First Frozencpu.com experience -- Average/bad

[vixro]

Well, I had high hopes for FrozenCPU based off of the reviews here, reviews on Reseller ratings and recommendations from members on the forums. I recently took advantage of the 10% off memorial day coupon to pick up a power supply to replace the one that broke on me Monday.

I made the order around 7pm EST on Monday, which most likely they were closed on, and had everything paid for and an email response by that evening telling me that I had been charged.

On Tuesday I was greeted with this email that my package had been shipped and would arrive shortly.

date May 29, 2007 6:02 PM

We are emailing to inform you that your order [#...] has shipped via USPS Express Mail (1-2 days).

Unfortunately USPS does not provide tracking information, your order should arrive soon.

If you have any questions in regards to this order, please visit our contacts page to find a convenient way to reach us.

Thank you for your order!
The FrozenCPU.com Team

The time this email was sent was late in the evening. If I were to understand it correctly that means it had shipped via USPS express mail and had shipped AFTER the cutoff time that would guarantee an overnight delivery. Instead of putting forth any kind of effort at all to ship it earlier that day and make sure that it went out, the package was put out later in the evening when it would almost certainly take 2 days to get to Idaho from California.

Item Weight 10.0lbs
FedEx Ground Home (1-5 days) $12.93
FedEx Ground Business (1-5 days) $12.93
FedEx Express Saver (3 days) $27.05
FedEx 2 Day (2 days) $32.20
FedEx Overnight (Next Day) $61.25
USPS Priority Mail (2-3 days) $23.05
USPS Express Mail (1-2 days) $42.50

Priority mail is around $17 for a box that size, if you include confirmation and insurance and the price of a box it would be about right at $23. That would be a guaranteed 2 days from Tuesday-Thursday to these two zip codes, which is the speed I have received. Overnight shipping was guaranteed through USPS express mail if mailed Tuesday before the cut off time.

I ordered on Monday night, and they had all Tuesday morning to pack the order and have it shipped out before the cut off time to have my package here by Wednesday. I made a special instructions note that I needed it quick and that was the reason I chose express mail. Express mail from California to Idaho only takes 1 day. Sometimes priority mail only takes 1 day from these 2 states through USPS too.


Today I wrote an upset email to coolerguys asking them why I had not received my package, somewhat threatening to post back resellerrating feedback (only on the shipping portion and how they handled the shipment of course, their prices and availability and website were all still fine. not to mention I haven't dealt with their service department or RMA so I can't have an opinion on any of that). Instead I received an email that for one SPELLED MY NAME WRONG, two had typos galore in it, and 3 didn't even solve the issue stated.

Erick

My sincere apologies for the delay on your PSU. Good news. It arrives
tomorrow. It actuall costed more than what you paid in freight however we
ate the overage.

Enjoy!


Mark Friga Jr
.A+/Net+/MCSE
President
FrozenCPU.com
1877.243.8266

What the hell?

Then a few minutes later I received another email from frozencpu from a DIFFERENT person stating even different information:

Here is your tracking number for your PSU 1Z725Y0E0256236498


Jeffy
Purchasing Manager / Domestic sales / RMA
[email protected]
ph-1.877.243.8266
fax-1.585.425.2813

A UPS tracking number?!?!!?!?!

That's not even the half of it, if you go to the tracking page of the UPS tracking number it even states that it was shipped late on Tuesday night WITH 2 DAY SHIPPING.




Arghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. This is the worst experience I've had in a while with support and shipping from a company. With my luck it will come tomorrow completely destroyed because UPS never takes care of my packages, the whole REASON I CHOSE USPS with express shipping and paid full price for!

Am I wrong to be upset about this whole thing? Somebody please help me stop the rage!!!

I have had no computer for 3 of my 4 days off so I can't get any work done, play any games, or basically do anything that I enjoy doing with my time off. What was the point in paying the extra $20 for overnight shipping if they were just going to screw me by shipping it 2 day with a different company?


This is my first and my last order at frozencpu.com I will never make another purchase from there again, no matter how this order is handled from this point on. Being late is unacceptable when it was caused by slow processing and shipped using the wrong carrier, both of which are completely controllable by the company and not the responsibility of the shipping industry.

 

[Xenocide]

no news to me

hopefully you get it!

 

[vixro]

Yea, it just seems to upset me big time. There are a few major factors that bother me about this:

- The item shipped very late Tuesday, when their website states that orders made before 6pm EST ship same day. Why make a big deal about shipping if it's not very quick?

- The item was shipped using a carrier I did not choose and never want to deal with (UPS).

- The item was shipped using slower and cheaper shipping than I paid for.

- The return emails were very unprofessional and very uninformative, not to mention more aggrivating than helpful. When I got the emails I didn't even want to read them initially.


Had the item shipped Tuesday night via USPS express mail and still arrived here on Thursday, I would have still been upset but not as upset. Sometimes shipping delays happen and sometimes you have quite a few orders and can't get a single individual order perfect among hundreds. What upsets me is just how it was handled and how poorly customer service responded to my concerns. Not to mention it was shipped UPS 2-day instead of USPS express mail, what is up with that?

My shipping should be refunded fully as a sign of good faith, or at least the portion between 2day and express mail. Either way, I want everyone to know how horrible this was taken care of.

 

[benbaked]

You have reason to be upset. $42 is alot of shipping for a PSU. What irked me when I read your post was that they shipped it via UPS instead of the USPS that you paid for, and then they said they ate that overage.

IMO, that's not right.

 

[Automata]

You should be able to call and talk to them, make sure to stay calm.

 

[vixro]

Out of curiosity, IF and this is a big IF I had ever wanted to choose a UPS 2-day option (which doesn't even exist on frozenCPU.com) the package weight from zipcode to my house with standard pickup is only 29.25 USD.

USPS Priority (2 days for these two zip codes) is around $17, or $22 with insurance.

Where did my extra $20 go? Where did my time for this entire day go?

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
















Sorry, I'm still upset. I have had nothing to do but think about this all day, since my car is damaged and my insurance agency has taken 2 weeks to give me a reply on whether it's totalled or they're going to cover repairs. They keep brickwalling me and telling me they will get back to me on it. Argh, stupid state farm, stupid broken computer, stupid UPS, stupid frozencpu, stupid everyone!!!!

 

[vixro]

I got the package today and it was indeed marked for UPS 2-day air delivery.

It shipped directly from silverstone out of California instead of from New York where FrozenCPU is based. My assumption is that they ran out of stock and ordered one to be directly mailed to me from Silverstone to fill the order. While normally I would applaud this type of service because it is an above and beyond step, but the fact that it was shipped 2-day air instead of overnight and then I was told that they "ate" the extra shipping costs when 2-day air through UPS is more than half the price of overnight (or what I paid).

I wrote this email to FrozenCPU and tried to keep my bitterness out of it for the most part:

FrozenCPU,

As my last email was long and abrasive, I will make this one very
short so my points stay clear and understandable.


I just received the PSU today from Order #[...]. Right on the
package it listed that it was from Silverstone, shipped otu of
California, instead of being shipped from the New York area like I
expected it would be. I can assume that this either means you place
orders directly through the manufacture and have them ship the
products or you ran out of stock and went ahead and had them ship me a
PSU to keep the order straight. Either way, this is not what bothers
me.

What bothers me is that the PSU was a day late intentionally. Instead
of shipping the product through USPS express mail, which takes exactly
1 day shipping in the United Sates if dropped off or picked up before
the cut off, it was shipped through UPS 2-day air mail. I don't know
why this happened, I don't care what the costs were to overnight this
product through UPS instead of USPS, all I care is that I got 2 day
shipping through a shipping company that I did not even pay for. When
I confronted support about this I was told that you "ate" the shipping
costs and I would get it the next day.

Was this a joke? 2day UPS shipping from California for a box with
that weight to my zip code is only around $23. I paid $43.50 for
overnight shipping that I never received. Saying you ate the shipping
costs would have meant that you went ahead and shipped it overnight
UPS which is a little more expensive than USPS, but you didn't have
that option because it shipped directly from Silverstone instead of
from your warehouse.

Either way the logistics of everything do not matter to me, the fact
is that you shipped a product 2-day air mail through UPS when I paid
for overnight express shipping.

I am not asking for a refund in the shipping price, I am demanding a
shipping refund. This is absolutely unacceptable by any standards and
when a person pays for express mail and then the product is shipped
through 2 day mail intentionally has to be illegal in some way.

The order number once again is: #[...]

Thank you,
Erik [...]

-------------------------
You can find a lengthy discussion about this problem at:

http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=513950

Feel free to post a reply with any concerns, I do expect a personal
email response back. Thank you for your time.

After re-reading the email it does seem quite harsh but I am absolutely and positively angry about this whole situation. I feel like I was scammed. The USPS express mail page says (1-2 business days shipping time) and if they hide behind that I will be livid. The fact is that USPS express mail can possibly take 2 days, that is right. If the package is mailed after the cut off time, then it will be mailed the next business day instead through USPS and it will take a total of 2 business days instead of one. While this would have upset me slightly, it happens right? The fact that it was INTENTIONALLY shipped 2day mailing to save the seller shipping costs and pocket the rest of my money is absolutely crazy and what upsets me the most.

 

[vixro]

Of course, my name was spelled wrong once again.

Erick

USPS Express is 1-2 Days. The 1 Day delivery is NOT a guranteed service.
You will not get a refund from as Monday was a holiday. You can go to every
forum you wish and threaten us with bad reviews however we stand by our
service and did nothing wrong.

We shippped from Silverstone because we ran out of that PSU that day. If you
feel that we did something illegal, please either hire an attorney or call
the police.

We will not respond to this request over email any further. Any further
discussion can be conducted over the phone at our offices.




Mark Friga Jr
.A+/Net+/MCSE
President
FrozenCPU.com
1877.243.8266

How did I know they would hide behind the "1-2 day USPS express shipping" policy and then intentionally ship 2day UPS and think they were covered?

My reply back:

The item was not shipped USPS express, it was shipped UPS 2-day. I
can understand delays from the shipping company taking an extra day,
it happens. The fact that it was intentionally shipped 2day shipping
is where the problem lies.

Enter SSS, I need help.

 

[Xenocide]

Thats mark for you, hes a real piece of work.

A few years ago he accused me of hacking his forums and sending out vulgar emails after a friend and i set up the whole system for him.

Only thing i ever bought from them was some sleeving about 3 years ago, that was my first and last purchase, ever.

 

[vixro]

I am in communication with him currently, maybe we can solve this issue.

 

[g0dM@n]

vix is right...

if you chose usps express, and paid for it, it shouldn't have gone out ups 2 day.

i bet they did ups 2 day b/c silverstone didn't offer usps... and they probably didn't wanna pay for overnight from ups with silverstone

they should definitely give some sort of refund.

FedEx 2 Day (2 days) $32.20
USPS Express Mail (1-2 days) $42.50

the could always AT LEAST offer the difference there (though that's fedex, but you get the idea).

 

[inkfx]

I just had an aweful experience with UPS myself. Ordered a P5K-D from xPCgear with 2 day air. According to UPS they delivered my package and left it at the front door. However, it never arrived at my front door. I called up xPCgear and they are taking it into an "investigation". The guy also told me UPS should have asked for a signature which obviously didn't happen. So now I get to wait 8 days while this "investigation" goes on before I can even think about getting another board.

 

[vixro]

After trading a couple emails back and forth, Mark offered me a $10 refund which I accepted.

 

[cipher_nemo]

I feel for you, and sorry to hear the shipping part of your experience didn't go well. But I must state, this is really funny because now it confirms my own, personal suspicions about Mark, the owner of FrozenCPU. I will fill you all in on a little bit of communication I had with him. He's a real "piece of work" as someone else mentioned above.

Mark,

I e-mailing you as suggested by one of your phone representatives. This is in regards to order number (removed for privacy).

For this order, I purchased two Bulgin Vandal switches and wires specifically made to connect them with a motherboard (with connectors and resistors). When I received them, I noticed that the area where the resistors are spliced into the cables felt limp. I assumed the best, figured it was just a delicate connection, and treated it gently. Next, I noticed the wires were crimped to large-sized quick disconnects. They were too large to connect to the switches because connecting one would physically prohibit me from connecting another. The Bulgin switches have four small quick disconnect terminals, fairly close to one another, and only smaller quick disconnects will fit.

Despite the wrong-sized quick disconnects, I decided to bite the bullet on this and purchase my own, smaller quick disconnects. I snipped off the over-sized ones, and crimped on the new quick disconnects. I sleeved the cable, and set it aside while I worked on the rest of my mod project. Unfortunately, I later discovered that the resistors were limp-feeling for a reason; the resistors are making no electrical contact with the wire. At this point I'm giving up on FrozenCPU's wires. I purchased resistors of my own, and made brand new cables.

I hope that you can credit my FrozenCPU account (or next order) for the cost of the four cables (power switch, power LED, reset switch, and HDD LED cables). I'd be happy to send back what I have left of the cables, if so desired. I still have the wires, motherboard header pin connectors, and non-functioning resistors, but not the quick disconnects. I don't need or want replacements at this point. Since I made my own cables, and since your cables don't have the correct quick disconnects, I don't want replacements. Your phone rep claimed he wasn't able to help me because I "modified" the cable. I find that difficult to believe since FrozenCPU is an online store for "modder" supplies.

Thank you for your time.

John

How can i possibly except your return after you have completely decimated our wiring.

We have hooked ours up to fit as you can see in our photos. A tight fit they are however it has been done by several other modders.

Now if you had asked us to return these prior to shredding these cables, I might have been able to do something however I cannot accept these as a return now-

Mark Friga Jr
.A+/Net+/MCSE
President
FrozenCPU.com
1877.243.8266

Mark,

I find it interesting that you define modded as "decimated" and sleeving as "shredding".

The product you sold me is not as advertised, nor does it function (even before I've added my own ends). It is defective, and it did not have the correct quick-disconnect ends. If you refuse to help me, you leave me no choice but to reverse the charges with my bank and send everything back to you. This would also mean I would no longer want to do business with FrozenCPU. Is that worth the price of a few cables?

If I was dealing with a major component provider such as Newegg, they would have no qualms correcting a situation such as this. And, because of their customer service, they've earned my trust and respect for thousands of dollars over the last year alone.

Your choice.

John

We will take photos of your cables when they arrive for Visa/MC. We also will point out to Visa and Mastercard that any items that are modified by customers are not returnable. You are not going to bully us with a chargeback because you will lose. I have your emails stating that you cut these cables.

I will also get signed affadavits from my employees that these wires we sell work perfectly. I also will sue you for damages should you try and reverse the damages. I will take you to small claims court for the cost of the plane ticket to file in your area. We have done this before and we will do it again.

In the end you will be out money should you pursue this any further. I reccommend you cut your losses because I live to fight people like you in court.

The ball is in your court now.

Mark Friga Jr[/left]
.A+/Net+/MCSE
President
FrozenCPU.com
1877.243.8266

 

[vixro]

Yes, I agree that once you remodded the cables they can't be taken for a refund (although you may not agree with me), but the way he handles these type of issues is just wrong. He's very rude and very unprofessional about it.


On another note, I received some case cover from FrozenCPU that I never even ordered. It was labeled with my shipping address and my card was never charged. I wrote an email to their shipping department and they blamed coolermaster for it and told me they would send me a shipping label. 5 days later and no shipping label has arrived, guess I should just put it in the garbage can.

 

[cipher_nemo]

vixro, wow, that's funny they sent you something you never ordered. But yup, it all comes down to poor customer service. And ForzenCPU's Mark is the best example of generally not caring for your customer.

I don't want to hijack your thread, so I hope you don't mind me posting my e-mails with FrozenCPU? Just let me know.

Here's my last response:

Mark,

I know my limited rights as protected by consumer laws, and I know the guidelines established by Visa and other credit-issuing banks for chargebacks. I also know of your threats and general lack of concern for customers from their own experiences with you. Your cowboy-like legal threats and the attitude you convey in your messages may be acceptable in New York, but I won't tolerate them. I certainly don't understand how one can do business with such bullying tactics. Are you familiar with recommended strategies to avoid chargebacks? All it takes is 1-2% of sales with chargebacks to be blacklisted by credit authorities.

This might help you:

www.sitepoint.com/print/chargeback-challenge

As for the chargeback, expect to receive the entire order returned, in the same condition as I received it, aside from defective resistors (or resistor connections) and one Bulgin Vandal switch that is also defective (as per my phone conversation prior to these e-mails). I'm not claiming the cables are untouched. I did cut the ends, but I will re-crimp the larger style quick-disconnects to make sure you receive everything. I am claiming defective goods, but before I file a claim, I must ship the order back to you. Expect it with confirmation. If you refuse the shipment, that will also go into the chargeback file. I will also include an unopened fan controller as sold in that order. Aside from the defective items, they will be in a like-new condition, ready to be sold again.

If you encourage me to do a chargeback, you will lose shipping costs, the profit from this order, put another mark on your vendor record, and waste time for both of us. You've already damaged your reputation with me and other customers you've treated so recklessly. I will not be bullied by businesses with little regard for their customers. You may elect not to respond to my returned package, but if you want to avoid a chargeback, I'll need e-mail confirmation that you will credit my card account with a full refund of the order, minus shipping. If not, I'll be forced to start the chargeback process on this order, after you've received the items. Please note that I will document the entire packaging of the order since I no longer trust you or FrozenCPU.

 

[Big Mike]

Wow, definitely marking them off the list of places to order from. Anyone that is that much of a jerk and takes their customers for granted that badly doesn't deserve anyones business.

 

[Gunlance]

Wow, definitely marking them off the list of places to order from. Anyone that is that much of a jerk and takes their customers for granted that badly doesn't deserve anyones business.

Ditto.

 

[TankGuys]

I think the handling was a bit... poor... in both your cases. Sorry to hear about your bad experiences

However, I would play devils advocate and "support" thier standpoint on a few issues:

@ cipher_nemo:

Once the cables were modded, you lose your right to return/exchange it. That's quite reasonable. That's true with basically any company, in any industry, in any country. Had you tested it and found it hadn't worked FIRST, and gotten a return the, that's different - but as soon as you modify it in any way, you're on your own. I can go into a long winded explaination of why this is the case, if you like, just let me know. Sometimes it's good to hear the "vendor" perspective on things to understand better.

Just as a precaution in any of your future endeavors, it pays to test parts before you mod them in any way. That will avoid any issues like the one you ran into

@vixro:

I agree with Mark in so far as the USPS express shipping isn't a date certain thing. It can be one or two days, it just depends. So from a very strict standpoint, it's not *horrible* that they used 2 day UPS instead. HOWEVER, I can also completely understand your frustration, and I certainly think a refund of the price difference is in order. So you both are right on that, in some sense

As for the processing time, that's also a bit of a grey area. The one bit of leeway you may want to grant them is that Mondays are almost always the busiest day, as we have to catch up on ~2.5 days worth of orders. On a Holiday weekend, you add yet another day to that backlog, and surprisingly (or maybe not?) those also tend to be very busy days... so it's more like processing 4-5 "normal" days worth of orders. It's very easy to run behind on days like that.

In any case, I do certainly agree that it was handled poorly by them, but there is at least some method to the madness, I suppose.


A note for everyone:

Mistakes happen - we're all human. As customers, we always expect the business to treat us with respect and understanding, and to take good care of us. Certainly, this is the responsibility of any good business. As such, we expect that when mistakes happen, they will be resolved quickly and to our satisfaction.

However - and this is a big one - I can tell you that 99% of the time, you'll get MUCH better results if you approach the issue with the same level of understanding/respect as you would wish in return. From a vendor perspective, I can tell you I'm always sorry when we make a mistake, and I'll do what I can to fix it. If the customer is understanding and friendly about it, I'll do everything I possibly can, and then some, to make them happy. If, however, the customer is rude and demanding, and accusing us of screwing things up on purpose, it's very tempting to do the absolute minimum necessary to get them to leave us alone... if even that much

I'm not saying you have to pour on the honey and kiss people's feet, just to use common courtesy, and give the benefit of the doubt when possible.

-Don't resort to threats, unless absolutely nothing else has worked.
By making threats, you *immediately* turn the situation into a hostile one, and you've lost any measure of good will you would have gotten.
-Don't demand things, request them nicely, until this method stops working.
Similar to above. Making demands is fine once all other avenues are exhausted. If you do so too early though, again, you lose any good will.
-Don't accuse anyone of intentionaly screwing you/your order, until it's obvious this is the case.
This is a biggy. I've had a few customers over the year accuse of us purposely trying to sabotage thier order. Not only does this not make sense, but it's extremely insulting, and it doesn't put anyone in the mood to be generous and helpful

Following this will get you the best results 95% of the time. The other 5% of the time, the person at the business is being a jerk or doesn't care, then it's time to start lighting some fires

 

[cipher_nemo]

TankGuys, some good words of advice sprinkled in with plenty of common sense. Thanks. I was simply shocked to received an e-mail from Mark with legal threats because it isn't becoming of a "president" of an online store, much less of any respectable business person. He even sends out unprofessional e-mails with poor grammar and misspellings. I would have responded much better to something simple like "we're sorry you feel that, but we're unable to help you any further ... we can offer you X, but we can't offer you Y and Z".

Any ways, I've wrapped up my communication with Mark. I've settled the issue, so here's the final e-mail correspondence. It's not worth my time and energy (or his) to keep battling each other. I'll get the one defective switch replaced, and concede on the cables. I know I don't want to waste my time with FrozenCPU after this experience. Thanks for the support, and thanks to vixro for starting this FrozenCPU thread! May be others will share their experiences here too, good or bad?

The last of my e-mails with Mark...

If you send everything back in good order and resellable condition. I will consider processing a full refund minus shipping.

I cannot refund the wiring that you already admitted to modifying.



Example- the bulgin switch is not defective you burned it out. It states on the product page that these will NOT be returned for customers that burned out the LED with overvoltage. This is written in huge red lettering.

I also know through other chargeback attempts, that if you cut wires etc, you cannot expect to win a chargeback. We have been in business 7 years on the internet and we deal with chargebacks all the time. Some we win, some we lose.

Perhaps we can meet in the middle somewhere as this will begin a ****ing match between the both of us.

Mark Friga Jr
.A+/Net+/MCSE
President
FrozenCPU.com
1877.243.8266

Mark,

I am willing to meet somewhere in the middle, because you are right, I don't want to add fuel to a "****ing match" between us that will cost both of us money, time, and plenty of headache.

If you want to avoid a chargeback, I do not need to send back everything. That is only necessary for a chargeback, since my bank and Visa will not allow the split-up of charges for a couple items inside one larger order. You've shown constraint in your last e-mail from continuing our battle of words, and for that I am willing to drop the issue of the wires. I've already made my own, regardless, so I'm willing to eat the cost on those.

However, I do have one Bulgin Vandal switch that has a defective press-action. The LED works like new (I tested the LED with two sub-C cells at 3.2V since it runs at 3.4V). I did not burn out the LED, that isn't the problem. The actual press of the switch doesn't work right. It makes contact, but it doesn't click like the other, and the amount of pressure needed to use it isn't right.

I'd be happy just sending this one switch back for a replacement. How is that for middle ground? I'm dropping the issue on the cables since we'll never agree on that.

Thanks.

PERFECT-send it back and I will swap it for you- NO PROBLEM