Building A64 system - need advice

[Sentential]

Sadly as I feared that many people here have done, you are mistaken. I return with the proof of this. Your bandwith IS doubled when going to dual-channel...period

This is the only pic I could find for now...note that his ram is running @ 284mhz vs my 254mhz. Yet I still crush him on bandwith. This pix is on an A64

Here is another, it is even more drastic since he is using low latency RAM @ 260mhz

Like I said, if you really would like me to show you a direct picture difference between my rig in Sing-Channel and Dual-Channel I will. But rest assured, it DOES make that much of a difference

If you prefer that I take a picutre of mine running in single-channel mode, I will do so

 

[Double_D]

Please post the numbers. I'm very interested in seeing them.

I guess what I am trying to say is closer to this: maximum memory bandwidth means relatively little to me unless it's impact is significant. From what I've read, it isn't really significant. Not to the extent that it makes much of an improvement in applications.

I read this article: http://anandtech.com/showdoc.aspx?i=2065&p=16
and it pretty much concurs with me.

It mainly boils down to this: which motherboard provides the best feature set. I know the DFI with it's NF3 250GB chipset is a great motherboard (built in firewall and such). I'm not sure really what is available for 939's because I never really considered them after reading the marginal improvements one sees with that socket over 754. So, I haven't researched them.

All-in-all it's going to boil down to cost vs REAL-WORLD performance. If indeed the 939's are the same price and do offer (albeit marginal) real world performance gains, I will rethink my decision. However, if the cost is cheaper for the 754 and the features are more impressive on the mobo offerings, I still think it's the better value since the performance for real-world apps is only marginally worse.

-DD

 

[Sentential]

There is absolutly NO question that S939 is faster. Ive got a couple graphs that ive summed up

<The FX53, 3800+, 3500+, 3200+ are all S939 CPUs>

<note the amount of speed gained on S939 vs S754>

<Once again the FX53, 3800+, 3500+, 3200+ are all S939 CPUs>

Among the Athlon 64 models, you can notice that the memory subsystem bandwidth influences the result more in monsters-heavy game scenes. For example, every Athlon 64 with a dual-channel memory controller (S939) outperforms an Athlon with a single-channel memory controller(S754). The amount of cache memory, on the contrary, doesn’t practically affect the result. The speed of the Athlon 64 FX-53 is close to that of the Athlon 64 3800+, while the Newcastle-core Athlon 64 3000+ is but slightly slower than the Athlon 64 3200+, which has a twice-larger L2 cache.

Plus they are indeed the same price. The 3000+ at many places is just slightly over $160. Buying a S754 rig would prove in the long run, disasterous.

If you look at how AMD rates their CPUs. The S939 versions are a full 200mhz slower than their S754 counterparts. So on average S939 are 200mhz+ faster than a S754 version at the same speed as evident by these graphs.

In addition S939 Winchester overclock considerably better than Newcastles, which is something else to consider.

If you decide to get a 3000+ on S754 your max OC will be anywhere from 2.3ghz-2.5ghz. However, if you get a Winchester their max OCs vary anywhere from 2.4-2.6ghz, plus the additional 200mhz effective clock increase because of dual-channel RAM.

Max 754 (best case scinerio) effective clock = 2.5ghz
Max S939 (best case scinerio) effective clock = 2.8ghz

Just look at the results. The 3200+ is a full 3 FPS faster than the 3000+, even tho they are at the same frequency and speed. Which is even worse is how the 3500+ manages to keep up with the 3400+ , which has which has 2X the cache of the 3500+ and STILL loses.

Its your call....

I know the DFI with it's NF3 250GB chipset is a great motherboard (built in firewall and such). I'm not sure really what is available for 939's because I never really considered them after reading the marginal improvements one sees with that socket over 754.

-DD

All nforce3 mobos has all those features. THe K8N Neo2 also has a gigabit / dual LAN with firewire / optical audio out.

In addition the maximum HTT (effective bus speed) is 200mhz faster on the Nforce3 Ultra, than the 250. 1ghz on the Ultra (S939 only) vs 800mhz on S754

 

[Double_D]

Thank you very much sentenial. I will indeed look much closer at this and may actually now get a S939. Although I don't consider 3 FPS significant improvement by itself to warrant the 'upgrade,' I do see your point. And, the DFI board I had picked out claims 1000MHz HTT...so, I'm not sure that's a valid point.

Now I've got some reading to do tonight and re-evaluate my decisions. Damn it...

Thanks, though, for your help.

I've decided on this memory, though, would you all consider it to be a good choice?

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?description=20-146-890&depa=0

 

[thor17usa]

I would suggest getting and AMD64 and at least 1GB of PC3200 ram. As far as what brand to get, I am not sure entirely and I just went with Giel. I like them cause they have blue heat speaders. Also, I would go for the Raptor 74 if you really want good performance. FOr the video card get at least an ATI x800 Pro with 256MB.

My system can run Doom3 in Ultra mode with a hitch...check out my sig.

Anyway, good luck with your system.

 

[Sentential]

Thank you very much sentenial. I will indeed look much closer at this and may actually now get a S939. Although I don't consider 3 FPS significant improvement by itself to warrant the 'upgrade,' I do see your point. And, the DFI board I had picked out claims 1000MHz HTT...so, I'm not sure that's a valid point.

Now I've got some reading to do tonight and re-evaluate my decisions. Damn it...

Thanks, though, for your help.

I've decided on this memory, though, would you all consider it to be a good choice?

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?description=20-146-890&depa=0

Yea thats the good stuff alright....I plan on getting a set of that myself. As for the decision, its not to terribly hard LOL.

Buy the RAM, get either a 3200+ Winchester or a 3000+. Then for the mobo buy MSI K8N Neo2 Platnium. Its as simple as that <see sig, its what im running>

 

[Double_D]

I have not read a review of the DFI where there was any problem with overclocking. I have thus read TWO for the Neo2. Making my decision much harder. That, plus the cost difference is about $50 for 3-5 FPS improvement. I'm thinking I'll go with my original decision on the 754 - at least until I read a little more on the Neo2 and what the problems people were having are.

But, I respect your opinion and thank you greatly for your help. At least we agree on the kick-arse memory! LOL

-DD