Help me try and prove the courts wrong

[don256us]

I'm gonna be the next in line to say: Formatting a drive does NOT erase it.

How do I know? This is part of what I do. I recover data for the local Sheriff and cities. A simple 'hex editor' is all that I need. You then asked about writing data to the formatted disk. Most of the time I can still recover enough for a case. There is something called drive slack so that even if you write to a sector, there may still be something left over from the old file that was there on that same sector.

You can use some of the ideas used above to write zero's, etc. Those do work. However, you have to run them. Many police Dpts can easily get a 'No knock' warrent if 1) they think they can get electronic evidence 2) if they think you might do one of the above methods to remove evidence. In other words, if you are doing something wrong, the only knock you might hear is your door hitting the floor. Computers are then unplugged from the back of the case and a boot floppy that prevents writes to any HDD is put in place with evidence tape.

Some people think that you can use the /u switch when formatting. That too does not work. The /u switch will clear a floppy (FAT12) but no other type of media. <-- NO other media.

 

[White Rain]

I dont see why so many people are talking about these ways that will take so long.

I think the poin here is if the cops bust down your door you want to hit the butten and thats the end of it.
not all this o lets go run this app and then this app then how about we open the HD and then take it to the train trax, Im shure the cops are going to let you do all this LOL JK.

So the butten would be the best way but what would the butten do?

i like the vibration thing but i will have to thing about thsi some more and read the butten post

The primacord thing would be intantanious, the second you hit the button it would vaporize due to the temp primacord reaches and it burns at 20000 feet per second, so if you somehow manage do wrap 20,000 feet around your hd ( more likely you'd have a max of 25-50 feet around it, the destruction would take less than a second.

 

[Ninety-9 SE-L]

geez, what are you people doing out there, LOL.

Ok, so if I had a program that wrote in 1s and 0s like 20 times or something that would write in random data (algorithm or such), that would technically be secure enough to keep most affordable recovery methods from finding anything? Since this isn't instantaneous, I would assume just using it at the same time you would normally format a HDD.

As for the 'meltdown' button, I would suggest using a USB2 or IEEE1394 external hard drive enclosure to save all your illegal whatever. Save everything directly to the external HDD so none of it is ever written onto the C: drive. Inside the external enclosure, you could do whatever you want (magnetic field, acid, primacord, etc) and it won't affect anything in the actual computer.

Heck, make your own enclosure. Get just the hardware that converts IDE to USB2, then make a big thick metal case for several HDDs. Have them all connected to your computer VIA USB and them when your door's getting knocked down, BOOM!!!

 

[jcw122]

or "HULK SMASH HARD-DISK DEVIL! SMASH!", are they requiring an intact hardrive or do they have a warrant to inspect the items.

i like this one!

 

[jcw122]

when your door's getting knocked down, BOOM!!!

[/IMG]

and this one...



but what i think should be done...somethign similar to the blow up thing exept somehow get thermite into ur HD...and then wire it all special and then just burn the thing...dude...thermite will leave NOTHING...that stuff can melt through almost any metal! hehehe!

 

[syberspy9]

The primacord thing wont work because of the amount of wraps you could make as you said so that is out.

Acid who is going to want to keep acid in there house beside their computer not me.

the out side of the case HD's is good but things still get written to the C: weather you want it to or not.

and as said above it has to be fast because the cops will just bust down your door and take the pc apart so software 0 'ing things wont work they take time.

seems like haveing your computer beside your appartment window with your external HD sitting on a ledge you made would be the best.
then when the cops come you just pull a string and your HD flys to the ground and well........


SMACK LIKE A PENNY OFF THE EMPIRE STATE BUILDING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

but we dont all live so high up. i need to read the butten post more.
you think that this would be more simple i mean we want to wreck a HD not keep it safe.

 

[White Rain]

Primacord wouldn't need many wraps is what i was meaning .. was stating that it would vaporize in like 1/1000 of a second. one wrap around the trunk of a 6in tree would cut it in two. If you completely wrap it around the outside of the hard drive in one layer would easily do the trick.

But hey, you could always do that, then encase the entire thing in thermite then have it running a safe distance away via usb or firewire inside of a kiln so when you have to hit the button you'll still have an arm left.

 

[syberspy9]

hmh i dont really get this Primacord thing (sorry but i would like to understand it.)

as for the thermite how would you release the thermite so it will eat the HD with a butten>?

 

[White Rain]

http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Detonation cord

There is a good article about what it basically is, take note of the tidbit at the bottom of the page.


Most of what I know about it is from watching discovery channel about when they are doing demolition of buildings or on movie sets when they are blowing things up, they use it to instantly cut through things like lining the inside of prop houses with it or cars to make them blow apart in the manner that they need for the shoot.

It's pretty cool stuff, it won't go off by burning or heat, you have to have an electric charge to set it off just like C4 which would make it safe to handle and put in an enviroment that has a bit of heat.

Wouldn't go off unless you hit the button unlikes some other ideas that have been mentioned....


I personally fear the idea of the beeper hooked up to the explosives in the case.... what if you were at your pc and someone dialed the wrong number???

 

[syberspy9]

etonating cord has been reported to have occasionally been used during wartime to restrain prisoners if no handcuffs were available; the cord was first demonstrated on a tree or other object, then tied to the prisoners.

HAHHAHAHAHA
thats great now i understand.

ok yesthis hooked up to a butten.
with the HD's inside there own little steal box is the way to go hit the butten and bam the hd's are gone as long as you wrap the cord around the hd's properly.

that is the way to go.

but what whould power the butten? you want it to have a batterie or somthing but how mutch power does the cord need to go off?

 

[nissmo300]

Here is what you do:

1. Dig a hole in concrete and bury a HD in cement there with wires comming up.

2. Connect wires to computer.

3. When 5-0 comes to house cut the wires from the floor.

4. No illegal HD found in computer. You're all clear.

 

[White Rain]

I think what they use for detonation (buildings) or movie pyro is a 6v lantern battery (one of those 6in long batteries that are about 3.5in square on the bottom) to set it off. I could be wrong, but I know they use off the shelf batteries, either one of those or 2 tied up to be 12v.

 

[White Rain]

Here is what you do:

1. Dig a hole in concrete and bury a HD in cement there with wires comming up.

2. Connect wires to computer.

3. When 5-0 comes to house cut the wires from the floor.

4. No illegal HD found in computer. You're all clear.

Maybe but when they are really looking for something they are pretty maticulate. Looking in heating grates, above ceiling tiles and the like, not to mention moving furnature around to see if anything is behind them (hidden compartment in the wall ect...

If they saw a power connector and a cut off firewire or usb 2.0 cord sticking out of a couple of holes in the concrete I'd imagine they'd be in there w/ a masonry drill in about 2.5 seconds.






Now that I think about it, if you give the HD some slack to pull it up some then cut them flush so they fall back into the floor unseen and mask them by having them come up through say the coaxial cable hole that goes to your tv they wouldn't ever suspect it.

 

[syberspy9]

Here is what you do:

1. Dig a hole in concrete and bury a HD in cement there with wires comming up.

2. Connect wires to computer.

3. When 5-0 comes to house cut the wires from the floor.

4. No illegal HD found in computer. You're all clear.

I think they will find it even if they dont see the hole were the wires are (if you have enuf time to cut them.

then im shure they will search the house and when they find no HD in the PC they will be like HMH must be one some were.

but the biggest factors is
#1 who digs a hole in there floor? and how acn u if u live in a appartment?
#2 i dought you will have time to cut the wires
its going to be lucky if you press a butten (ie you will have to be at or neer your pc if your not home or in another room then how are you going to get to your PC and cut wires or even press a butten if they have you in cuffs or on the ground kicking the crap out of you?

(REMEMBER THEY THINK YOU ARE GOING TO GRAB A GUN)

 

[White Rain]

You'd need to have a HDD in the pc w/ your os on it and your programs and keep the illegal ones in the floor using the firewire or usb2.0.

The button thing would work but you'd want it to be an external hard drive as to not dmg the rest of your gear when you fire it off, and don't leave it at home you take it w/ you.

Make the external hdd container around the HDD and have the batteries on the inside to detonate the primacord and the button (of course you'd want something like a glass plate to smash through b4 you hit it ie fire alarm so you dont bump it accidently). That way you would alway be able to destroy the evidence leaving them with nothing but circumstancial evidence.

Of course it wouldn't be small as your standard external hdd housing, it'd be about 2x as big, but that's still not so bad, especially considering the security it would provide.

 

[nissmo300]

I think they will find it even if they dont see the hole were the wires are (if you have enuf time to cut them.

then im shure they will search the house and when they find no HD in the PC they will be like HMH must be one some were.

but the biggest factors is
#1 who digs a hole in there floor? and how acn u if u live in a appartment?
#2 i dought you will have time to cut the wires
its going to be lucky if you press a butten (ie you will have to be at or neer your pc if your not home or in another room then how are you going to get to your PC and cut wires or even press a butten if they have you in cuffs or on the ground kicking the crap out of you?

(REMEMBER THEY THINK YOU ARE GOING TO GRAB A GUN)

well you'll have another "clean" drive in the computer the the "dirty" drive in the floor. You'll have a little slack as white rain mentioned so that you'll pull it up a little, cut wires, and drop.

Then you go open the door for the cops or wait until they come to you. They take you away only to find a HD in your computer with no "illegal" stuff in it.

 

[syberspy9]

you guys have to get away fro m the CLEAN DRIVE IN THE PC thing.
the clean drive will still have stuff on it weather you want it to or not.
the hole in the ground wont work.
but the detonation cord thing with a butten and a hd box will work.

 

[White Rain]

You could always have 2 seperate computers, one completely beneath the floor except mouse, kboard (wireless versions) and the monitor, a way to power it on. you could then quickly unplug the monitor from the underground pc (using an extension so you can drop the monitor cord that's attached to the back of the pc under the floor down into the floor. mod the keyboard and mouse so that they work on both pc's at the same time because they run on the same frequency, so when you turn the clean pc on the mouse and keyboard would run on it ( would only have one pc on at a time) only suspicious thing is then is that your monitor isn't plugged into the clean pc, to remedy that all you have to do is remove the securing screws from the monitor plug so you can use the excuse you lost them and it falls off the back of the pc all the time on it's own.


I wouldn't go for that idea personally, too complicated and if they were already looking for you they know you have something to hide anyway, so having something like the primacord HDD death box although suspicious would be the best way to prevent your data from falling into the wrong hands.

 

[Alice]

I totally don't get this. I mean, why use a normal hard drive? Get a ramdrive or something. Hell, get creative: Bubble memory drive. What I'm saying is that there are other, more secure forms of media.

...Or just keep a usb flash drive up your ***.

 

[White Rain]

Love your usb smuggling idea, albeit a tid uncomfortable.

Not sure about the bubble memory drive, I'll have to look that up and get back to you.


Mostly, it's not about understanding the idea, it's just having fun blowing up your hard drive or at least rigging it to and trying to find a way to justify it to your friends and family