FX 4100 3600MHz to 5250MHz ..wtf?!

[SticksStones]

I've got a new CPU, MB and RAM. Most people on here would no doubt call it a budget gaming build. I got into overclocking a few months back as my old system was getting old and needed pushing.
Before everybody say's it, I know I still need a new GPU.

New bios...no real idea what I'm doing with it yet. What I've done is put put it into D.C.O.P mode...no idea what that is. CPU to x22, CPU-NB up 400MHz to 2400. Put an extra 0.1v to the core using the offset.

I expected to see the core at 4400 MHz at 1.48v, but cpu-z say's 5250MHz at 1.404v....ran prime95 for only 5mins, but seemed stable and temps got as high as 58-59 before seeming to find a level. I understand 62C to be the lower limit - 70C maximum.

3600MHz to 5250MHz...is that possible?! Could the reading's be wrong? Could it yet go higher? WTF is D.C.O.P?

I'm so surprised by the results I'm feeling out of my depth and decided to stop prime95 and post here.
Some friendly advice and reassurance would be very welcome!

CPU: AMD FX 4100
MB: Asus M5A97
RAM: 8GB DDR3 Kingston Hyper-x
GPU: 1GB 4870 ATI vapor-x
CASE: BitFenix Survivor

AIR COOLING
CPU: Coolermaster hyper 212
SYSTEM INTAKE:
200mm Coolermaster megaflow
Custom modded x2 80mm Akasa
SYSTEM EXHAUST:
140mm Akasa Viper
200mm BitFenix

 

[trents]

What are you viewing the CPU speed with? Windows System rerport or some other software. Or is that what it says in the post when you first start the computer. The latter will give you the true reading I would think.

 

[wagex]

from what ive heard them new fx chips are pretty beastly clockers should be right grats on the badass overclock

atleast i dont think cpu-z has issues with the new fx chips?
are you using the most updated version?

 

[SticksStones]

CPU-z the latest version 1.61 x64 - just downloaded it again to be sure.

Core drops down to 1670MHz when idle, but still 5250MHz with prime95 running.

I'm amazed I can get such a high clock by accident. I still need to look into the turbo feature and whatever D.C.O.P is......but I'm might give BF3 a go and see if it runs any faster!

 

[trents]

Try going into bios and disabling Turbo Boost or what ever they call it, and Cool N Quiet, C1E, C6 and APM (Advanced Power Management). Then go into Windows Control Panel Power Options and configure it to High Performance. You might also try a different version of CPU-z or CoreTemp which also reports core frequency.

 

[Buddywh]

Try going into bios and disabling Turbo Boost or what ever they call it, and Cool N Quiet, C1E, C6 and APM (Advanced Power Management). Then go into Windows Control Panel Power Options and configure it to High Performance. You might also try a different version of CPU-z or CoreTemp which also reports core frequency.

x2 - especially APM. My motherboard BIOS doesn't really disable APM so the CPU clocks back constantly. So I THOUGHT it was running at 5G, but actually only a small fraction of the time as it clocked back to 2.7 or 3.2G most of the time.

When I got APM disabled (using a utility) Prime 95 @ 5 Gig would either lock up immediately or disable three cores within a few sec's., 5 min's. max for the last.

It seems to me it really WANTS to be able to run at 5G but just can't get the heat out fast enough or something. No wonder extreme overclocker's have had so much success with this chip.

 

[RGone]

DOCP reads the memory SPD and then sets parameters to overclock based on those Ram SPD findings. So your settings for cpu speed are 240x22 when loaded. A shade over 5.2Ghz is not bad, IF your temps in CPUID Hardware Monitor are n0t TOO high when loaded with P95 Blend mode.

Now I try and make this clear. If it were my system, I would not be turning off the Green features in bios. You have already said when loaded you get the 5.2Ghz. Do you need that 5.2Ghz when doing nothing or surfing the Net? No one does; not really, need a full time 5.2Ghz.

The Turbo Control for the newer FX processors does a good job of increasing cpu speeds when the temps and current load on the processors is not extreme. Although you have only a 4 core processor, continued running at a straight up 5.2Ghz is going to bring on a bunch of heat. More heat than you want to deal with most likely. That is why knowing what I have seen about the newer FX processors and 24/7 computer use...well I just don't see disabling 'green' in the long run. I could do it if I benched everyday for HWBot but I don't. I do emails and surf the web. That surely does not need 5.2Ghz of heat and power consumption. YMMV and this is just my personal opinion today. RGone...ster.

 

[RGone]

Good post man. I was typing what I wrote above and had not seen your post when I posted. You got it nailed as to what will likely happen if everything is forced to run full tilt all the time. I mentioned heat build-up just as you have and it will happen for sure.

Yes the extreme dudes have fun with the FX-4100, but they have the extreme parts to do the deal. Well they hope they have.

I am beginning to get over this Max Mhz day in and day out for 24/7 because it is a waste really. In no way do I 'hug trees' but from a standpoint of pieces to run high speeds and temps at the same time for 24/7, most just don't get it done. RGone...ster.

x2 - especially APM. My motherboard BIOS doesn't really disable APM so the CPU clocks back constantly. So I THOUGHT it was running at 5G, but actually only a small fraction of the time as it clocked back to 2.7 or 3.2G most of the time.

When I got APM disabled (using a utility) Prime 95 @ 5 Gig would either lock up immediately or disable three cores within a few sec's., 5 min's. max for the last.

It seems to me it really WANTS to be able to run at 5G but just can't get the heat out fast enough or something. No wonder extreme overclocker's have had so much success with this chip.

 

[SticksStones]

I don't think I'm at 5250MHz, faster maybe, but not that fast. I think it's at 4400MHz. CPU-z must be giving me inaccurate readings. If it was running that fast it would surly need more volts and be giving off more heat. Both the BIOS and Core temp say 4440MHz - which is what I expected.
I'm not keen on turning off all the green features. Cool 'n' quiet I turned off when I first got into the bios, but as i understand it, it's best to leave C1E on. Not sure about the others.
I think the temps are accurate though, so my custom fans seem to be doing a good job!

 

[SticksStones]

Yeah it's at just over 4400MHz. Didn't restart before downloading and running the new version of cpu-z, now that I have, it's reading 4414MHz. ...at least i know where i'm at again. Now I can push it back up towards 5000MHz!

Too good to be true, but thank's for the help

 

[Buddywh]

...
I am beginning to get over this Max Mhz day in and day out for 24/7 because it is a waste really....

That's the story that, IMHO, everyone misses. Modern multi-core CPU's are just way more powerful than needed for average work. There's always exceptions, of course.

Even though I was able to stress test mine at 4.52G I leave it at 4.5G and call it a good 'nuff. Then, just to be sure, I leave cool-n-quiet running... that clocks back the processor when it's not working hard which is like 95% of the time.

Prefer cool-n-quiet because I can change the settings from within the OS, without rebooting. Also, unlike other greenies it's not contrary: it lets the processor deliver the cycles when the application demands, every time it demands.

I'm sure there are people who have a need to keep a 5G processor cool 24/7, but I'm certainly not one.

 

[SticksStones]

I'm not worried about the noise. I keep an eye on the temps in games. But I don't need the CPU at 4000MHz + when I'm programming, using photoshop or downstairs watching telly, so I do want it to drop the volts for longevity when idle though. Maybe I should switch both on - probably will.
It's difficult to figure out the difference. Both appear to do the same thing, lower the voltage and core multiplier. I've looked and looked for a clear cut answer on this, but all I find is "I do this" with people contradicting each other or a very technical description running into pages and pages...which tbh I can't be bothered to read and understand...at least not yet.

 

[RGone]

...at least not yet.

Easiest explanation. AMD Turbo Core can monitor and generally change the multipiers and thus cpu speed upward based on a number of things, but that is when it gets complicated.

Cool N Quiet can lower the cpu core speed and voltage when not in heavy use and is likely the better option for those not doing much 95% of the time.

 

[Leito]

With My athlon and Radeon graphic i can set up the min. and maximum CPU clock in CCC. This software changes the CPU multiplier. While writing posts on web etc i I'm setting CPU clock on 800mhz and it's enough. While watching some HD movies on YouTube i need "next step" from CCC - 1800mhz. Of course i can set it, for example for minimum 1800mhz and maximum 2300mhz. I can set it from 800 - 1800 or 800-3000 - min.-max. etc... It's good, because CPU generates less heat, "eats" less power and probably will live a little longer This same thing with CPU fan... It generates less noise. The Gigabytes "Easy Energy Saver" was for Me worse, because sometimes music from WINAMP was lagging and the response time was visible... But this one from CCC is much better.

You can set this up from min. to max. and it will adjust automaticly, but if You wish You can set it up manually - at 800Mhz all the time and by 4 clicks change it whenever You wish...

Running prime95 on 5 minutes is not enough... Just think... Are You turning on a game on 5 minutes? The test should last longer... For example the temperature in room should be higher that usual, maybe 25-30*C And CPU stressed harder (I've heard, that prime95 is stressing CPU harder that any game) and much longer than usually. So if Your average playing time is 3 hours - You should stress it 5 or 6 hours. Only after positive testing in "worst scenario" condition - You can be sure, that Your machine is stable... Many people are leaving PRIME95 on night or 24H test. Even if You will end up positive on for example 240x22 and You system fail on 241x22 then downgrade it a little to daily usage. Of course look out on temperatures too . I am not any experienced overclocker, but i think, that those "tips" are little helpfull

With regards,
Leito.

 

[trents]

The only problem with leaving the green stuff enabled is that if you significantly overclock the CPU the green stuff can cause instability if left in place.

 

[SticksStones]

I've switched them both on again for now, will switch them off when trying to figure out what overclock to use and see if it's still stable after that.

@Leito I don't like CCC, with the GPU you can't do anything with the fan other than have it going at X% all the time. On auto the GPU will get to 90C and the fan will still be at 60%. Also I've heard such programs can be unstable with the CPU.
Normally would run prime95 for longer than 5 mins but I stopped because something didn't seem right...and it wasn't. Personally wouldn't run Prime95 overnight, it will push the temps far higher than any game....what if the temps do climb too high?

I've just got to figure out this new bios and all the new options.

 

[trents]

That Prime95 pushes the temps higher is exactly the point. If it's stable in Prime then for sure it will be stable in any real world app. If you're too hot in Prime you either need to bet better cooling or you need to turn the volts and the overclock down some.

 

[coolbrezz]

i got my fx4100 oced to 4.4ghz under water it normally stays under 50c on prime or aida64

 

[Buddywh]

...
Also I've heard such programs can be unstable with the CPU.
...

CCC uses an AMD service called FUEL that's about as buggy as can be... it was constantly crashing and restarting. I can see the logged events in the Event Viewer.

If you remove the FUEL service, then you can't use CCC to adjust the percent of clock-back that Cool-n-Quiet uses but Win7 allows for that anyway in the Power Options control panel applet.

Open it up then set the power profile you prefer, then click 'Change Plan Settings' for that profile, click on 'Change advanced power settings', then expand 'Processor power management'. It's a little bit buried but it avoids having to use AMD's buggy FUEL service.

The setting are a bit obtuse because it's in percentages, but a little experimenting you can find the break points. An FX processor has 4 different clock speeds it will set to... you can set the maximum speed and the minimum speed it will use. The exact speed at each break point depends on your overclock.

 

[RGone]

Good information man. RGone...ster.

CCC uses an AMD service called FUEL that's about as buggy as can be... it was constantly crashing and restarting. I can see the logged events in the Event Viewer.

If you remove the FUEL service, then you can't use CCC to adjust the percent of clock-back that Cool-n-Quiet uses but Win7 allows for that anyway in the Power Options control panel applet.

Open it up then set the power profile you prefer, then click 'Change Plan Settings' for that profile, click on 'Change advanced power settings', then expand 'Processor power management'. It's a little bit buried but it avoids having to use AMD's buggy FUEL service.

The setting are a bit obtuse because it's in percentages, but a little experimenting you can find the break points. An FX processor has 4 different clock speeds it will set to... you can set the maximum speed and the minimum speed it will use. The exact speed at each break point depends on your overclock.