Help overclocking an FX4100!

[twiztiddummy]

Hi guys! I'm trying to overclock an FX4100 cpu. I have had it for some time now and want to squeeze the juice out of it. I reached 4.5Ghz just by raising the multiplier to x22.5 and voltage to 1.425v. I also modified the load line calibration (LLC) to the maximum option (100%). It's been stable for 6 hours in P95 I was reading about modifying nb, htt and other voltages for fine tuning and better performance, but didn't want to make such changes till i knew what changes could be made for sure. As a cooling option for the cpu I have the CoolerMaster Hyper T4 so temps are quite ok.

I will post some photos with my rig and temps in idle and stress so that you guys are up to speed with everything. Hope you guys can help! Thanks in advance!

 

[trents]

Did you disable the "green" stuff like Cool N Quiet, C1E, C6, Turbo and APM yet? That's a pretty good overclock on that motherboard which doesn't even have any sinks on the VRM. You're performance is being bottle-necked by your 1333 mhz ram. The FX CPUs will handle 1866 mhz ram nicely and I would look to upgrade that component if I were you. If you do that, go with a different brand than Kingston because for some reason we see a lot of incompatibility with Kingston on AMD systems these days.

 

[twiztiddummy]

yep. did that too. forgot to mention
also raised the ram frequency to 1600 mhz as it seems it was set by default to 1333. RAM are 2 kingston 1600 sticks of 4gb each.

 

[trents]

I edited my post and added some afterthoughts about the ram so you might want to go back and read it. CPU-z shows your ram is still at 1333 mhz.

The motherboard is made to set the ram speed at 1333 mhz. That's the default of many motherboards so you have to manually set it for the higher speeds.

 

[twiztiddummy]

Raised it to 1866 as i had that option in BIOS. They are by default 1600 sticks. I'm testing them to see if they're stable. Thanks for noticing that!

 

[trents]

I will be shocked if your ram is stable at 1866 mhz. If there is any chance it will you would need to give it extra volts and significantly relax the timings. By the way, make sure you use the Prime95 blend test as it does a better job in stressing the ram than does the small FFT option.

 

[twiztiddummy]

started P95 10 mins ago. Everything seems to be ok. will leave it that way for at least 2 hours to be sure. Thanks for the advices! Is there any way I could cool down the motherboard? And i think it has a heatsink on it. Will post a pic:

 

[trents]

This is the VRM area and it has no sinks. The other heatsink you speek of is on the North Bridge. If there is cutout are in the motherboard tray that exposes the socket/VRM area the best approach is to cut a hole in the case side and install a fan to blow on the backside of the socket/VRM area.

 

[RGone]

M5A78L-M/USB3 is mATX with 4+1 VRM phase and no VRM heat sinks. The board is using a two platform backwards chipset and as such will not have a true CPU_LLC circuit and therefore very likely no menu option to disable APM (application power management). The ability to disable APM is a major option choice to keep the current hungry FX processors from throttling when loaded. When and if this cpu throttling occurs is hard to determine. Throttling of FX processors can be initiated by temp and by actual current draw thru the VRM circuit or the cpu itself depending on what the motherboard itself monitors for cpu speed reduction to keep the cheaper boards from destroying themselves.

 

[twiztiddummy]

I am willing to experiment with that. I did a little research and found out that there are some kind of heatsinks that are applicable to my mobo http://www.overclock.net/t/946407/amd-motherboards-vrm-info-database

btw almost an hour of p95 in blend mode and everything still looks great. temps are ok. In any case is there anything more that i could do to squeeze more performance from my rig?

M5A78L-M/USB3 is mATX with 4+1 VRM phase and no VRM heat sinks. The board is using a two platform backwards chipset and as such will not have a true CPU_LLC circuit and therefore very likely no menu option to disable APM (application power management). The ability to disable APM is a major option choice to keep the current hungry FX processors from throttling when loaded. When and if this cpu throttling occurs is hard to determine. Throttling of FX processors can be initiated by temp and by actual current draw thru the VRM circuit or the cpu itself depending on what the motherboard itself monitors for cpu speed reduction to keep the cheaper boards from destroying themselves.

@RGone - thanks for the info! any options on disabling the APM without using the bios?

Just had a look into bios and in power setting i have APM Configuration. Is that it?

 

[trents]

If it shows APM then that's it.

 

[twiztiddummy]

If it shows APM then that's it.

Everything is off and disabled so I guess that's ok. BIG thanks trents!

I will look further for some options that i might have in cooling the VRM cause i really don't wanna buy another motherboard.

 

[trents]

twiztiddummy, you're squeezing a lot out of that 780G chipset motherboard; more than I would have ever thought possible. That latest bios update from Asus must have done wonders.

 

[trents]

You can also purchase mosfet heatsink kits for the 'fets which is the most fragile part of the VRM. The mosfets are the tiny flat black rectangular chips that are in rows behind the capacitors that sit next to the socket.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...E16835708012&gclid=CKDrsbqew7cCFWKCQgodYgQAXw

 

[twiztiddummy]

twiztiddummy, you're squeezing a lot out of that 780G chipset motherboard; more than I would have ever thought possible. That latest bios update from Asus must have done wonders.

Thank you. You're probably right and perhaps it's time I stop at 4.5 Ghz. I am very pleased with what i accomplished so far. Thank you for all the useful info you gave me!

Later edit: If those fit it would be great. I guess they have to be applied with something.

 

[RGone]

in power setting i have APM Configuration = Nope that is the older Advanced Power Management setting and not the newer FX APM-en that arrived with the FX processors. I will not say that the newer APM-en could not have been put into that area by a bios writer, but to date, I know of NO older chiipset boards that have the newer FX APM-en setting as in option to Disable, since it is just Off or On or Disabled or Enabled and no other distinctions.

As I try and examine your captured images, I am astounded. That you are at 4.5Ghz with about 1.4Vcore or just a little more seems so unreal. Maybe I have worked with the 6core and 8core processors more than I realize. Then to see the temps you seem to be experiencing, is another eye-popper to me. Startled might be a better way to describe how looking at your volts and temps has made me. You seem to be in about a top 1% of air cooling users as my memory seems to remind me. Consider yourself very fortunate.

Now beyond being startled, I suspect that a bit of contemplation might be in order. If you are n0t seeing any weird cpu throtling, then I might suggest remaining basically where you are. Why? All of us that push these FX processors see the cpu voltage as needing X amount to get to a pretty fair overclock. AFTER that each 100Mhz of cpu speed seems to take a pretty darn great amount of added cpu voltage to get up over the next 100Mhz cpu speed jump. That pretty hefty cpu voltage increase also brings more heat and more current required from the VRM circuit and boom the whole thing seems to go to h*ll in a handbasket. Just where that happens is usually moving from 4.5Ghz to the next 4.6Ghz and you are right there. Will yours exhibit what we call stair-stepping of the Vcore and temps, it will somewhere when raising the cpu speed. Will it be at the jump from 4.5Ghz to 4.6Ghz? Probably since most get hit right about that point.

So understanding or at least knowing what is experienced by 99.9% of the FX users, I suggest you remain about where you are. You have been more fortunate than 99% of the people we have seen in the forum. To just be hungry for more may be the straw loaded on the camel that breaks its' back.

Friends of mine that have used an FX 4 core as well as their 6 and 8 core cpus have found 4.3 to 4.5Ghz to be a good sweet spot for their 4 core FX processor. AND they have found that to see much extra power/performance they need to get up to about 4.9Ghz. A big jump for any real sign of extra performance. A TX4 cpu cooler just will not get your there stable. The friends of mine that jump from a good place at around 4.5Ghz are on pretty hefty water-cooling and are able to absorb the extra heat of the jump to 4.9Ghz.

I doubt after all is said and done that I would even want to disable APM-en and risk my motherboard when you seem to be in a very elite group of users seen to date. You are perhaps not throttling and that is very awesome in my mind. The board seems holding up to the load of 4.5Ghz. I would likely leave well enough alone rather than move just a little and have the situation degenerate quicker than I can type it.
RGone...

 

[trents]

The mosfet heat sink kits generally come with adhesive teflon sticky pads to attach them or you can purchase an epoxy-based TIM adhesive like: http://www.arcticsilver.com/ta.htm. The latter is a better, more long term solution.

 

[trents]

I'm attaching some pics of the mod I did to my case to cool the backside of the socket/VRM area.

 

[twiztiddummy]

in power setting i have APM Configuration = Nope that is the older Advanced Power Management setting and not the newer FX APM-en that arrived with the FX processors. I will not say that the newer APM-en could not have been put into that area by a bios writer, but to date, I know of NO older chiipset boards that have the newer FX APM-en setting as in option to Disable, since it is just Off or On or Disabled or Enabled and no other distinctions.

As I try and examine your captured images, I am astounded. That you are at 4.5Ghz with about 1.4Vcore or just a little more seems so unreal. Maybe I have worked with the 6core and 8core processors more than I realize. Then to see the temps you seem to be experiencing, is another eye-popper to me. Startled might be a better way to describe how looking at your volts and temps has made me. You seem to be in about a top 1% of air cooling users as my memory seems to remind me. Consider yourself very fortunate.

Now beyond being startled, I suspect that a bit of contemplation might be in order. If you are n0t seeing any weird cpu throtling, then I might suggest remaining basically where you are. Why? All of us that push these FX processors see the cpu voltage as needing X amount to get to a pretty fair overclock. AFTER that each 100Mhz of cpu speed seems to take a pretty darn great amount of added cpu voltage to get up over the next 100Mhz cpu speed jump. That pretty hefty cpu voltage increase also brings more heat and more current required from the VRM circuit and boom the whole thing seems to go to h*ll in a handbasket. Just where that happens is usually moving from 4.5Ghz to the next 4.6Ghz and you are right there. Will yours exhibit what we call stair-stepping of the Vcore and temps, it will somewhere when raising the cpu speed. Will it be at the jump from 4.5Ghz to 4.6Ghz? Probably since most get hit right about that point.

So understanding or at least knowing what is experienced by 99.9% of the FX users, I suggest you remain about where you are. You have been more fortunate than 99% of the people we have seen in the forum. To just be hungry for more may be the straw loaded on the camel that breaks its' back.

Friends of mine that have used an FX 4 core as well as their 6 and 8 core cpus have found 4.3 to 4.5Ghz to be a good sweet spot for their 4 core FX processor. AND they have found that to see much extra power/performance they need to get up to about 4.9Ghz. A big jump for any real sign of extra performance. A TX4 cpu cooler just will not get your there stable. The friends of mine that jump from a good place at around 4.5Ghz are on pretty hefty water-cooling and are able to absorb the extra heat of the jump to 4.9Ghz.

I doubt after all is said and done that I would even want to disable APM-en and risk my motherboard when you seem to be in a very elite group of users seen to date. You are perhaps not throttling and that is very awesome in my mind. The board seems holding up to the load of 4.5Ghz. I would likely leave well enough alone rather than move just a little and have the situation degenerate quicker than I can type it.
RGone...

Thank you for the long post and for saying that! What can I say? I probably am very lucky because right now after 2 and a half hours the system is still stable and not throttling. The CPU reaches a max of 49 degrees. I could probably try my luck having that temp with P95 stress testing, but i won't. As you said I could risk my motherboard and honestly I don't wanna try. Maybe after I'll buy those mosfet heatsinks i'll give it a try. Till then I wish you all the best!

I'm attaching some pics of the mod I did to my case to cool the backside of the socket/VRM area.

That looks great! I might try that myself. Those heatsinks are out of my reach cause i'm not from the US and don't know if newegg ships in EU. Will post tomorrow an update as I really wanna try that!

 

[trents]

I'm sure you can get an equivalent mosfet heat sink product on your side of the pond. Maybe some of our UK forum members can suggest an etailer over there.