The HATE for sony discussed in vivid detail please

[Zatrix]

every movie commerical i see always ends like this:

Available at stores on (whatever date) and on psp portable

 

[OC Noob]

John Carmack did not do Diakatana, John Romero did. John Romero also helped start up Ion Storm which are the offices in Dallas you are talking about. I went to the opening party they had there and it was an amazing office and great party. Waste of money, but amazing.

Carmack did started ID. They did the original Wolfenstien, Doom, Doom II, Quake, Quake II, Doom III, etc. He's a great engine dev. Much more than John Romero. Romero didn't really design too much worth mentioning.

Now, to the topic. I hate Sony for what they did to SWG. I could careless about anything else but the destroyed a game that I really enjoyed.

WELCOME

Good call on that. I remeber the name Diakatana being thrown around, but am not familiar with it at all. For all I knew Britney Spears could have developed it.

...but the Xbox managed to take a significant amount of market space because of the fact that it was more powerful. I already posted about this. In games that are released for both systems people will have a tendancy to buy the PS3 version because it will look and play better. Just as people bought Xbox games over PS3 games. And that year difference between the releases? It's SIGNIFICANT. As proved, once again, in Xbox vs. PS2.

The 360 is by no means the slouch that the PS2 was, but they are still ironing out the kinks in the Cell. Will be for the next year or so. Once you can actually use all the pipes of the system... it'll be reckoning day.

So you know I base my opinion on what Carmack and other game developers are saying, what are you basing your opinion on?

 

[rainless]

WELCOME

Good call on that. I remeber the name Diakatana being thrown around, but am not familiar with it at all. For all I knew Britney Spears could have developed it.




So you know I base my opinion on what Carmack and other game developers are saying, what are you basing your opinion on?

Specs for the PS3 versus specs for the 360. The fact that the 360 was released a year ago and the PS3 will be released in two weeks. All the video I've seen from the Tokyo Game Show and other game shows. (And still images and private video that friends have sent me from Tokyo.)

The PS3 simply has greater potential. There was never any question about the fact that the Xbox and Gamecube looked better than the PS2. Even just before those systems were released. There is also no question that the PS3 games look better... and will look better... than their Xbox 360 and Wii counterparts. I've personally already seen NBA Live, and NBA 2K6. And Marvel Ultimate Alliance. Just to name a few games that I've seen on PS3 and 360 already. PS3 looks better hands down.

 

[FudgeNuggets]

You're full of it Rainman,
EVERY interview with game developers have had them stating that the PS3 CPU is SLIGHTLY more powerful and the 360 GPU is SLIGHTLY more powerful but the 360 has 2x the RAM that the PS3 does and all in all it makes them turn out looking pretty much equal but makes the 360 easier to program for. The screens you're seeing are all pre-rendered anyway. People who have actually played the PS3 say that the games range from looking like crap to being equal to the 360.

Here is the most recent example:
http://www.news4gamers.com/industrynews/News-13649.aspx

 

[OC Noob]

Specs for the PS3 versus specs for the 360. The fact that the 360 was released a year ago and the PS3 will be released in two weeks. All the video I've seen from the Tokyo Game Show and other game shows. (And still images and private video that friends have sent me from Tokyo.)

The PS3 simply has greater potential. There was never any question about the fact that the Xbox and Gamecube looked better than the PS2. Even just before those systems were released. There is also no question that the PS3 games look better... and will look better... than their Xbox 360 and Wii counterparts. I've personally already seen NBA Live, and NBA 2K6. And Marvel Ultimate Alliance. Just to name a few games that I've seen on PS3 and 360 already. PS3 looks better hands down.

Were they running on the same TV and max settings for both AND are you sure your opinion isn't just a little bit biased?

There are a lot of people in the media who have seen the PS3 in action and I haven't seen it mentioned once that the gfx look better now that people are seeing real in game stuff and getting the chance to play stuff.

ps did anyone hear anything about Capcom going multiplatform with ALL of its next gen games in the future (they claim Capcom's CEO said it)? Someone at Teamxbox.com linked an article in a different language and it said Devil May Cry 4 would be multiplatform too, but I can't believe that. Especially since it hasn't come out in any reputable english sites. Anyone seen anything on this?

http://forum.teamxbox.com/showthread.php?t=481187

 

[rainless]

You're full of it Rainman,
EVERY interview with game developers have had them stating that the PS3 CPU is SLIGHTLY more powerful and the 360 GPU is SLIGHTLY more powerful but the 360 has 2x the RAM that the PS3 does and all in all it makes them turn out looking pretty much equal but makes the 360 easier to program for. The screens you're seeing are all pre-rendered anyway. People who have actually played the PS3 say that the games range from looking like crap to being equal to the 360.

Here is the most recent example:
http://www.news4gamers.com/industrynews/News-13649.aspx

Right. Now YOU'RE full of it.

I'm talking about in-game footage I've seen of at least three games (the ones I just mentioned) that exist on both systems. And if you JUST admitted that both the CPU and GPU are more powerful... then why is it such a stretch to believe that the games look better.

(And I dare say if ANYBODY's a little biased... it would have to be the Fudge man... I haven't made a SINGLE Sony thread, and Fudge has... what?... a good half-dozen ANTI-sony threads?)

 

[Shell]

Right. Now YOU'RE full of it.

I'm afraid you are, I've seen a PS3 and a 360 operating side-by side and they both look just as good. In fact... because the 360 has more RAM, it had higher-res textures, and the PS3 has better shading... but lots of RAM in a console has proven very useful.
And many PS3 games will in fact be 720p and 1080i instead of 1080p just to keep up with the 360 which is now capable of 1080p.

And the reason why all of these Sony flameing threads have come up... well, let's just say that Sony has been summoning it for a while... lies, and bad marketing are just the beginning.

My friend's laptop caught on fire(few flames, mostly smoke), thanks to Sony's batteries, my Cell phone got fried, thanks to a faulty Sony transformer by Hipro.

The other reasons why I hate sony: NONE of their products have lasted more then 2 years on me, an LCD, a plasma, a radio alarm clock, an amplifier... and 2 CRTs, none of them lasted more then 25 months... good thing I was lured into getting extended warranties on anything expensive.

 

[OC Noob]

I stole this from Kenny K at gamersreports.com:

"

QUOTE(optaviusx @ Nov 1 2006, 02:41 PM)

The 360 has more ram to work with than the PS3.

The ps3 uses its 256MB of GDDR3 for textures (which is the ram for rsx) Its possible for RSX to texture from XDR, but it would need to travel over the cell's flexio and as a result there is a penalty for texturing from XDR. Or they could use the XDR sorta like a fast cache and stream it all in.

The ps3's os reserves 32MB of ram from the GDDR3 ram and 64MB from the XDR. The 360's os only takes away 32MB of ram from the unified 512MB GDDR memory. Not only that the 360 uses memory much more efficiently than the ps3. For example for a 720p resolution with 4XFSAA the ps3 would require to use 28MB of ram. The 360 accomplishes this with just 16MB a lot of valuable memory being saved there.

Many other memory saving features I wont bother going into right now, but the 360 has more RAM to work with than the PS3 no matter how we look at it.

your close optivious on some of your numbers. the OS for the ps3 actually takes up a little bit more then 96MB of memory, i cant go into specifics because of restrictions but trust me its a bit higher.

also on the 360 the 32MB quote is including the sound from games, not just the OS. the OS for the 360 only takes a little less then 16MB of memory.

here is the OS breakdown for the two systems to put it all together:

PS3:
-1 SPE used for OS 24/7
-1 SPE on stand-by, can be taken over by OS at any moment (game code will NOT run to this SPE)
-96+ MB of memory used by OS
-leaves 1 thread on PPE and 5 SPEs for game development code and execution.

360:
-.5%-2% of the second thread on cores 1 and 2 reserved for OS (cores are labeled core0, core1, and core2 in game development.)
-16MB of memory reserved for OS

to clarify, the OS in these systems includes the dash, guide, menues, OS kernal, and such.

so in total we have a little less then 416MB of memory in the ps3 and in the 360 around 496MB of memory; yes this DOES make a difference. Both systems are capable of handling 6 hardware threads at a time, this does not mean that it can not handle more then 6 software threads though.

as for the question of accessing the XDR memory for RSX, it can be done but its so bottlenecked and not efficient enough to be used in real world programming.

dev quotes on the memory differences:

QUOTE
"Further to the Edge comments this month about how much better Call Of Duty 3 looks on 360 in comparison to the PS3 version, I noticed this in GamesTM this month On Rainbow Six Vegas.....

'' .....a chat with the Ubisoft development team shed a little light on he matter."All I'm able to say is that we're looking to ship on PS3 as well but we're not having specific content.....we're developing with 360 as our main development platform and porting to PS3 means that there's less memory available for us to use, but we're trying to minimise any drop in quality"..Such comments sugget that the gap in performance between Playstation3 and Xbox 360 is nowhere near as powerful as some would like us to believe and that the console may even be less able than Microsoft's..."

They also go on to say that only the 360 version will feature the face mapping technolgy and that their are no plans for PS3/PSP linkage or to use the sixaxis tilt technology."

http://www.maxconsole.net/?mode=news&newsid=10742

QUOTE
GI: What do you like about working on the PS3? How about the Xbox 360? Will there be any major differences between the two versions?

Högdahl: So far the two versions look pretty much the same – quite unsurprisingly, since we use the same shader source code and content for both platforms. They will be identical gameplay-wise. There will only be very minor cosmetic differences, such as the PS3 will have better quality video for the in-game TVs and on the Xbox 360 we have a bit more room for textures in memory.

http://www.gameinformer.com/Magazine...1042.51750.htm

hope this answers your question. if you would like to know anything else please ask and i will answer what i could without getting any associate or myself in trouble "

 

[Lt. Max]

on the topic of PS2 which ended on page 1 i am surprised nobody has mentioned these two words: Gran Turismo. Most of the people i know or hang out with have bought PS2 based on simply that game, the best driving simulator ever (pretty much). That series even on the old ps2 is one of the top driving games in graphics and playability.

anyways.. if i get my hands on a ps3 im flipping it on ebay. nuff said

the blue-ray and hd-dvd war is going to be interesting.. i wasnt around when betamax and vhs wrestled but honestly, sony's idea is (again) more complicated so chances are people will go for the cheaper tech.

Marko

 

[rainless]

I stand by something else written on the last page: Eventually, every single one of these people complaining about Sony and talking about how the PS3 isn't as powerful as everyone says...

...will HAVE a PS3.

'Nuff said.

 

[Falcon-K]

I wont, I never bought a PS2 and no desire to buy a ps3

 

[rainless]

I wont, I never bought a PS2 and no desire to buy a ps3

You're one exception out of MILLIONS. Even Fudge "Burn-down-Sony-HQ/Save-the-World" Nuggets bought a PS2.

 

[Shell]

You're one exception out of MILLIONS. Even Fudge "Burn-down-Sony-HQ/Save-the-World" Nuggets bought a PS2.

I bought a PS2... it almost caught on fire... now I have another PS2, I got it off Sony after threating to sue them.
Will I pay for a PS3? Hell No!
Unless it caught on fire and I actually sued Sony... then I'll use the money to open a gaming bar full of Wii and 360s.

Sony was much better years ago... back when administration was run by the original founders who actually gave a crap about more then the money.
They've took a slide.

I once was a sony fan...

 

[rainless]

Me personally, I won't be getting a PS3... least not when it comes out. I can't afford one. (Well MAYBE I can't afford one. I do have to trade in about 20 or thirty games I've got lying around.) I'd personally rather have a 360. Just so I can finally FINALLY play Ninja Gaiden.

 

[UnseenMenace]

Originally Posted by Oni :-
I'm sick of reading half-baked facts about numbers, prices, and game releases. I'm sick of the bias towards console x over console z. Who cares, really? Did a certain console call your mom fat, or insult your girlfriend? Probably not. I don't understand the defensiveness that most fanboys display (console or otherwise).

There is little evidence imho to suggest that either the PS2 of XBox is vastly superior to one another and I expect the same of the Xbox360 and PS3..

This is turning quickly into a pointless fanboy thread similar to which is better Nvidia or ATI when the reality is that both are very capable products for what is intended.

Lets get this back on track before the thread is closed... the question was related to HATE for Sony and was not XBox vs PS3 related

 

[rainless]

There is little evidence imho to suggest that either the PS2 of XBox is vastly superior to one another and I expect the same of the Xbox360 and PS3..

This is turning quickly into a pointless fanboy thread similar to which is better Nvidia or ATI when the reality is that both are very capable products for what is intended.

Lets get this back on track before the thread is closed... the question was related to HATE for Sony and was not XBox vs PS3 related

Well I think the well has been dipped dry.

 

[FudgeNuggets]

I stand by something else written on the last page: Eventually, every single one of these people complaining about Sony and talking about how the PS3 isn't as powerful as everyone says...

...will HAVE a PS3.

'Nuff said.

I'll have one but not until the bugs are worked out and the prices come down. I got screwed with broken PS1s and PS2s, not happening again.

 

[blueswitch]

I would like to mention the comment on the PS2 in relations to xbox.....xbox hardware wise could run circles around the PS2 and the difference will not be so vast this gen. And saying that the PS3 is coming out a year after 360 is a mark of it having newer better components (or eluding to) is rubish. Fact is the PS3 was supposed to come out 6 months after 360 but do to all the problems with cell and blu-ray it's taken them a year to get it out...and thats only with huge shortages. Thats after they disabled one of the cells because processor yields were so low trying to get the initial 8 cells. Also I think how developers are able to program with multiple threads is going to be a huge factor with these two, as well as PC's this gen. I read that once a cell has been initiated for a task, shading or whatever it can't be taken off that task whether it's being used or not. however the 360 can dynamically assign task to their threads and when their not using them pool them back and assign another task, thats a huge advantage.

 

[OC Noob]

There is little evidence imho to suggest that either the PS2 of XBox is vastly superior to one another and I expect the same of the Xbox360 and PS3..

This is turning quickly into a pointless fanboy thread similar to which is better Nvidia or ATI when the reality is that both are very capable products for what is intended.

Lets get this back on track before the thread is closed... the question was related to HATE for Sony and was not XBox vs PS3 related

It's relevant. Part of the "hate" is based on lies and half truths including one of the biggies Sony keeps telling, which is their claim that their system is vastly more powerful than the competition (360 its true concerning the Wii though) and that the output will be MUCH better than the 360.

But if you say stop, you got it.

So what was the topic again? Oh yeah its a hate thread...