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Umm we have a first timer 'how to clean and build sticky'. Again, Again. I think you missed it.

The basic beginner guide. Nice.

You continually provide why we expect weeks of research and knowledge before buying this stuff.

It's frustrating to no end. I should just give up.

I can't for your own benefit. I can't believe you forgot BIOCIDE, don't build it till you have it. You want a link of others who forget or do you get the message????

Official Link:
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=631501

Original link:
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=592874

Two jugs should be fine, plus one to clean the loop after cleaning etc.

Don't forget to boil water before adding parts. Let it cool a while. The idea is to kill everything. Anything that will touch water to be put into the loop, like my One Cup Pyrex Glass Measuring cup ALWAYS gets put in the microwave and get the water boiling. I let it cool. I know it's sterile.

Like ESPN Says every football weekend. COMON MAN. Get it right.

Good luck. Wrong rad, and your fans will prolly make a small dent in that rad.

I spent lots of work to help you and still you mess up. Are you really ready? The rad will work but meh, bad choice. Didn't spend any time really understanding.

It's your stuff so I will sleep well tonight, and I will have a great day tomorrow.
 
Iii.. Thought I was understanding. >.< Someone else had mentioned how the older BIX radiator was amazing, with its 30fpi. Works at higher speeds, and moves a lot of heat off.. The newer Black Ice was still 30fpi, and I did a google search on it - seemed like it was a great rad. Good reviews.

What's wrong with the BI Rad?

As for the biocide, I know I need some. the watercooling won't be installed without it - That was a simple oversight on my part, I was excited about just getting the order in, double checked to make sure I had everything I needed, and missed something.

Edit: Aside from the fact that it needs to move at high speeds to work well. I get that.
 
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Did you buy the fans for it? 2000+ RPM 38mm thick fans? It performs weakly at under1500 RPM and lesser than that using it in a case it will block airflow from your input case fans.

It's a THICK sponge that wicks heat well with the right fans.

I still can't believe you bought that rad. Guess the Beginners guide didn't explain that.

Well make it work I guess, many make mistakes on the first pass.

Post your build results, never know it could work.

Excited means you were not rational. WC needs rational thinking and understanding. WC is a hobby, never rushed, no hobby is rushed. Unless Karma says you should be rushed and here is your life lesson. Karma never forgives, only teaches.
 
And I'm learning.. I should probably take the time to thank you again for giving advice and such through this whole thing. I know, at times, I seem a little noobish. I'm still working on that though.

For future reference, incase the Black ICe ends up not performing like I want it to (Though, I really thought it would..), you'd reconmended something with less fpi?
 
I have read the watercooling stickies in depth. Thought you might have a suggestion, after reaming me for the radiator I chose, though... I'm more curious why you think it's a bad choice.
 
To show how old it is and why we can't find reviews to compare to maodern rads

"The difference is really small, but if you're plan is to run really quiet fans, you're not gaining any performance over the BIP. You need to run at least something like 70+ CFM fans to start taking the advantage of the GTS over the BIP." This Quote is from Martin himself. And they are talking about the BIP also, another very old rad.

The link, look at the date:
http://www.overclock.net/t/220783/w...-blackice-gt-stealth-360-or-black-ice-pro-iii

The first one is the oldest, high end rad, the other two are later designs that work better with lower airflow (lower speed fans), if you want ultimate cooling and don't mind too much noise the Black ice extreme III with 3 high speed (90 - 100 cfm) fans will perform well, but not more than a few degrees better than the later rads with quieter fans.

http://forums.overclockers.com.au/showthread.php?t=562662

http://www.overclock.net/t/929726/black-ice-gts-360-xflow

Read post#6
http://www.overclock.net/t/1148466/which-rad-to-get

The GTS isn't a bad rad but it's very flow restrictive, I would use it in a CPU only loop though with decent cfm 120x38mm fans.
http://www.overclock.net/t/607352/bix-gt-x-flow-vs-bix-gtx

Read post 2, 3.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1312125/my-first-watercooled-build-needing-a-few-pointers

Lastly:
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=688509

Use these to choose your rad, watch for thickness, you'll have to take measurements to fit it at the top. You have 300 watts to dissipate, look at the Dt that Skinnee talks about at your chosen fan speed.
http://skinneelabs.com/water-cooling-radiators/2011-2012-radiator-review/
http://martinsliquidlab.org/2012/04/14/360-radiator-shootout-summary/
 
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Shame to have seen the tone of some of the replies I've seen in this thread. Sometimes we make mistakes, or choices others don't agree with. Granted this is a forum full of technicians all passionate about playing around with and building PCs. Part of the fun of custom water loops are doing them yourself. I mean generally you're not going to get much more performance out of water then you could out of air (and on a price/performance spectrum water will usually lose).

That said there is a lot of coolness factor for having water, there is a cool look, and a cool sound... and of course a cool CPU/GPU.

as to the rad... I've used automatic transmission cooling rads from junked cars, i've used rads from dirtbikes and motorcycles, and rads from floorboard open air water heaters. I think you can get hung up a bit on specs for a rad. If his rad isn't great at keeping the CPU cool, he can add a 2nd to the loop. or a 3rd if needed. frankly, the best part about water is as long as your pump is up to it, it doesn't matter how long your loop gets.

No need to beat on a dude, lord knows I've had to daisy chain a few rads together before. Speaking as someone who's been WCing systems for myself and others since the late 90s, and as someone who's read the stickies here since shoehorning myself back into the hobby, I'm not ashamed to admit i still don't know the math calculations you guys use to figure out the rad size needed, or fan strength needed.

Frankly when I was doing it, it was all trial and error. (granted with parts that were a lot cheaper)


Of course when i was doing it i wasn't interested in making it all fit inside a case... and sorta interested in making it look cool attached to the case, or wall or something. My last WC rig was actually mounted on the wall above my pc. It looked like something out of a mad scientists lab, as i used a lot of custom home made copper parts, something very steampunkish. (especially with the red antifreeze in the loop, the red/pink with the copper... cool combo. I painted all the connectors black... that was a fun loop. worked fine too)

shame i don't have that thing laying around anymore. It would be a cool reference design for a new loop... or at least a cool thing to hang on my wall as a trophy or something. never made the move from buffalo to phoenix though. took up too much space.
 
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Yea, we have seen these. But from the very beginning it was a tough crowd. Buying a pre built PC for way more money that he needed to spend. Then picking the wrong recommended rad, and then buying the way old X-flow rad that with a simple Google search or even asking us would of kept him from buying it.

Anyhoo, Your very special and really never needed to do research etc, your an experimenter and a old timer who does fine with his methods and it's entertaining and fun to read about.
 
Anyhoo, Your very special and really never needed to do research etc, your an experimenter and a old timer who does fine with his methods and it's entertaining and fun to read about.

psh... you wouldn't believe how much i read on this topic. both back in the 90's and now. i can't get enough of it. and usually do a boatload of research before i build anything (and really tighten down on the topic when i near the time to spend a dime).

I was just saying there are "details" i never really honed in on much. I'm good at math, and if i was going to spend the premium you guys do on a pc specific watercooling rad, i darn sure would make sure it's a good size for my needs before spending money.

I just never really was spending much money on my water loops, so playing around with rad space and fans was something i did because i was usually salvaging the parts. I mean when you're picking through a junk yard for radiators off a car or motorcycle or something, and your only interest is if the piping in the rad is made of copper or not... and if it looks like it will hold water... then you're kinda limited on the details you need to know about the radiator.
 
Wooo! CPU block/pump combo, VGA block, and the res came in today while I was at work, along with all the compression fittings, and the 11 foot of tubing I ordered (I can't imagine needing more than that, though it might happen.)

I've spent the past three or so hours running scalding hot tap water through all three of them, with short little 4-inch peices of tubing I cut, so I didn't make a mess. Got everything dried off.. Tomorrow, I go buy distilled water to boil and run through them. The case, rad, and majority of the computer stuff should come in.. though, my killcoil won't be here until Thursday. I think.
 
Let the water cool a bit before running through the parts. They aren't designed for 212F, they could warp etc. You don't need to sterilize the distilled, but put boiling water in the cup your gonna fill with to sterilize it and keep your work surfaces clean. On some new builds all the cautions were taken except the sterilization and still a few folks get growth, I'm meaning very few, but I have seen it happen. Killcoils don't kill everything, just the one bug you could have on a counter surface, never know. Running cooled down hot boiling water through the tubing? Sure why not. But get the temp under 125F first before doing that to any parts.

Lastly, play with the fittings and the compressions, see how they work and fit before mounting the parts on the mobo/card etc. Practice makes perfect.

Glad your getting your stuff, I was the same way long ago. Don't rush the build, savor the times and the tinkering. It's a hobby so every minute spent working on the stuff is worth the $$ you spent.

You prolly saw this already:
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=631501

Original post:
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=592874
 
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Mm. Since I got everything dried, I've been playing with the fittings.. Screwing them in, unscrewing them. Putting a peice of my scrap hose on, screwing the compression down to it, tugging on it at different levels of tightness.. just random things with it. I think I'm glad I went with those, over the old clamp style.

As for the water, I say boiling, but it was water from the faucet on 'hot' as hot as it'll go. Hotter then I like to keep my hand in for any extended period of time.

It's good to know I don't need to boil the distilled water though - I couldn't see anything stating that for sure, one way or the other. That saves some time... Once I get that tomorrow, I'll flush the whole system a few times with it. As far as filling the system, when it comes time to that, I was figuring I'd use a funnel and pour directly from the distilled water jug. That plan is only good, if everything else works out though.

I do have a question that I've never considered, in my years of computer building... When all the hardware comes in, I was planning on putting everything into the case in order to measure my tubing.. Get my tubing cut, and then take everything out of the case to put it together. Put it back into the case, fully assembled.

My theory for this is that I can tighten down the compression clamps easier, and tighter, while it's outside of the case. My question though, is it alright to put the blocks on their respective components without any thermal paste? As long as I don't turn it on? Seems like it'd be fine.

And, will it be safe to run the system for a leaktest without the killcoil?
 
Mm. Since I got everything dried, I've been playing with the fittings.. Screwing them in, unscrewing them. Putting a peice of my scrap hose on, screwing the compression down to it, tugging on it at different levels of tightness.. just random things with it. I think I'm glad I went with those, over the old clamp style.

Sure, you can say they are better. You have only dealt with one, I have only dealt with barbs myself. They are the same if done right. Compressions are prettir though.

As for the water, I say boiling, but it was water from the faucet on 'hot' as hot as it'll go. Hotter then I like to keep my hand in for any extended period of time.

Did you do the 'dance'? Maybe missed the sticky? It breaks loose any bits in the rad.

It's good to know I don't need to boil the distilled water though - I couldn't see anything stating that for sure, one way or the other. That saves some time... Once I get that tomorrow, I'll flush the whole system a few times with it. As far as filling the system, when it comes time to that, I was figuring I'd use a funnel and pour directly from the distilled water jug. That plan is only good, if everything else works out though.

I do have a question that I've never considered, in my years of computer building... When all the hardware comes in, I was planning on putting everything into the case in order to measure my tubing.. Get my tubing cut, and then take everything out of the case to put it together. Put it back into the case, fully assembled.

Sure, that would be fine, and good practice. Make sure you think and rethink tube routing. No harm in making a piece of hose an extra " long. You want the hose to be a good 90 degree into any fitting. Leaks happen that way once they are stressed. That's where the expensive BitsPower angled rotaries are golden.

My theory for this is that I can tighten down the compression clamps easier, and tighter, while it's outside of the case. My question though, is it alright to put the blocks on their respective components without any thermal paste? As long as I don't turn it on? Seems like it'd be fine.

Yep.

And, will it be safe to run the system for a leaktest without the killcoil?

Yes, but you'll have to open the loop and add it later, ruining all your hoursssss of bleeding the loop, even a leak test takes an hour+ just to get the loop full and some of the bubbles out.

Then the leak test is pump on, fans on the rad on and running for hours and checking with bit of paper towels on ALL fittings and letting it run overnight. The water will get WARM! with just the heatdump from the pump, so a bit of fanage, not much is recommended. It shocked me the first time hot warmmmm! the water was overnight. WAYYY warmer than it ever has been on my PC with rad fans and load testing.

You might think it's excessive, but seen warm loops pop a hose, poof goes the mobo. Your fault, can't RMA the mobo because Karma will get you. Seen 1 hr noobie leak tests and next you know, bam, the GPU goes poof due to a leak. Karma again. I overtightend a GPU block on a GTX 280, poof, shorted out. In the garbage. Spent $470 the next day due to my stupidity.
 
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it doesn't hurt to run your first "watertight" test with dye in the water. that way you can spot leaks easy. use white paper towels around all the joints. so the leaks will stand out clear. you don't even have to have the blocks attached to the motherboard (i wouldn't) just make sure you do the first leak checking proper.

The way I used to assemble them was blow as hard as i could into each section of tubing + their connecting block/part, and use a hose clamp to pinch off the back side... and see if I can separate or blow out a joint. then increase the loop, one link at a time, and repeat. then i run water with dye through it... if it survives, no leaks, i then connect it to the board/cpu, then put the mb back into the case, and attach the pump/res to the case. wrap everything generously in white paper-towels again and test again.
 
I did do the 'dance' with the cleaning/water. Didn't miss that stickie. I'll do it again tomorrow, just for my peace of mind.. I do like to double check, and double check my double check. My leaktest will be run over night as well, and probably most of the next day. ASsuming I get everything put together by Thursday evening, I'll run it all night Thursday, check it before work Friday, and let it run while I'm at work if it's dry in the morning.

I'm glad to know the water gets warm from the pump... I think I have some adapters lying around that can adapt the 3/4-pin motherboard plugs to something that the PSU can power.. So I should be able to get my rad fans going for the leaktest as well. I don't have any small fans to put next to the case. If I can't get the rad fans running from the testing PSU, I'll plug them into my current rig and let it power 'em, probably.

Yet again, thanks for the advice Con. Off I go to read stickies for the seventeenth time.. I swear, I'll be dreaming about grey forums and multicolored words by the time this is over.
 
I would build all the components in the case. Than cut the tubing and route everything. Assuming everything has been cleaned. I wouldn't use dye for one and pour the distilled water in with the killcoil. Just simple paper towels or different color shammies work great too. Leak test and run it for hours. Power everything on once you investigate that nothing has leaked for sure and make sure all the compressions are tight fitted once more to make sure. Than your priming and bleed process starts. Wallah!

Take pictures of this and create a build log. Its some extra work but its fun.
 
Was planning on the build log. Figured I'd post pictures and stuff here as I went, and then I could compile it later. Tomorrow, I'll get some pictures of the components.

Even with all the work this'll be, I'm excited. I've been wanting a watercooled rig for years.. Glad I found a great group of very experienced people to offer advice and criticism. Found http://forums.extremeoverclocking.com/t355358.html
as another thread of 'how to build a watercooling system' I'm reading through. IT goes over some different cleaning methods then what I've seen in our own stickies, among other things. So far, my plan is.. Tomorrow, clean and reclean all watercooling parts. Put the hardware in the case, give it a quick testrun with air to make sure nothing is DoA.. the only thing I should have to remove then, is the stock CPU fan, and the VGA fan (Which would have to be removed anyways.) Build the cooling system in the case, cut and measure. At some point during all this, food, class, and a few breaks will happen.

Wednesday, after work. Build the loop outside the case, fill it, and run a leaktest... I know it's not the same as being in the case, because of different pressures on the hoses. But, it'll let me check the fittings, to see if I've over tightened anything. Let that test run through Wednesday night.

Thursday, check for leaks. Assuming there are none, assemble it inside the case without taking it apart - Taking extra care not to pull any tubing loose. Inside the case, run another leaktest through thursday and overnight to Friday. Friday morning check for leaks. Let it run while at work. After work, check for leaks.. If it's all clear, plug in the motherboard and enjoy. Of course, plans are only good untill put into motion.. Then it's just adapting to what happens.
 
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