Considering Phase......Strongly

[jtlee75]

I have been reading and learning bits and pieces here and there. About 8 different forums so far tonight alone. But not a lot of how info in one specific place. I want to build it myself. I am fully aware of the epa laws and dangers. I have help from a cousin that is hvac certified and has all the tools needed. I was planning on using the internals from a window unit ac. It works fine and is only a few months old but needs charging anyway so what the h*** right? So would any of you veterans in phase change be willing to help and true noob at doing this? Have yahoo mess. and can install any other that might be preffered(sp). I will start breaking down the ac unit I have to get the specific model numbers off of the components inside this by the end of the week. I am sure I can find all the info I need scrattered about and do this myself, but I would really feel much more comfortable about it if I had some experience to walk me through the first build.

 

[-aDaM^]

Sounds great, its not actully that hard. The hardest thing would be making the thing that attachtes to the CPU(evap i think)

 

[Epox4life]

Your best off buying the evap from chilly1.

 

[jtlee75]

yea. I am going to buy the evap. I do have access to a fulll machine shop though, so I may make one later on down the road.

 

[crimedog]

so.. first you wanna make sure you have tools. then snag a compressor that powerful enough (approx 1/4hp or larger) a condensor that's big enough, an evap, suction line, cap tubing, filter/dryer, schrader valves, and copper tubing. for tools you need guages, some kind of vacuum pump, a torch/gas, brazing rods, swaging tools, tubing cutter(s), and a camping propane heater will make brazing the evap together much easier.

once you have the evap brazed together the rest is very easy. really just brazing everything together. you should put a schrader valve on the service port of the compressor (this is the low side), and the suction line will connect to the flex line which is attached to the evap. the other pipe out of the compressor goes to the condensor, and out of that you have the filter/drier and then the cap tube. somewhere in there you want another schrader valve for the high side readings. another note you want the filter/drier angled downwards. chilly1 sells filter/driers with a schrader valve already installed at the top.

so now it's all assembled, you need to vacuum it. then, add a bit of refrigerant and start it up. propane is a good starter refrigerant. after you've verified that the evap gets cold and the condensor gets warm you apply a heat load and tune it by adding the right amount of refrigerant.

 

[Pf.Farnsworth]

so.. first you wanna make sure you have tools. then snag a compressor that powerful enough (approx 1/4hp or larger) a condensor that's big enough, an evap, suction line, cap tubing, filter/dryer, schrader valves, and copper tubing. for tools you need guages, some kind of vacuum pump, a torch/gas, brazing rods, swaging tools, tubing cutter(s), and a camping propane heater will make brazing the evap together much easier.

once you have the evap brazed together the rest is very easy. really just brazing everything together. you should put a schrader valve on the service port of the compressor (this is the low side), and the suction line will connect to the flex line which is attached to the evap. the other pipe out of the compressor goes to the condensor, and out of that you have the filter/drier and then the cap tube. somewhere in there you want another schrader valve for the high side readings. another note you want the filter/drier angled downwards. chilly1 sells filter/driers with a schrader valve already installed at the top.

so now it's all assembled, you need to vacuum it. then, add a bit of refrigerant and start it up. propane is a good starter refrigerant. after you've verified that the evap gets cold and the condensor gets warm you apply a heat load and tune it by adding the right amount of refrigerant.

1/4hp not nessesary nor is it meaningful. 1/6hp would do fiune too. And one to powerfull would actually make your temperatures go up due to heat dump from it. HP is not a good way to look at it, look at displacement, 15cc is a good size.

Do alot of reading at as well:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=80

 

[martinjon666]

hmmmm....homebrew phasechanger myself...Best of luck. PM me with any little questions, i read for about 2 months before i started.

 

[jinu117]

Feel free to ask questions find out what components you really have first than rest of things unfolds quite quickly.

 

[jtlee75]

Compressor is a rotatary. Can't find any specs on it though. ot is LG labled.
I would like some general component placement and part number information if you would. I have an evap, suction line, cap tube assembly on the way. I was gonna use the condenser out of the ac unit for a first time. Then later may do a hermetically sealed compressor as they are shorter. I have all the torches and such for the brazing and plenty of argon, co2, and argon/co2 mix for purging. My friend is taking hvac in school now and can sign out all the gauges and stuff from the school for the weekend when I get ready to chage it. What type of refidgerant gases do you recommend. The compressor is running R22 in the ac unit. Was considering R134 since I already have several dozen cans from working on cars. Can it be run with the compressor already running R22? What will I need to do to run it? Any and all info is welcomed and appreciated. I been doing alot of reading over at xs but gets kind of confusing when they talk about cascades and all. I read all the stickies in the phase section in one sitting. Got a migraine from it to prove it. Thanks for all the help and info guys/gals. We still have gals on this forum?

 

[jinu117]

Oil is probably mineral which doesn't play with R134a... you will have to replace the oil first. I suggest using PoE with R134a or... most of refrigerant
R404a works great with it if you can get a hand on, even R402a is an option, and R507.
It might be tad loud but it should give real good temperature
I do suggest putting good U bend before suction to make sure you not only reduce vibration but also traps any liquid refrigerant with above compressor.

 

[jtlee75]

Recommend a good filter/dryer for me? Maybe somewhere to order online?

 

[jtlee75]

ok. I havent broken the seal anywhere yet. But I read somewhere that the line frosting back to the compressor is a bad sign.. Like this. Can an over/under charge cause this or if there is not enough load?

 

[greenmaji]

that would be from the lack of heat load (you've disabled the thermostat I take it), and the unit is carged to cool a room or small appartment full of air.. And the unit is going to be overcharged for a PC as well.. what your looking at there is normal considering the conditons your working with..
your going to be recovering the entire charge and reworking the system anyway if your making a single stage direct die so this shouldnt be a consern of yours right now anyway..
Good luck with the project

 

[Pf.Farnsworth]

That is Very bad. Frosting back to the compressor means not all the refrigerant is boiling off, which means its going in to the compressor, now given rotaries handle liquid sluging better then reciprocating compressors, you still can not compress a liquid. This WILL destroy the compressor. How fast is only determined by how much you are slugging in and for how long.

That looks like a 3/4hp. A little to big for a SS DD if you ask me, I would not go above 1/2hp. Get a reciprocating compressor if you can, much quieter and not as power hungry, read more practical to use in an SS DD.

If you are in to phase change cooling this is the wrong forum, ask your questions here:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=80

 

[greenmaji]

well yes it's bad.. and I said he needs to recover the refigerant and break down the system (that is remove all the refigerant) so operating it with that charge would be a non-issue.. so long as your not running it in the mean time for the heck of it.
And to be honest.. It very well could be oversized for a single stage direct die.. Most small air cons come with a 1/2 hp compressor but this one appears to be a tad bit bigger.
ask around other fourms the compressor is loud and oversized but it wouldnt be impossible to build a SS DD with it.. heck Chilly1 just build a 3/4HP SS DD for proth not too long ago and proth still hasn't got it yet (DOE!)
teampuss, xtreemresorces, xtreamsystems would be places to ask more technical questions. but your reading there, if you read enough you most likely won't have questions for a single stage build..

 

[jtlee75]

i know the xs forums very well. I just have been a member here awhile and know some of the other members are very helpful. I know this unit is a little big(now that I found some specs) but it is a first test build with what I have available already. I do plan on getting a smaller compresser that is quieter as well for a 24/7 running. This is just going to be for benching and a learning experience. Thanks for all the info all. I figured the frost was from lack of heat load but wanted to double/triple check everything on a first experience. This is the only specs I could find. If I read right only 8.4cc?? Mine is in red..

 

[Pf.Farnsworth]

Chilly1 just build a 3/4HP SS DD for proth not too long ago and proth still hasn't got it yet (DOE!)

Don't even dare going there, you clearly do not know what he is going though right now.

 

[XeonStrikeForce]

rather then trying to tell him what to do you could simply tell him or link him to the situation, other then that he can "go there" all he wants.

Green Your friend hasn't goten it in due to a rather nasty move from an ex Gf of his and PayPal that have frozen his founds (How ironic the term) doing some rather sever damage to his abilities to ship systems. He is working on rectifying it though.

 

[greenmaji]

I understood the paypal situation and UPS situations I'm not irritatied at Chilly1 at all, I had no clue about the Ex though (more bad news for Reggie ouch )

that looks like CC's per revolution OP.. I think Pf. is right it looks to be about 3/4HP

 

[jtlee75]

That is Very bad. Frosting back to the compressor means not all the refrigerant is boiling off, which means its going in to the compressor, now given rotaries handle liquid sluging better then reciprocating compressors, you still can not compress a liquid. This WILL destroy the compressor. How fast is only determined by how much you are slugging in and for how long.

That looks like a 3/4hp. A little to big for a SS DD if you ask me, I would not go above 1/2hp. Get a reciprocating compressor if you can, much quieter and not as power hungry, read more practical to use in an SS DD.

If you are in to phase change cooling this is the wrong forum, ask your questions here:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=80

pf- how did you come to the 3/4 hp estimate? I am trying to learn all this. Also, just seems 3/4 hp is large for a 5700BTU a/c, just a guess though. Thanks for all the info.
Yea, chilly1 is going through some stuff and that sucks. He has been hammered several times over at xs they just don't realize this same or a worse situation can happen to them. He goes out of his way to help people and they appreciate it till he can't or get hung up doing something then they hammer him. It aint right. I appreciate anyone willing to help anyone else. Especially the new guys. I am new to phase change so I understand having to ask questions that might be common knowledge to the veterans.
Thanks.