Another "New guy to watercooling thread". But I have done my homework..... I think

[SnowRider]

Thanks for all the great help/comments/suggestions so far guys!!! I really appreciate it!! Keep 'em coming!!

 

[Nitrix]

I agree with you for the silenx fans, they are pretty expensive , IMHO they worth it. I have two 120mm running on my heatercore and one 80mm for case fan...those fans are doing a great job of cooling my system at a low level db.


Right now I'm around 33 degree...see sig for specs


As for the other component, you made a good list. However, if I were you, I wouldn't get a chipset block. It's restricting the flow and it's only harder to route your tubing. A passive Zalman nb47j would do the job.

You don't need a reservoir, keep it simple, go for a t-line. As for the heatercore, you might want to consider the danger dan double eater core.

That swiftech pump is execellent but If you want something equivalent and a little more quieter and expensive, get the eheim 1250 but don't restrict the oulet with 1/2 ID tubing, that would greatly degrade its performance. I use 5/8" ID from the outlet to the T-Line.


Good luck.

 

[GV2NIX]

As for the other component, you made a good list. However, if I were you, I wouldn't get a chipset block. It's restricting the flow and it's only harder to route your tubing. A passive Zalman nb47j would do the job.

I'm going to have to disagree about the NB47J. I have one, and although it worked fantastically when I had the CNPS7000-Cu, but now that my cpu is water cooled and there isn't as much air moving over it, it just gets super hot and limits my overclock. It gathers heat well, but it has trouble dispersing it with such little air flow. If you definitely want to eliminate the NB WB, then, in my opinion, you should definitely look into putting a fan on top of it or getting active NB cooling. However, if you have really good air flow in your case, then maybe you won't have to.

 

[SnowRider]

I do plan on H²O cooling my northbridge versus the stock heatsink that is on their now. I've read some of the good and bad of doing this like loss of flow, warmer water, etc. but I think in my case the pro's far outweigh the con's. I think from what I've read that the swiffy pump will be able to handle all of that (I hope) without any major issues. Besides, the stock HS now runs very hot even with decent airflow over it. I have a temp probe inside the HS fins and at the moment it's reading 47°C with an ambient of 25°C. Under load it can get to 50°C no problem. That Zalman NB HS is nice but thx to Intel I can't mount it on my mobo. because of the lack of mounting holes.

 

[Arkangyl]

Overall that setup looks pretty good, just a few things to take into consideration;

#1 the PolarFLO GPU block, maybe you could link me to some reviews but the ones I've seen only compare it to high flow / low performance blocks. Right now I'm running the DangerDen maze 4 block and its working very well for me, IMO the design behind it looks a lot better than that of the PolarFLO which, I think is just a chamber for the water.

#2 the CPU block, that block seems to be tied with the Whitewater and RBX for the top dog right now, hell, if I were getting new stuff I'd choose it over my RBX because of looks. Just one thing to consider; DangerDEn will be releasing its new TDX block VERY soon, I'd wait for some reviews and then decide.

Really I'd take a look at the PolarFLO CPU, GPU, NB blocks vs. the Dangerden TDX, Maze 4 GPU and Maze 4 NB blocks...

#3 for a resivouir seriously consider a bayres, it would seem to fit into your case a LOT better than either of the cylenders.

As for the radiator, if you planning to go all internal I'd think a Black Ice Xtreme would be best, I've seen them on the top of Coolermasters without a hitch, I'd think the Heatercore would be a bit on the large side though, and a BIX2 would not fit...

Anyways, good looking settup there, really the difference between PolarFLO and Dangerden is minimal, IMO the main difference would be the VGA / NB blocks and the fact that DD's new TDX has 2x barbs instead of 3x...

 

[GV2NIX]

That Zalman NB HS is nice but thx to Intel I can't mount it on my mobo. because of the lack of mounting holes.

Yes, indeed. I used the Zalman on my Gigabyte 8KNXP-Ultra because it had the nice holes, but I can't use it on my Abit because of the stupid P4 loops. However, if you really want it, I'm sure Zalman, ever conscious of changing trends, will probably design one that can be used with the loops. Afterall, they recently modified their PSU product line to include a version with SATA power connectors. But, like I said, I think you'll get better performance with an active cooling solution for your NB, namely, a NB WB

I'll be using a NB WB with my GPU and CPU block with my MCP600 also, and I don't think I'll suffer too much of a flow loss. Just make sure you use a high-flow NB WB like the Swiftech, DD Maze-4, or the D-Tek. The D-tek and DD WBs offer the least resistance I think, but if you want the D-Tek one, you'll have to wait a few weeks until they make the P4 loop mounting hardware to go along with it.

 

[SnowRider]

Overall that setup looks pretty good, just a few things to take into consideration;

#1 the PolarFLO GPU block, maybe you could link me to some reviews but the ones I've seen only compare it to high flow / low performance blocks. Right now I'm running the DangerDen maze 4 block and its working very well for me, IMO the design behind it looks a lot better than that of the PolarFLO which, I think is just a chamber for the water.

#2 the CPU block, that block seems to be tied with the Whitewater and RBX for the top dog right now, hell, if I were getting new stuff I'd choose it over my RBX because of looks. Just one thing to consider; DangerDEn will be releasing its new TDX block VERY soon, I'd wait for some reviews and then decide.

Really I'd take a look at the PolarFLO CPU, GPU, NB blocks vs. the Dangerden TDX, Maze 4 GPU and Maze 4 NB blocks...

#3 for a resivouir seriously consider a bayres, it would seem to fit into your case a LOT better than either of the cylenders.

As for the radiator, if you planning to go all internal I'd think a Black Ice Xtreme would be best, I've seen them on the top of Coolermasters without a hitch, I'd think the Heatercore would be a bit on the large side though, and a BIX2 would not fit...

Anyways, good looking settup there, really the difference between PolarFLO and Dangerden is minimal, IMO the main difference would be the VGA / NB blocks and the fact that DD's new TDX has 2x barbs instead of 3x...

One of the "joys" of having an All-In-Wonder 9800 pro is that almost all aftermarket cooling devices don't fit on it because of the tuner box....this includes the Maze 4 GPU block. When I bought the card I payed less money than I would've for the "plain" 9800 pro. At the time I wasn't planning on watercooling or anything so I figured, "I can get a 9800 pro or I can get a 9800 pro with a built in tv tuner and extra software". Well I have to say that it's nice having a TiVo in my computer but I'm finding out the consequences of having that extra box on the card.
Anyways, that PolarFLO GPU block is easier to mod to fit my card than the Maze 4 GPU block since the PolarFLO has a mounting plate and the Maze 4 is more like the whole block is the mounting plate.
I'm still going back and forth between reservoirs and T-lines and Black Ice's and Heatercores and additives and fans and.................. I think my head is gonna explode. To many decisions to make lol.

Oh, and here's a whole mess of reviews of the PolarFLO blocks.
________

http://www.tech-mods.net/reviews.php?op=showcontent&id=124&page=1
http://x-trememodz.com/content-74.html
http://www.gruntville.com/reviews/wc/polarflo_vga/index.php
http://reviews.pimprig.com/cooling/polarflo_universal_&_vga_blocks.php?page=3
http://www.modthebox.com/review272_1.shtml
http://www.viperlair.com/reviews/case_cool/other/water/polorflo/uniblock_sf/p3.shtml
http://www.overclockers.com/articles879/
http://www.cooltechzone.com/reviews/cooling/pflowblock_6.php
http://www.gruntville.com/reviews/wc/polarflo_sf/index.php
http://www.benscustomcases.com/reviews/pfcpusf/
http://www.virtual-hideout.net/reviews/hoi_polarflo_waterblock/index.shtml (Note: This review is of the older revision block which lacks the "SuperFinish" just to let you know)
http://www.x-trememodz.com/content-38-page3.html
http://www.resellerratings.com/seller5673.html

 

[SnowRider]

Okay..... heres a diagram I threw together on how I was planning on placing everything. It goes- Pump >> CPU >> GPU >> NB >> Radiator >> Reservoir >> Pump. I've tried to draw everything to their actual size as best I could without getting real technical. The Reservoir in the diagram is the Tank-O-Matic and the Radiator is the Black Ice Xtreme II. I'm not saying that these are for sure the parts I'm buying, I just used their measurements for the diagram.
Alright.... now the big question. If I had those 120mm fans exhausting (pulling air through the radiator which is what I've heard is best), and seeing that the radiator is pretty close to the dvd-rom...... how much do you think this would this hurt my cooling capabilities to leave the dvd-rom there? I think the space would be about a half inch at the most. So, which would be better.... a single 120mm fan sized radiator/heatercore? Or a Dual 120mm fan sized radiator/heatercore with that very small gap on one side?

This case sure wasn't built for watercooling .

 

[GV2NIX]

Yeah, tell me about it. I have a Praetorian, same deal pretty much. I'm using my front intake to house the BI Micro II instead of modding the top to put it up there. However, since you're using a reservoir, I guess you need that space down there to put your pump in.

Also, since I'm going to put my BI Micro II in the 3.5" bays, I'm shoving all my spinles into the 5.25" bay area. But, since you're going to put your rad up there, I guess you can't do that. Sorry, I'm just sort of listing the differences, I know that isn't helping. Let me give some more constructive advice.

I see that your GPU block's intake/outlet are facing to the right. Is there any way you can rotate the block so that it faces outward (towards us from the picture's perspective)? I see the tube going from the GPU to the chipset is going to have to make a very tight turn and twist, if it's coming out of the GPU block towards us, then it can just curl around the video card and go straight into the Chipset block.

Also, the Y-adapter is going to make for a stiff tube assembly coming out of the CPU block, so it's going to be hard to curl that around to go into your GPU block from the right. All that lateral pressure from the twisted tubing might shift the blocks making them not set properly on the chip dice. Iinstead you could make the lower arm of the y-connection from the CPU much shorter so that the end of the y-adapter is already pointing down toward the GPU, then it would be easier for the single hose to go to the GPU instead of curling it around to the right. Man, I'm sorry this is so long. Let me know if it was any help!

Sorry, maybe I should take the time and draw a picture like you did. I'll post back if you want one.

 

[SnowRider]

Yes it's possible to rotate the barb direction on the GPU block. That's one of the great things about that PolarFLO GPU block is it's extremely customizable. I had the barbs facing that way because when I first measured I didn't think I'd have enough room for the hose between my video card and the side panel. I don't know what I was thinking though because I remeasured and should have enough room (it's about 1 1/2"). The thing that worries me about though is if the hose will kink because of that tight turn . I've always thought that of what would happen if video card manufacturer's put the chip and HSF on the top of the card. I mean, heat rises right? And any air below the card will most likely be standing still because there's no place to go! That's why I have my pci slot covers off at the moment. I don't know.... maybe there's a reason for why they put it there that I don't know of .
Anyways, how's that Black Ice Micro II working for you? I thought of getting that one but I wasn't sure how it stacked of performance-wise with all the heat running through my rig. It'd be awesome to fit the radiator in that spot though. I'd have to move my HDD's somewhere else . Hey if you want to make a picture like I did go for it I don't know how long it'd take you but it took me a good amount of time lol.
Thx for the help.

And remember..... the way I have placed things in the pic isn't set in stone. It's just how I pictured things. So any suggestions as to the placement of stuff is more than welcome

 

[SnowRider]

Alright I just went to the Hardware labs website (the company that makes the Black Ice radiators) and came up with these performance spec's (I underlined the heat ratings so they'd stand out more)......

Black Ice Micro II -
* 2-pass Dual 80 mm Radiator specifically developed for PC CPU and GPU watercooling
* Double-row high internal volume design
* New superior durability custom formulation high-gloss acrylic paint finish
* Rated for 570 KCal per hour (2261.91 BTU per hour) or 662.91W
* 160 mm x 73.4mm Double-row copper-finned core consisting of flat tubes for maximum heat conductivity
* High-density copper fin configuration for enhanced heat dissipation
* Built-in enhanced depth plenum chamber for increased performance and noise reduction even when using high-speed 80mm fans.
* Self-tapping dual 80mm fan and case mounting holes for ease of installation
* 9.55 mm OD (3/8 inch) pre-angled inlet/outlet barbed hose connectors (Also available in 6.4 mm OD (1/4 inch) barbed hose connectors)
* Compact 193 x 82 x 46 mm (7.6" x 3" x 1.8") dimensions allows it to fit internally in most cases

Black Ice Xtreme -
# 2-pass Double-row Low Pressure Drop Radiator specifically developed for PC watercooling based on the new high-performance Black Ice Xtreme design.
# More than DOUBLE the performance at the compact Black Ice Prime form factor: rated for 790KCal per hour (3134BTU per hour) or 919Wh.
# 120 mm x 32 mm (4.72 inch x 1.25 inch) Double-row Copper core consisting of flat tubes for maximum heat conductivity.
# High-density louvered copper fin configuration for enhanced heat dissipation.
# Built-in plenum chamber for increased performance and noise reduction.
# Self-tapping and case mounting holes for easy installation of 120mm fans.
# Now with12.5 mm (1/2 inch) pre-angled inlet/outlet barbed hose connectors
Compact 153 x 133 x 45mm (5.9 x 5 x 1.69 inch) dimensions allows it to fit inside most mid-tower cases.

Black Ice Xtreme II -
# 2-pass Double-row Low Pressure Drop Radiator specifically developed for PC Watercooling based on the new high-performance Black Ice Xtreme design.
# Xtreme performance: rated for 1580KCal per hour (6270 BTU per hour) or 1838 Wh*.
Double Row 240 mm (9.44 inch) Copper core consisting of flat tubes for maximum heat conductivity.
# High-density louvered copper fin configuration for enhanced heat dissipation.
# Built-in plenum chamber for increased performance and noise reduction.
# Self-tapping and case mounting holes for easy installation of 120mm fans.
# Now with 12.5 mm (1/2 inch) pre-angled inlet/outlet barbed hose connectors.
# Optimal 273.4 x 133 x 45 mm (10.75 x 5.25 x 1.77 inch) dimensions allows it to fit inside most mid-tower cases.

__________End quote_____________

*This is what I'm guessing this radiator's "Wh"(which stands for Watts an hour I'm assuming?) rating is. The site doesn't have it for some reason (even though every other rad has this rating) so I just doubled the Black Ice Xtremes rating. I think this is pretty accurate considering that the BIX II's "KCal per hour" rating is exactly double that of the BIX's.

So my question is how do these ratings compare to that of a heatercore? Everyone says heatercores are better, but I've never seen actual comparisons between the two.

 

[GV2NIX]

Well, I haven't gotten mine up and running yet, so I can't say for sure how the BI Micro II is working. About the only thing I can say is with 6 fans mounted on it and running, when I blow hot air in one hole, it comes out the other hole cold! All jokes aside, I chose it because it's basically the biggest 2-fan rad I can fit in my case without doing mods. I was going to run 2 BI Micros in parallel, but that's not going to work, it's extremely awkward putting one BI Micro under the blowhole fan and one in the back, plus the plumbing would be a nightmare. True, I could've used one 120mm x 120mm rad, but that would be a big fuss for me in this case (Praetorian). So I need to use the one BI Micro II. Yeah, maybe it's not the best perfomer, but I'm confident I can get enough air through that with 6 fans (4 fans pulling 2 fans pushing to make sure there's no loss of flow through the rad and rilters) to ensure its effectiveness. Once I get it up and running, I'll definitely give you some data.

In terms of the plumbing, I tried out various configurations with just the mobo on my lap and the video card plugged in. I did that to design my wishbone thing that goes between the CPU and GPU block. The only difference is that the barbs are horizontally aligned on my RBX as opposed to your vertically aligned barbes. So, it's for that reason that I suggested shortening the lower y-fitting tube on yours so that the outlet of the y-fitting naturally points more downwards. Then the tube going from your CPU to GPU won't have to bend as much initially.

There's at least half to a full centimeter of space bewteen the CPU-GPU tubing and the side panel. I need to get my camera out and take some snapshots so that you can see what all this nonsense that I'm talking about loosk like. So, hang tight, I need to dust off my Leica. I'll post again later tonight and show you what I mean.

 

[SnowRider]

Heh.... you know what?? I think that PolarFLO CPU block goes the way you said, with the barbs horizontally. I just looked at a review of it and they have it mounted on the Mobo that way...... lol, my bad. So that would make it easier for the tubing to bend around the video card I guess. DOH!!! I just looked at another review and they have the block with the barbs vertically!! I'm gonna email PolarFLO and ask them if it matters or if it'll go either way. I'll let you guys know what they say.
BTW, you have 4 fans pulling air on one side of that rad??!?!? I'd like to see a pic of that too. Never heard of that being done. I'd much appreciate pic's. Thx

 

[GV2NIX]

Well, here it is, Project: Wishbone! Anyways, I'm sure you can pretty much figure out what I did.

 

[GV2NIX]

Here's the same thing from a different angle. By the way, the board really isn't installed in the case. The case is totally empty, I just set it in there and screwed in the retainer thumbscrew for the video card. Almost looks like it's really in there doesn't it! I just wanted to make the pictures as convincing as possible, haha! Still waiting on my NB WB by the way. Once it arrives, I can get the NB WB plumbing figured as well as the plumbing for the rest of the system. Then maybe I can post some more suggestions for you.

 

[GV2NIX]

Here's what it looks like with the side panel on. As you can see, there is still at least half of a centimeter of space between the tubing and the side panel. I could've even lengthened the tube going into the GPU to make the curve a little less aggressive, but you get the idea. Man, I love this camera!

 

[GV2NIX]

And here's my heavy-breathing BI Micro II with 6 Vantec Stealth 80mm fans attached to it.

Each fan is supposed to put out 27CFM each, but with the dual-pass rad and steel mesh filters, I'm sure they put out much less than that, even with 2 pushing and 2 pulling. So, I slapped on 2 more to help the other fans move air.

I know, I know, putting more fans in series won't increase the air flow. That is, these fans, no matter how many of them are stacked on top of each other will never move any more than 27CFM. But there's resistance here. So, I'm trying to get them to put out as close to 27CFM as possible. Therefore I stacked them to overcome the flow resistence.

Anyways, tha'ts my theory for this particular situation. But realistically, I'm pretty sure there isn't going to be much of a difference whehter I use 2 pulling or 4 pulling, but I had them lying around, so I figured why not. Plus it was fun! Hope these pictures helped. Let me know if you can rotate that CPU block so that the barbs go horizonally.

P.S. For future reference, how do I attach more than one file per post? I don't have any web storage space that will let me link to public areas. I hope the mods don't think I'm spamming. I just didn't know how to make one post with all the pictures I needed.

 

[SnowRider]

That looks like it's gonna be sweet man. Thanks for the pic's. I didn't mean for you to go to that much trouble to get them but thanks. What parts are you gonna be using in your watercooling setup? I'd like to see how yours turns out because of your case being so similar to mine. That's insane what you did with all those fans and radiator lol.

 

[GV2NIX]

Here's what it looks like I'm going to have:

Danger Den RBX
Danger Den Maze-4 GPU
Danger Den Maze-4 NB (Gave up waiting for D-Tek)
Swiftech MCP600
Brass ball valves for my Swiftech-inspired fill & bleed thing
and...
A whole bunch of 1/2" ID Tygon 3603

As you can see, I live "DANGERously" har har! Ok, bad joke... Anyways, no problem about the pictures. I love doing this kind of stuff! I'm glad you like the rad too. I guess it's a little overkill, but hey, tinkering is fun right? I'll keep you updated as things come together.

 

[SnowRider]

......I love doing this kind of stuff! I'm glad you like the rad too. I guess it's a little overkill, but hey, tinkering is fun right?

Oh yeah! You should've seen me when I was taking pics of my setup lol. I think I went a little overboard (I definitely didn't post all the pics I took). After I built this computer which is my first one, I've been addicted to all this stuff haha!! Cheers dude.
BTW nice setup you got there and where did you buy your Tygon and how much?