The NRZ N2 Waterblock Beta Thread

[EarthDog]

1. What version of p95?
2. No, I mean test length needs to be at least 30 mins for the loop to normalize and saturate.
3. https://www.amazon.com/Phobya-Inline-Temperature-Sensor-Matte/dp/B00EUREX1G
4. I assume you measured off the cpu in hand?
5. https://modmymods.com/barrowch-g1-4-oled-display-flow-meter-v2-black-fbft03-v2-black.html
6. Ok...whenever you settle on a config, dont change it for testing otherwise, you are testing variables other than the block.

 

[thenrz]

1. What version of p95?
2. No, I mean test length needs to be at least 30 mins for the loop to normalize and saturate.
3. https://www.amazon.com/Phobya-Inline-Temperature-Sensor-Matte/dp/B00EUREX1G
4. I assume you measured off the cpu in hand?
5. https://modmymods.com/barrowch-g1-4-oled-display-flow-meter-v2-black-fbft03-v2-black.html
6. Ok...whenever you settle on a config, dont change it for testing otherwise, you are testing variables other than the block.

1. Whatever the newest version is on the Prime95 site which is V29.8 build 6.
2. Affordable, i'll order maybe a half dozen of them up later in the week. Hope I can get a quantity discount...
3. I requested this information from Intel and AMD as an interested manufacturer, and I really got a lot of weird replies. I used a laser 3D scanner on an i7700K as I didn't have a Ryzen in hand at the time. The resolution of this scanner isn't the best, so i had to generalize some things.
4. I'll check around since that isn't in stock.
5. I'm just getting the testbed put together. I need to make sure I am not testing on a subpar system, so the first step is to make sure that each component is functioning within what one considers to be a performance envelope. Data will be gathered after this without changing any other variable, and this will allow said data to be analyzed without fear of tampering. I don't have any intention of blowing smoke into any orifice and this includes my own. If I'm doing this, I need to do this right.

Let's be honest, in materials and tooling alone I am already well on my way to spending a good bit of money. There is a lot of facets to this thing that many wouldn't realize extraneous to the actual design of the block. As one person, I am not making the optimal decision the first shot sometimes and end up having to re-buy specific items in a different size, thread, gauge, etc. I'll be the first to admit that, but mistakes lead to data and the data allows future decisions to tend towards correctness. I think that having a block that works, performs within a reasonable envelope for not having many things revised, and mounts with a completely custom mounting solution is a great start. After the beginning of next week, I will have more available machine time and I can finally get going with ideas. I have pretty good size plates of tellurium copper 145 and brass 360 as well as some 303 stainless for a future idea.

I bought the stuff to electroplate nickel... but it's seriously hard for me to give up copper's drastically better thermal conductivity. I'd much rather just clean the block more often than to sacrifice 200+ W/m K... but the industry seems to have gone the way of electroplating, so I must be missing something. Anyone care to elaborate on this?

 

[trents]

In your own testing you will need to keep track of changes in ambient temperatures. From what you describe in your household concerning the discrepancy between the bio thermostats of you and your lady it may vary quite a bit from time to time. Ambient temperature changes have a direct, 1:1 effect on processor temps when using air or water cooling. And if you are testing in a small, close room it may heat up a few degrees during testing by the heat generated by the system you are testing.

Details like these will tell the story of whether your project is actually producing a superior product since if it does turn out to give superior performance compared to others on the market the differential will not likely be huge. Most likely a few degrees at best since the limiting factor is still the reality that the heat exchange is ultimately accomplished by ambient temp air, a parameter that kind of creates the same limitation for everyone doing this.

 

[thenrz]

In your own testing you will need to keep track of changes in ambient temperatures. From what you describe in your household concerning the discrepancy between the bio thermostats of you and your lady it may vary quite a bit from time to time. Ambient temperature changes have a direct, 1:1 effect on processor temps when using air or water cooling. And if you are testing in a small, close room it may heat up a few degrees during testing by the heat generated by the system you are testing.

Already doing this. I have a thermocouple probe with leads inside and outside of the case. My office/spare bedroom area isn't small so that's not an issue. The delta T is really the name of the game here. The numbers will follow a curve based upon ambient temps. Seeing 73C in my initial test would have probably meant the room was 2C cooler give or take of course.

I have some fans on order, but the rest will have to wait until the weekend or early next week. I am really quite fortunate to have the ability to continue working with Ohio's stay at home order, and to be honest I am cleaning up right now with overtime... but of course there are a lot of things pertinent to life outside of this that require funds, so I need to meter what I am spending. I am keeping track of expenditures, though, as if I end up going the LLC route or otherwise, I want to be sure my expenses can be deducted should it end up that way.

 

[thenrz]

So, tomorrow I will end up with a 3900X. A very close friend of mine is really having a hard time with the situation we all find ourselves in, and he was in the process of putting together a build. Long story short, I am going to buy+ship him an RX570 or similar graphics card and trade him my 3600X for his 3900X. He can't return it, and can't afford to buy a card to complete his build. It is super important for him to have a PC right now as he does a lot of contracting work and needs to try and generate some extra income asap. Sooo, I think I should be able to stress my block beyond what I expected.

 

[trents]

Sounds like a good deal for both of you.

 

[Blaylock]

That's just a good deal all around.

 

[thenrz]

Well, I grabbed it this morning on my way to work. Part of feels really bad that I got it for a deal from a good friend... but I really didn't need it and have already spent too much lately on everything pertaining to my computer and more so the N2 block. I keep telling myself that if he is happy with the deal then I should be as well. Dropped off an old ATI HD4850 for him to use in the interim. One has to use some pretty ancient drivers to make it work, but unless you want to game it will work just fine until I get the new one ordered and shipped to him.

Had a crazy storm that started around 11:30pm last night. I was half asleep and was awoken by the full on air raid/tornado sirens going off. Then my phone starts blasting the ews tones with a seek shelter immediately message. I was outside my garage until the last minute watching it roll in. The lightning alone was like nothing I have seen since probably the 2003 storms that rolled through this area in August of that year. It was so constant that I could see the clouds like it was daytime. I started to hear a very low train like sound as the gust front approached, and my heart started beating out of my chest. Last time I heard that there was a tornado a half mile away. I ran inside and stood at the top of the basement steps with the door open just listening to the hail, rain, and wind blast the house. My fiancee kept telling me to come downstairs all the way, but I had to know what was going on. Really brutal. There may have been a tornado a bit northwest of here and another one about 2.5 miles west of my house. Needless to say, I was up a while after all that.

Will report back when I get the new CPU and block installed again. I think a prime 95 test is in order as soon as possible here.

 

[EarthDog]

I had no idea you were in NE Ohio... I'm from Solon!

We got hit with that same line a few hours later (about 2:30A). I remember hearing those winds from a derecho a few years back... it sounded almost no different than a real Tornado... crazy. Glad you are safe!

 

[thenrz]

I had no idea you were in NE Ohio... I'm from Solon!

We got hit with that same line a few hours later (about 2:30A). I remember hearing those winds from a derecho a few years back... it sounded almost no different than a real Tornado... crazy. Glad you are safe!

I work in Warrensville Heights, so not far from there at all. I live in southeastern Medina county right now, but I am probably moving up more towards work within the next 6 months.

I was up in the UP of Michigan when that derecho hit. I heard the stories, though. The storms from 2003 in August, they hit 3 out of 4 days, and every day got progressively worse. The final day was the day I saw my first of two tornadoes and it was within eyeshot of my parent's kitchen. We lived on some land in the woods, and we had 7 trees down across the driveway alone. I know the bill for the tree guys was over 5 figures, and I am sure my dad was super thankful insurance at that moment. That was the day I became really interested in the weather... if I didn't go CS in college, I would have gone meteorology for sure. Sometimes I wish I would have done just that!

 

[EarthDog]

I'm from the Bedford area... right off Northfield Road across from Bedford HS (those apts across the street there). My mother went to Warrenville high in the mid 70s.

Anyway, small world... thanks for keeping updated...

 

[Zerileous]

If you feel bad about the deal spend a bit more on the GPU. $200 can get him a RX 5500XT 8GB.

Glad you all stayed safe in the storms, I love thunderstorms but it sure can get real fast.

 

[trents]

I'm jealous of you guys there in mid America. We never get any exciting weather here in the Pacific Northwest. We don't get any coverage from the Weather Channel.

 

[thenrz]

I'm jealous of you guys there in mid America. We never get any exciting weather here in the Pacific Northwest. We don't get any coverage from the Weather Channel.

The late night surprise tornado warning is not something you want, trust me on that...

If you feel bad about the deal spend a bit more on the GPU. $200 can get him a RX 5500XT 8GB.

Glad you all stayed safe in the storms, I love thunderstorms but it sure can get real fast.

I thought about this, but if I go against our handshake agreement, he's going to force me to take money back or something. He's a great guy, but a bit proud. What I am going to do is get an RX 580 and try to play dumb. He isn't that knowledgeable on these things as to notice one number...



Posted is my 10 minute Prime95 run on the new CPU, Small FFTs. I'm confused by the results. 130W continuously, rock stable at 59C.

View attachment 209483

How can I be 15 degrees less... I was waiting for the uptick in temps after 4-5 minutes as with the 3600X, but that didn't happen. Either I nailed my mounting this time, or I'm missing something. I really need the temperature probes on the inlet and outlet all over the place to understand what the heck is happening here. If 59C on a hotter chip is actually my number, then I'll be damned... But I am thinking there is something else at play.

This is bothering me. I should be excited, but I am just kind of perturbed that something changed so drastically. Everything else stayed the same, except I am carrying double the cores and a higher TDP. I was pushing 100W before and I am 30% above that now. Wait... could it be that the IHS is doing a better job at spreading out the heat from more chiplets rather than concentrated in one spot? Hmmm, this seems like a logical supposition.

 

[trents]

The newest release of Prime95 cycles through periods of very intense load followed by long periods of less intense loads. 10 minute is just not a long enough stress test with P95. If you really want to exercise your CPU and your cooling, give the good ole' Intel Burn Test (IBT) a try. It'll get the CPU's tongue hanging out in a hurry. Set it to Maximum. Another stress tester that is quicker to get you heated up than P95 is OCCT.

 

[thenrz]

The newest release of Prime95 cycles through periods of very intense load followed by long periods of less intense loads. 10 minute is just not a long enough stress test with P95. If you really want to exercise your CPU and your cooling, give the good ole' Intel Burn Test (IBT) a try. It'll get the CPU's tongue hanging out in a hurry. Set it to Maximum. Another stress tester that is quicker to get you heated up than P95 is OCCT.

I will give those a try. What has me confused is an apples to apples comparison between my previous CPU and this one. Same test, same parameters, backwards results. Once I give my thermal paste a day with some of the lighter stuff, I will go for maximum stress. I'm not sure how much more than 130W can be passed through this chip, but call me a ryzen noob. I was wayyyy more knowledgeable about things like k8.

 

[trents]

It is nearly impossible to harm these chips. They won't let you. They will throttle back and drop vcore if experiencing too much power draw. AMD has done a masterful job of building voltage, amperage, temp and frequency algorithms into the chip logic to prevent harm to the unit and they work very well. I would worry more about motherboard mosfets than the CPU.

 

[thenrz]

View attachment 209484

That's minute 8 after accidentally hovering over the stop button and clicking it after 4 minutes initially. So, 12 minutes with a 3 or 4 second break. 145W... that's awesome.

 

[trents]

I like it because it's so quick. In my overclocking days it was very handy and helped me rough in the overclock quickly. No waiting for an hour or more to discover you're not stable after all. I think it only has AVX 1 since the developer dropped the project sometime in 2012. But since you're not overclocking in your project you don't have to worry about being unstable for some kinds of instruction sets. You're just working with temps.

 

[Blaylock]

How is that CPU configured in BIOS? Are you running it stock or do you have a manual overclock? Are you running with all the "green" switches disabled? If you're running stock the CPU will adjust it's voltage and clocks based on the amount of cooling provided. It makes ryzen a very difficult CPU for testing cooling capabilities because of the wide range of variables. It's almost impossible to make an empirical test with it.


Side note: I've been through some hellacious storms going through Ohio. Last year we just missed the tornado that hit Dayton while we we're riding our motorcycles home from a week long road trip.