. Though while i had everything apart i went looking for another fan to add. Eventually i ended up in the attic and found a nice big 120mm fan. It was wired for 7v - and I'm thankful. Its louder already than the existing case fan. I have it sitting in the lower front mounted on the inside of the case pushing air in. Right now the computer is apart on my desk but it is pushing much more air than the case fan does. Hopefully i'll figure out what the problem is with the new psu and get everything back together soon.

 

[Bobnova]

The 7V fan wiring may actually be the issue, using an output as a ground is fairly rude as far as PSUs are concerned.

 

[doyll]

Adding a fan inside the case is most likely a waste of time. You need more airflow through the case. You might find this guide helpful.
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7678268&postcount=40

 

[Mizzery]

The 7V fan wiring may actually be the issue, using an output as a ground is fairly rude as far as PSUs are concerned.

I wish that were the case but I did try it without that fan. I tried it with just the 24pin and 4pin motherboard connectors.

Adding a fan inside the case is most likely a waste of time. You need more airflow through the case. You might find this guide helpful.
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7678268&postcount=40

The fan is acting as an intake, mounted to the front of the case (on the inside). It is not just blowing hot air around inside the case.

 

[Mizzery]

So it was the stupid 7v fan connection. I got the new cpu today and when i put that in i tried the new psu. It worked. Then when i actually plugged everything in it didn't. I had to unplug the psu and let it sit - perhaps it has a built in breaker or protection that needs reset time.

So the fan is running at 12v now. Its noisy. But it provides enough inward pressure to make air come out of vents that were previously intakes. System temps are pretty good though, cpu seems to be settling around 42c and the gpu seems happy at 77c with 48%fan pwm according to CPUID HWMonitor. SSD / HD are at 32/33c respectively - all while folding on the cpu and gpu.

While digging in the attic for the case fan yesterday i also came across my watercooling stuff i had hooked up to my athlon system about 10 years ago and I think I'm going to convert this dell to liquid cooling. Need to find or make a 775 mount for the block. I also found another waterblock while searching for a fan so perhaps I can cool that gpu down a bit as the fan based cooler doesn't seem to be doing as well as I'd like.

 

[NiHaoMike]

The CPU temp is great. The GPU temp is a little high for continuous use (bad for the caps), but the Nvidia control panel might have a tweak to manually increase fan speed.

 

[ATMINSIDE]

The CPU temp is great. The GPU temp is a little high for continuous use (bad for the caps), but the Nvidia control panel might have a tweak to manually increase fan speed.

Except that the 470 is safe to ~105°C.