AMD FX 6100 Problem (Throttling Related)

[FoxInABox]

Hello all.
I recently upgraded my system (Cpu, cooler, ram, mobo) as seen in specs.

I currently have a stable overclock of 4 Ghz with a voltage set at 1.365v in bios, although with LLC set on auto (~50%) it runs at 1.34v at load and 1.38v idle with a max spike of 1.392v. I plan on playing with it a bit to get it closer to what I set it at.

Anyway there seems to be a known bios problem with throttling (http://www.overclock.net/t/1202751/amd-fx-cpu-throttling-fixes-please-sticky)where the only way I can get it to run all 6 cores at 4ghz all the time is to open AMD Overdrive, enable turbo control, then disable it and that solves the problem of it lowering cores under load. (Obviously with cool 'n' quiet and all that pwm stuff disabled.)

Now the problem is, I want to turn back on cool and quiet and set the power mode back to balanced so that it isn't running at full bore 24/7 but once I have done the AMD Overdrive trick, it just sits on 4ghz and doesn't drop down when idling. If I don't do the thing with AMD Overdrive it doesn't run all the cores at 4ghz when under full load (i.e. It fluctuates every core from 4.0 to like 3-3.3ish)

From what I understand my mobo is a piece of sh*t (which I didn't know at the time of purchase) and I am guessing that is the cause of my problems.(Fairly obvious seeing as it is crap for O.Cing and its a bios problem that is causing it) Any solutions or do I need to go get myself a new board, if so, suggestions on a cheapish decent one please.

Tl:dr I need a solution to let it run at lowered speeds/voltage when idling and then bump up all cores to 4ghz at load. Anyone got any suggestions?

Thankyou[/SIZE]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
AMD Fx-6100 / Cooler: Coolermaster Hyper tx3 evo v2 / Mobo: M5A78L-M LX v2 / 4GB G-Skill Ripjaws DDR3 1600 @ 9.9.9.24 / Nvidia Gtx 275 / 2x 1TB Western Digital HDD's / PSU: Widetech 650w
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[trents]

Until you get a new motherboard I wouldn't count on solving that throttling problem.

"all that pwm stuff disabled"? PWM stands for pulse width modulation and has to do with controlling fan speed from the motherboard bios. Did you mean to say APM?

 

[FoxInABox]

Until you get a new motherboard I wouldn't count on solving that throttling problem.

"all that pwm stuff disabled"? PWM stands for pulse width modulation and has to do with controlling fan speed from the motherboard bios. Did you mean to say APM?

Haha yes that is what I meant. I'm still learning some terminology as this is my first proper overclock

Damn I figured that would be the answer but no harm in hoping for an easy fix.

After reading that 10 page thread where you helped FD overclock I don't plan on going much higher (4.2-4.5 depending on my temps) due to the scaling issue, do you think it would be worth shelling out the extra money for a 8+2 phase or go for one that will handle the clock I am going for but not much more? I should do some research myself but seeing as you know what you are talking about I figured I may as well ask
Cheers

 

[Ajay57]

Hey Foxinabox this is what you need to look at this list of AM3+ Mobo's and go for a Gigabyte UD5 or UD7 IF you do not like them. Then the Asrock 990FX Extreme 3/4 just look at the list buddy! Then come back to us?

1, http://www.overclock.net/t/946407/amd-motherboards-vrm-info-database#post_12462681

 

[ssjwizard]

That motherboard has throttling issues and they cant be corrected. I have gone rounds and rounds with mine. APM is hard tuned into the bios, OCP kicks in @ 110W and kills the system @ 180w, the LLC settings DO NOT WORK, and the "core voltage" setting is an outright liar on that motherboard.

Mine sets the idle vcore ~ 0.15v above whatever I set it to. I have added a heatsink and 30CFM fan to the VRM section which helps keep the temps down but it only delays the activation of throttling(caused by hot VRM this is only one type).

 

[Ajay57]

Happy New Year SSJwizard from me and Family! Sorry.

 

[ssjwizard]

Thanks!

PS. Please do not capitalize characters in my SN.

 

[FoxInABox]

That motherboard has throttling issues and they cant be corrected. I have gone rounds and rounds with mine. APM is hard tuned into the bios, OCP kicks in @ 110W and kills the system @ 180w, the LLC settings DO NOT WORK, and the "core voltage" setting is an outright liar on that motherboard.

Mine sets the idle vcore ~ 0.15v above whatever I set it to. I have added a heatsink and 30CFM fan to the VRM section which helps keep the temps down but it only delays the activation of throttling(caused by hot VRM this is only one type).

Thankyou for the info. I will be looking at getting a new Mobo asap. And cheers AJ for the list

 

[FoxInABox]

Little update on the situation.
When I run a game or program that isn't using 100% load, the clocks will stay at a constant 4ghz. Even at idle the majority of them will stay at 4.0 for most of the time and drop to 3.0 quickly then back up to 4. However running prime 95 will cause the cores to stay mostly at 3.0 (200x15) and a few of them will jump up to 4 for a brief second.
Its like the whole situation is backwards lol (staying at 4ghz when there is no need to, but dropping down to 3ghz when under load) and i'm pretty sure I am wasting my time trying to find a solution as trents said.

 

[Hicksimus]

So when it's not at full power draw....it's not throttling.

Seriously though, do you realize that throttling is the alternative to fire. Here's what you are doing. Driving down the highway in second gear bouncing off the rev limiter while on the phone telling a mechanic that it's weird that the RPM fluctuation stops when you stop driving it past redline.

http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1559489

Keep it up though I enjoy these pictures.

 

[RGone]

Seriously though, do you realize that throttling is the alternative to fire.

I doubt that is too strongly worded since it lies so very close to the truth. FX cpus suck up the power. It has to come thru some electrical components. If they are barely good enough at stock type settings, they will not suffice when steadily loaded by an overclock with the extra voltage pushing the current thru the cpu.

Asus knew exactly what they were doing when they put over-current protection circuits for the VRMs on all their boards lately. They can claim support for more power hungry cpus and get by with them at stock cpu settings/usage which is all that is warrantied in truth anyway.

Extreme power draw is why you cannot DISable APM in bios on their less expensive motherboards either.

The unwary cost shopper buys in at about the least expensive level he can and then wants to overclock and is hung with a board not nearly designed for the extremes of overclocking cpus with 6 and 8 cores and surely not with the power hungry BD/PD processors.

 

[FoxInABox]

Yeah just did a bit of a test. Uninstalled Overdrive and reset bios.
With turbo and cool and quiet off, it will idle at the stock 3.3ghz but during prime 95 drops down to 3ghz still.
Guess its time for a new mobo. Strange thing is though, while i was waiting for my cpu cooler I was having a play with a 3.9ghz overclock and I am almost positive it wasn't throttling back. Perhaps it had something to do with the fact I was doing it all in Overdrive where as now I am doing it though the bios, or maybe I am completely wrong. Gotta test that.
So sounds like these motherboards aren't designed at all for the type of power needed for an OC, would you recommend setting it back to stock or am I able to leave it at my 4ghz 1.365v without too much risk of it breaking?

 

[FoxInABox]

Also here is a 20 min prime test for temps and voltages, in case anyone was interested.
EDIT: Locked at 4ghz by doing the enable/disable turbo in Overdrive ENDEDIT

 

[RGone]

Legwork <>Homework <> Maybe <> Might...

CPU Temp seems to be 54c.
CPU Core Temps seem to be 47c.

Seeing those temps and you NOT mentioning any throttling during that 20min run of P95 in Blend mode, let me suggest you up the FSB/CPU freq by about 4 or 5 and test P95 Blend mode at that extra gentle overclock. Doing so in this manner will slightly overclock the ram so I would take and look at WHATEVER it's default voltage is suppoed to be and adding 0.05V to that suggested Ram voltage to try and ensure the ram will take that gentle overclock along with the Cpu. Still referring to Ram I would suggest you go in bios and set Ram Command rate to 2T since it will have a mild overclock on it as said already.

Adding 4 FSB/Cpu Freq will bring your total cpu speed to about 4.1Ghz.
Adding 5 FSB/Cpu Freq will bring your total cpu speed to about 4.13Ghz.

If the 4 or 5 FSB add does nOt raise the temps by much and P95 Blend does n0t fail then post for us the Screen captures as you have accurately done already above and let us look at what is going on with temps and voltages and just where the Ram is overclocked up to. WE may have a little more head room and most especially if you are n0t experiencing the throttling.

RGone...ster. ______________

EDIT:
Every bit of this is trial and error at your end. I do this in my sleep. N0 real idea if this will work for real or n0t, until you do the legwork at your end. WE, you, us all might be able to sneak up on 4.1Ghz or maybe 4.2Ghz and not have a throttling situation and if so that is plenty of horse/CPU power for most usage and YOU might skate on buying a board at this time. Most operative word here is >> MIGHT.
END EDIT.

 

[FoxInABox]

Thanks for the tips Rgone, I will get straight on it.

I'm not sure if I explained clearly or not, but to clarify. For me to be able to keep the clock constant I can adjust the settings in bios or Overdrive, then once its at the speed I want to force, I have to turn on the turbo core mode in Overdrive then turn it back off. That seems to work if I want a constant clock speed.

However, after I have done so there is no way of letting it do its own thing as it is stuck at a constant speed until I restart, then I have to do the turbo on/off again to force it (If I choose to do so)

Only real problem is, unless I force it it won't keep the higher clock speeds under load. It will throttle the multiplyer to x15 (always seems to be x15, unsure of why that number but anyway) and only run at 4ghz on a few cores at a time for a few seconds each core. Which kind of defeats the purpose of why I am overclocking it I want high speeds under high load and low speeds at idle, just like everyone else haha.

I'll give you suggestions a shot and post back in 30 mins.
Edit: also when at constant clock i noticed that my WMP would become all jumpy and freazy when listening to music, going to test again just to confirm it wasn't a one off thing

 

[FoxInABox]

20 Mins in prime95, seems stable.

I Set the FSB to 205. Upped the ram voltage to 1.55 from 1.5, doesn't show any difference in cpu-id which I am guessing is common.
Set the command rate from AUTO to 2t. (It did have a grayed out 2t next to it. Not sure if that means recommended or what the value currently was)
EDIT: Not to sure on this, but it increased my NB to 2050mhz, that is nothing to stress about right?
END EDIT
EDIT2: Also no problems with WMP, not sure what caused it last time.
END EDIT2

No change in temps -


On an unrelated story about previous overclocking. I remember trying to overclock my first and previous cpu (Amd Athlon II x64) from 2.7 to anything over 3 and I would be happy. Couldn't for the life of me get it stable past 2.9.
I now remember that I was a complete noob and never once changed the voltages haha

 

[RGone]

You say >>20 Mins in prime95, seems stable.

I write >> Did you do anything with AOD at all?

You write >> I Set the FSB to 205. Upped the ram voltage to 1.55 from 1.5, doesn't show any difference in cpu-id which I am guessing is common.

I write >> There is no voltage reading of Ram voltage. Only shows suggested voltage and nOt the current voltage.

You write >> Set the command rate from AUTO to 2t. (It did have a grayed out 2t next to it. Not sure if that means recommended or what the value currently was)

I write >> Likely greyed out means the 2T was already set by AUTO ram settings.

You write >> EDIT: Not to sure on this, but it increased my NB to 2050mhz, that is nothing to stress about right?
END EDIT

I write >> Any raising of FSB raises Ram speed. Raises HT Freq. Raised CPU_NB Frequency as FSB is a "common" clock for all those other frequencies.

You write >> EDIT2: Also no problems with WMP, not sure what caused it last time.
END EDIT2

I write >> Good. No idea. Assume you mean Windows Media Player.

 

[FoxInABox]

"Did you a do anything in AOD" Yes, I turned turbo mode on, pressed apply, which drops the multiplier to 19.5 as that is as high as the slider in the turbo settings go to. Then I disabled turbo mode and reset the multiplier back to 20 and applied that. I presume I should be doing this as otherwise it throttles to x15 and will therefore be hard to test for stability?

Since the FSB raises the speed of multiple variables should I be manually setting the speeds of all but one variable to stock so when I get stability issues I know which part is causing it? Is that the method for overclocking with the FSB? If not could you explain what the next step would be?

And yes I did mean windows media player