I really find Linux useless for most things

[Archer0915]

and I really believe there is some sort of backdoor kickback system where Microshaft gives some sort of perks to companies so they do not develop software for Linux.

Since the days that I was into Linux (think 90s) not much has changed. Sure there are more apps but... no quicken, no heavy duty office app packages (hey I like Open and Libre) that can work with other software. I don't know, perhaps I am just getting bored with MS. And yes, I am typing this on a Linux system.

 

[petteyg359]

no quicken, no heavy duty office app packages (hey I like Open and Libre)

Yet to find anything Word can do that Writer can't. Same for Excel and Calc. Granted some businesses are using Excel or Access where they should be using a real database with a purpose-built application, but if you're using the wrong tool for the job, you can't blame another OS for not having that stupidly wrong tool available.

Also, Quicken? Who uses Quicken these days? GnuCash is guaranteed better unless you need the whole "connect to online accounts" thing, and if you need that, just use the online version of Quicken, since an offline version kind of defeats the point there

 

[caddi daddi]

I like using Linux, apache runs better on it, samba runs better on it, blender runs better on it, foam runs better on it, susprog runs better on it, dassault systemes, draftsight runs better on it, autodesk runs on it, I'm trying to find one thing that runs better under windows........, AH, got it, malware runs better on windows. If I pick the right disro and don't make it a bloated pig it uses less resources than windows and so my software performs better eg; using lean pup and not fatdog64.
and when it comes to options, more often than not, more options than I need to even know about, Linux has plenty of options and windows has few, but at least I don't often delete my home directory when simply trying to change to my home directory under windows.

 

[Archer0915]

Yet to find anything Word can do that Writer can't. Same for Excel and Calc. Granted some businesses are using Excel or Access where they should be using a real database with a purpose-built application, but if you're using the wrong tool for the job, you can't blame another OS for not having that stupidly wrong tool available.

Also, Quicken? Who uses Quicken these days? GnuCash is guaranteed better unless you need the whole "connect to online accounts" thing, and if you need that, just use the online version of Quicken, since an offline version kind of defeats the point there

Use some engineering programs with Linux please! Seriously Linux is seriously lacking support from the professional end of things. And I have many accounts and I need quicken. I must have the access to online accounts and since MS killed money...

Try doing advanced work with Calc or using SigmaXL. You can write excel programs easier than writing them in any programming language.

For the normal user Linux is awesome as long as it provides everything they need.

- - - Updated - - -

I like using Linux, apache runs better on it, samba runs better on it, blender runs better on it, foam runs better on it, susprog runs better on it, dassault systemes, draftsight runs better on it, autodesk runs on it, I'm trying to find one thing that runs better under windows........, AH, got it, malware runs better on windows. If I pick the right disro and don't make it a bloated pig it uses less resources than windows and so my software performs better eg; using lean pup and not fatdog64.
and when it comes to options, more often than not, more options than I need to even know about, Linux has plenty of options and windows has few, but at least I don't often delete my home directory when simply trying to change to my home directory under windows.

And what Autodesk products are you running on Linux?

As far as normal stuff, you really can not beat it. I do not do normal stuff.

 

[(G{in}[AK)TION]]

Linux to me is more like a workstation/server based operating system. Because alot of times, i see people using it for server use and running special kinds of linux programs on their work station machines.

You ever installed linux on a family members computer only for them to ask you hundreds of questions, some being the same question asked again, why their specific programs are not working and why isnt the wireless printer working in linux?

"But WINE can help with the programs and you can install an alternate driver for that printer" is not the answer im looking for either. And even though i have not used it in a while, i dont see a good enough reason as to why i should bother installing linux on my testbed, then installing WINE (followed by additional programs and tools needed to get that windows program going) and finding out that it is not working as well as i expected it to.

And if i am installing a LINUX device driver for a specific piece of hardware like my wireless printer, i expect that Linux driver to be made SPECIFICALLY for that very specific piece of hardware like my wireless printer instead of guessing which driver would work best. Printer is a Canon MG5520 which has been working great for everyone in the family and will be used till the day it dies, is no longer supported by canon, no longer fits our needs, or until we all die.

Then there is PC Gaming. IF linux was as good as windows for PC gaming, i would hop onto the linux train. But Battlefield 3, 4 and 1 do not support linux at all and they run like garbage in WINE accoring to this site here. They did not have battlefield 1 listed on the site though but i know that if bf3 and bf4 run like "garbage" in wine, then i know bf1 would also run like garbage in wine.
https://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=application&iId=16433
https://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=application&iId=13626

Half life has support for linux but the mods for the gldsrc engine would need to be ported over to the linux version of gldsrc of the engine. But i know that wont happen since the game is so old and only a very small group play it so programmers would probably be like "yeah whats the point anyway".

Natural Selection 2 also runs on linux but last couple of times i played it, i had a hard time trying to use the games shortcut keys because they kept triggering the linux commands short cut keys. not handy at all especially when your playing commander.

Then again, this was around 2013-2015. would i still try testing it again? Maybe. Would depend on how much time and effort it would take to get all this stuff working in ubuntu, debian, steamos, opensuse, linux mint, or whatever distro would do the job best.

 

[Archer0915]

Linux to me is more like a workstation/server based operating system. Because alot of times, i see people using it for server use and running special kinds of linux programs on their work station machines.

You ever installed linux on a family members computer only for them to ask you hundreds of questions, some being the same question asked again, why their specific programs are not working and why isnt the wireless printer working in linux?

"But WINE can help with the programs and you can install an alternate driver for that printer" is not the answer im looking for either. And even though i have not used it in a while, i dont see a good enough reason as to why i should bother installing linux on my testbed, then installing WINE (followed by additional programs and tools needed to get that windows program going) and finding out that it is not working as well as i expected it to.

And if i am installing a LINUX device driver for a specific piece of hardware like my wireless printer, i expect that Linux driver to be made SPECIFICALLY for that very specific piece of hardware like my wireless printer instead of guessing which driver would work best. Printer is a Canon MG5520 which has been working great for everyone in the family and will be used till the day it dies, is no longer supported by canon, no longer fits our needs, or until we all die.

Then there is PC Gaming. IF linux was as good as windows for PC gaming, i would hop onto the linux train. But Battlefield 3, 4 and 1 do not support linux at all and they run like garbage in WINE accoring to this site here. They did not have battlefield 1 listed on the site though but i know that if bf3 and bf4 run like "garbage" in wine, then i know bf1 would also run like garbage in wine.
https://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=application&iId=16433
https://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=application&iId=13626

Half life has support for linux but the mods for the gldsrc engine would need to be ported over to the linux version of gldsrc of the engine. But i know that wont happen since the game is so old and only a very small group play it so programmers would probably be like "yeah whats the point anyway".

Natural Selection 2 also runs on linux but last couple of times i played it, i had a hard time trying to use the games shortcut keys because they kept triggering the linux commands short cut keys. not handy at all especially when your playing commander.

Then again, this was around 2013-2015. would i still try testing it again? Maybe. Would depend on how much time and effort it would take to get all this stuff working in ubuntu, debian, steamos, opensuse, linux mint, or whatever distro would do the job best.

Workstation is hit or miss but for server it is all win! For anything but games and specific programs it is a win. But I think the first two replies missed the OP and went with the thread title only.

From the OP:

I really believe there is some sort of backdoor kickback system where Microshaft gives some sort of perks to companies so they do not develop software for Linux.

 

[ihrsetrdr]

and I really believe there is some sort of backdoor kickback system where Microshaft gives some sort of perks to companies so they do not develop software for Linux.

Since the days that I was into Linux (think 90s) not much has changed. Sure there are more apps but... no quicken, no heavy duty office app packages (hey I like Open and Libre) that can work with other software. I don't know, perhaps I am just getting bored with MS. And yes, I am typing this on a Linux system.

I believe that as well, particularly with desktop graphics drivers. That in itself keeps millions of users locked into MS for their gaming pleasures.

I don't use any exotic proprietary software suites so Microsoft Windows has no draw for me at all.

When I started unsing Linux in the early 2000s I started enjoying my computer usage alot more.

I didn't want to be beholden to some giant corporation, I just always thought that using my computer in the fashion that I choose was what life is all about.

 

[Archer0915]

I believe that as well, particularly with desktop graphics drivers. That in itself keeps millions of users locked into MS for their gaming pleasures.

I don't use any exotic proprietary software suites so Microsoft Windows has no draw for me at all.

When I started unsing Linux in the early 2000s I started enjoying my computer usage alot more.

I didn't want to be beholden to some giant corporation, I just always thought that using my computer in the fashion that I choose was what life is all about.

I prefer the NON GUI option but I am over it. Honestly I fell in love with Linux and then Mandrake got me hooked. Still I was DOS guy and that is why. The new flavors are better though Mandrake? Late 90s I guess, back when all I had was dial-up. But yeah I think big bucks are being paid to keep linux down.

 

[habbajabba]

NolaPro runs in linux.
wget http://www.nolapro.com/download/nolapro_release.zip

 

[Stratus_ss]

I have read a lot of things in this post that I struggle to find merit in. Part of it is that I want to be defensive and partly I feel some comments are intentionally incendiary.

For the games thing, there isnt much you can do if the game you really want to play isnt on the platform (its the same for console exclusives) you either buy the platform or pass on the game.

As for the printer issue I have been there... sort of many years ago. Canon in particular has done a shotty job at best making their drivers anywhere near useful and for that I place the blame solely on the manufacturer. From a practical standpoint it doesn't matter whose fault it is, if your gear just doesnt work but I feel that the angst is misdirected in most cases.

] You ever installed linux on a family members computer

Yup. Goes great for the most part.

] only for them to ask you hundreds of questions, some being the same question asked again, why their specific programs are not working...

On one hand this is a problem with setting expectations more than a problem with Linux. If they are being pitched an experience that is like Windows, then they will expect everything to be the same. If they are aware that its not harder but different things are a lot better received.

On the other hand I have the same experience on a Mac or for that matter on Windows when some stupid backwater POS software starts to go awry, you as the "technical genius" are called to account for every website 404/500/503, every malware infection, every program crash, every computer bog down etc. This is OS independent and is just the cross we all bear for being the person that "knows about computers"

 

[Alaric]

I have read a lot of things in this post that I struggle to find merit in. Part of it is that I want to be defensive and partly I feel some comments are intentionally incendiary.

For the games thing, there isnt much you can do if the game you really want to play isnt on the platform (its the same for console exclusives) you either buy the platform or pass on the game.

As for the printer issue I have been there... sort of many years ago. Canon in particular has done a shotty job at best making their drivers anywhere near useful and for that I place the blame solely on the manufacturer. From a practical standpoint it doesn't matter whose fault it is, if your gear just doesnt work but I feel that the angst is misdirected in most cases.



Yup. Goes great for the most part.



On one hand this is a problem with setting expectations more than a problem with Linux. If they are being pitched an experience that is like Windows, then they will expect everything to be the same. If they are aware that its not harder but different things are a lot better received.

On the other hand I have the same experience on a Mac or for that matter on Windows when some stupid backwater POS software starts to go awry, you as the "technical genius" are called to account for every website 404/500/503, every malware infection, every program crash, every computer bog down etc. This is OS independent and is just the cross we all bear for being the person that "knows about computers"

I'm gonna go with "No". Your post makes it seem like Linux is the other Windows, minus some otherwise deserved distribution and respect. Not true. Not even close. 80+% of the world's privately owned computers run Windows, so, like it or not that is the standard against which others are measured. Printers? Any idiot can drop a CD in their Windows rig, just click "Yes" all the way through and their printer works. Blaming the manufacturer because a tiny percentage of users have an OS that otherwise requires them to write code to print a damn recipe isn't reasonable. Linux has its uses and positive aspects, I'm not saying its bad. It is, however, wrong for the vast majority of users. It is harder, not just "different". The quotes in your signature prove that you think it requires a higher level of skill and knowledge to run Linux.

 

[||Console||]

I have tried the linux rout with non technical ppl that only need facebook/email/torrents and still I get more questions as the "friend that knows computers" . It was a bigger pain in the *** than re-installing windows every 6-12 months .
I know linux has a place but for me it is well above the avg user . And depending on what that user does maybe even above the "above avg" user . If the person want's a gaming rig No way should they be running a linux box . If they want to run a apache/server then maybe .
It is just plain harder to use for the avg user versus windows . Cmd line scares ppl .

 

[caddi daddi]

we run autodesk maya.

if you are building one for someone that is new to computing and you turn off all the update and upgrade nag screens it goes rather smoothly, migrating them from widows is another story.

 

[Stratus_ss]

I'm gonna go with "No". Your post makes it seem like Linux is the other Windows, minus some otherwise deserved distribution and respect. Not true. Not even close. 80+% of the world's privately owned computers run Windows, so, like it or not that is the standard against which others are measured. Printers? Any idiot can drop a CD in their Windows rig, just click "Yes" all the way through and their printer works. Blaming the manufacturer because a tiny percentage of users have an OS that otherwise requires them to write code to print a damn recipe isn't reasonable. Linux has its uses and positive aspects, I'm not saying its bad. It is, however, wrong for the vast majority of users. It is harder, not just "different". The quotes in your signature prove that you think it requires a higher level of skill and knowledge to run Linux.

Lets parse this a little. My intent was not to make it seem like the other Windows. In fact it was meant to highlight the opposite. It is a different thing entirely and should be approached as such.

With regard to the quote in my signature, the reference was specifically meant for servers, I can see how, without context, that can be misconstrued. Most people do not administer their desktops, they simply use them. I can see how the term could be applied to both however.

Regarding your statement on printers, if we are talking about new printers I concede the point, if you are talking about a printer that has some years behind it, it can be difficult to get otherwise functional hardware to work on any OS when there are no drivers provided for your OS of choice (whether that is Vista, XP, Linux or other). You run into the same problem if you go the other way as well. If you have a new printer that simply does not have drivers for the previous version of the OS you are hosed

I have tried the linux rout with non technical ppl that only need facebook/email/torrents and still I get more questions as the "friend that knows computers" . It was a bigger pain in the *** than re-installing windows every 6-12 months .
I know linux has a place but for me it is well above the avg user . And depending on what that user does maybe even above the "above avg" user . If the person want's a gaming rig No way should they be running a linux box . If they want to run a apache/server then maybe .
It is just plain harder to use for the avg user versus windows . Cmd line scares ppl .

I cant (and wouldn't try) to dispute your experience only to say that our experiences are not aligned and when I give people instructions I dont tell them to use the terminal. I think you are correct most people don't like to type, especially if they dont understand what they are typing

we run autodesk maya.

if you are building one for someone that is new to computing and you turn off all the update and upgrade nag screens it goes rather smoothly, migrating them from widows is another story.

If you mean using it as a Maya workstation I can totally see this being true. Purpose built computing is usually smooth (even in linux) when the users are accomplishing a specific task. Its once they start web surfing and/or collecting malware/adware/spyware or installing things on their own that things go awry

 

[Archer0915]

we run autodesk maya.

if you are building one for someone that is new to computing and you turn off all the update and upgrade nag screens it goes rather smoothly, migrating them from widows is another story.

Cool, try some of the engineering and design programs. It ticks me off that Mac is supported and not Linux.

 

[ihrsetrdr]

I see a potential for a Linux vs. Windows pissing contest here, which I have no intent to participate in.

Notice that I don't invade the Windows forum section to point of the weaknesses and shortcomings of MS .

I am fine with the majority of desktop and corporate workstations being on Windows...not my problem.

Most Linux distros are desktop and workstation friendly. Just about everything that needs doing in Linux can be done with the mouse clicks;

submitting a sudoer's password every once in a while for software installation is the main difference, these days.

 

[Super Nade]

Cool, try some of the engineering and design programs. It ticks me off that Mac is supported and not Linux.

You could always try a virtual machine, but I see your point of deficit of support for Linux from makers of specialized software. However, that does not mean Linux is useless, a subtle but important distinction. It requires significant resources to develop software for multiple platforms. The fact that Windows has a stranglehold on the market makes it the first and sometimes only choice for developers. However, there are developers who address multiple platforms, i.e. Mathworks, Wolfram etc, but not nearly enough.

 

[orion456]

You could always try a virtual machine, but I see your point of deficit of support for Linux from makers of specialized software. However, that does not mean Linux is useless, a subtle but important distinction. It requires significant resources to develop software for multiple platforms. The fact that Windows has a stranglehold on the market makes it the first and sometimes only choice for developers. However, there are developers who address multiple platforms, i.e. Mathworks, Wolfram etc, but not nearly enough.

Linux is also so fragmented with incompatible distros that the market would have a hard time addressing so many versions of Linux. Windows and MAC provide support for developers to learn as the platform grows. Linux is a wild west and very hard to service. Unless Linux consolidates around one distro, I don't see many developers being interested.

 

[Stratus_ss]

Linux is also so fragmented with incompatible distros that the market would have a hard time addressing so many versions of Linux. Windows and MAC provide support for developers to learn as the platform grows. Linux is a wild west and very hard to service. Unless Linux consolidates around one distro, I don't see many developers being interested.

This used to be a thing, but less and less the case. There is the steam model whereby they ship a target runtime and everyone builds against that. Then there is app image, flat paks and snap packages all which strive to be a universal packaging format which all show great promise. I suspect that snap packages will win out however. Either way the problem is being addressed from multiple angles not to mention that Linux as a development environment is more and more popular. Things like visual studio code, jet brains and other tools are bringing in technical users who will then start (as we have seen in the past) "scratching their own itch" and producing the software they want/need for the platform. I personally think the future is quite bright (I hope)

 

[Alaric]

First 9 downloads on the Benchmarks page at majorgeeks.com http://www.majorgeeks.com/mg/sortname/benchmarking.html

Just about every iteration of Winders covered, no Linux distro in sight. And no, it isn't a pissing contest between the two. Linux has advantages and pluses Windows can't match. It just isn't a viable alternative to the big W for the majority of users. Android probably has a better chance, to be honest. Linux is another skill level from Winders, and most PC owners don't have a need or desire to go there. If you're going to be using the average computer at work or home, you have to know Windows. You can happily go through life and never touch Linux. As to the thread title, it's true for the vast majority of the market. The fact that the OP knows Linux and uses it, and still finds little universal use for it sums it up nicely, IMO.