3570k Isn't Running as Hot as Expected

[xander89]

competition, yes, that's one thing... AMD is quite silent for sometime after releasing the bulldozer.. i haven't heard any news about the Pile Driver for awhile now..

in terms of performance AMD are 2 generations behind now. if they really pushed the boat it might push intel into not taking shortcuts. INtel has really pulled ahead of the game in the last 2 years. I dont seem AMD catching up anytime soon

 

[raident30]

in terms of performance AMD are 2 generations behind now. if they really pushed the boat it might push intel into not taking shortcuts. INtel has really pulled ahead of the game in the last 2 years. I dont seem AMD catching up anytime soon

Intel, i think, is getting complacent for not having effective competition which is bad for the consumers who are getting sub standard products...

 

[Frakk]

competition, yes, that's one thing... AMD is quite silent for sometime after releasing the bulldozer.. i haven't heard any news about the Pile Driver for awhile now..

I did post a link next door to a review for the soon to be released Trinity APU a few days ago.

Trinity has cut down Piledriver cores and even that looked like it was an improvement on Bulldozer.

It did not last long before it vanished, and its not the first time i have seen links testing AMD engineering samples suddenly disappear.

Intel dominating is very bad news for every one, even the staunchest Intel fans would agree with that

 

[raident30]

I did post a link next door to a review for the soon to be released Trinity APU a few days ago.

Trinity has cut down Piledriver cores and even that looked like it was an improvement on Bulldozer.

It did not last long before it vanished, and its not the first time i have seen links testing AMD engineering samples suddenly disappear.

Intel dominating is very bad news for every one, even the staunchest Intel fans would agree with that

yes indeed

 

[RollingThunder]

But I think there is some evidence it is not the TIM, and no real evidence that it is (except intuition based on previous processors). That is why I said I doubt it.

GeneO,

Understood but don't you think saying "I doubt it," followed by "here's why" would be a better solution? The members here are only looking for something factual to back up what's said either from personal experience or from independent testing.

 

[dejo]

when followed by "heres why" or "I think" it does lead to more discussion, and hopefully some learning by all involved. We pride ourselves on trying to be helpful and respectfull to all in our community.

 

[GeneO]

Give me a link where they have 100% shown the TIM isn't a contributing factor? No point stating something that directly flys in the face of everything being said then not supplying anything to back it up. That is directly antagonising people whatever you might think and it just makes you look like a troll.

I just find it hard that you have heard about this but hardly anyone on this forum has. I've been following most of the IB threads and this is the first I've heard about the TIM not contributing to to heat whatsoever.

Well I can argue the opposite as well. Give me a link that show where TIM has been shown to be the cause of the high temps.

http://www.maximum-tech.net/intel-admits-that-ivy-bridge-runs-hotter-because-of-22nm-shrink-12410/

http://www.maximum-tech.net/ivy-bridge-heat-problem-persist-even-after-ihs-removal-12404/

I don't think I have been antagonistic any any way but your post sure seems antagonistic to me.

I also can't see Intel switching to a new IHS to die process that would would result in this kind of problem. I doubt they save that much money and I would think they wouldn;'t do it unless they determined it doesn't matter.

 

[Frakk]

Well I can argue the opposite as well. Give me a link that show where TIM has been shown to be the cause of the high temps.

http://www.maximum-tech.net/intel-admits-that-ivy-bridge-runs-hotter-because-of-22nm-shrink-12410/

http://www.maximum-tech.net/ivy-bridge-heat-problem-persist-even-after-ihs-removal-12404/

I don't think I have been antagonistic any any way but your post sure seems antagonistic to me.

Seems pretty conclusive.

I would go with the 22nm DIE concentrating its heat in a much smaller area, in other words it has less space to dissipate its heat making it less efficient at doing so.

 

[EarthDog]

I know this theory attempted to be bunked before, but w/e heatsink they used, the mounting on the cooler made it difficult to get a sufficient amount of contact pressure with the cooler used so that wasnt useful. Can the NH-D14 get adequate pressure with the IHS removed? I dont know that cooler/its mounting.

 

[GeneO]

I know this theory attempted to be bunked before, but w/e heatsink they used, the mounting on the cooler made it difficult to get a sufficient amount of contact pressure with the cooler used so that wasnt useful. Can the NH-D14 get adequate pressure with the IHS removed? I dont know that cooler/its mounting.

The fact that the results are virtually identical is compelling enough for me.

 

[EarthDog]

The fact that the results are virtually identical is compelling enough for me.

Maybe I wasnt clear... What Im saying is that I dont know how the NH-D14 mounting works... as in, is it able to get enough contact pressure on the bare die that is recessed a mm or so below the IHS? If you dont have enough pressure, temperatures will be higher so that *may* have negated the difference of the removal.

If someone who knows that cooler can tell us it can be torqued down and there isnt a limit, then I would say you have brought compelling evidence to teh table. Until then... my question needs answered to make any conclusion from that link more than speculative.

 

[xander89]

delidding and whacking a huge cooler ontop more often than not wont help temps as much as you think. Mounting a regular cooler on a delidded processor is asking for skewed results, especially the NH-D14 You cant tighten it properly, the pressure is going to be uneven and most likely will not decrease your temps. From what ive heard delidding results are mixed at best


You seem to have a lot of faith in intel. Using tim is a cheaper process, its quicker and the materials don't cost anywhere near as much. When they are churning out millions of these saving a few $ on each one = millions in profit for them.

also the link isnt very in depth...... no pics, seems to be a shoddy/not very legit test if you ask me,.

 

[GeneO]

If it didn't make good enough contact, the temperatures would likely be higher than with the IHS, nit the same. I am just saying that casts a large doubt on the IHS TIM being the cause. Don't get me wrong, I hope that it is the TIM, because that can be fixed in production.

 

[xander89]

The fact that the results are virtually identical is compelling enough for me.

then your pretty easily convinced, i dont really trust a news piece that has one shoddy table, a tiny paragraph of info and pictures that look like they have been recycled from other sites

also the site you linked has so few Hits every month it doesnt even show up in google ad planner, and in the largest part of the forums there have been a total of 850 posts.....I'm not sure i trust results coming from there tbh

 

[EarthDog]

If it didn't make good enough contact, the temperatures would likely be higher than with the IHS, nit the same. I am just saying that casts a large doubt on the IHS TIM being the cause. Don't get me wrong, I hope that it is the TIM, because that can be fixed in production.

I believe, due to a lack of information on the cooler mounting on my part, that any conclusion cannot be made at this time. The cooler may have enough pressure to be effective enough to maintain temps, but not proper pressure to allow for better temperatures. That is what I am trying to find out. Only then could I personally agree with your assertion. The writing is on the wall, but until that question is answered, I cannot take the leap of faith you did.

 

[xander89]

I believe, due to a lack of information on the cooler mounting, that any conclusion cannot be made at this time. The cooler may have enough pressure to be effective enough to maintain temps, but not proper pressure to allow for better temperatures. That is what I am trying to find out. Only then could I personally agree with your assertion. The writing is on the wall, but until that question is answered, I cannot take the leap of faith you did.

screenshot or it didn't happen

 

[Frakk]

Interesting, the HIS is not exactly a tight fit on the DIE cap so if the cooler is just as loose the results would be more or less identical.

 

[GeneO]

Wow, now I must say this is grasping. It would be an unlikely coincidence to me that they would be exactly the same

 

[EarthDog]

So you are saying that the IHS and TIM have 100% thermal conductivity (when we know for a fact the thermal conductivity of said items already and its not remotely close to that efficient). It doesnt. The temps should be less regardless as you are taking out the IHS and thinning out the TIM with direct contact. This is part of what leads me to believe there isnt enough pressure as the temps should drop at least a couple C anyway with removing those mediums.

EDIT: Sorry for the edits.... we need auto edit update here.....

 

[xander89]

You dont think its also an unlikely coincidence that removing the nickel plated copper IHS and the TIM to a much thinner layer and its still the EXACT same temperatures? So you are saying that the IHS and TIM have 100% thermal conductivity (when we know for a fact the thermal conductivity of said items already and its not remotely close to that efficient).

This is science and not speculation.

+ 1 the likelihood of them being almost identical is highly improbable, you shouldn't believe every shoddy table people stick up on sites that get that get so little traffic.

I could throw a table together putting up random temperatures, but unless i actually have proof i carried out the experiment i.e pictures, screenshots people would laugh me out of the forum.