Debating playing with AMD

[Dr. McCoy]

Good suggestions here - I can say the fun you'll have tinkering with an AMD is worth getting into.
I own both and I still enjoy my AMD's vs the Intels, the Intels to me are...... Bland in that there's not a whole lot you can do with them vs an AMD.
With an Intel it's mostly just crankup the multi and you're off to the races.

With an AMD it's a little different with all the tweaking you can do, however the FM2/FM2+ setups are mostly like an Intel is now, BCLK limited and the same basics apply. I have a 7870K with a Crossblade Ranger and like Johan said, it's a good setup but tops out quickly.

An AM3+ setup with FX chips such as the FX-8350 and ran with 990FX chipped boards are whats fun to tinker around with.

Cheapest 8 core you can currently find new would be the FX-8300: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113399
And the best/cheapest board that will run it to it's potential is this one: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131874&ignorebbr=1
Or perhaps this one as the cheapest 990FX chipped board: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131851&ignorebbr=1

I only went with Asus boards since as far as I know they have the best lineup for an AM3+ based setup, I've certainly been pleased with my Asus AM3+ boards and just ordered another CHV-Z yesterday. Nothing wrong with the older CHV-Z I bench with, I got it for a DD build.

As for RAM, you'll have a hard time getting past 1866 unless you can find a good set of sticks and that's one of the major challenges with these - However if you do find a good set normally getting past 1866 and higher isn't a big deal once you figure it out - I can routinely hit or even top 2400 with mine but thats mainly due to the sticks I run along with how I tweak things.

Cooling has been brought up and yes - That is a big factor but you can still do OK with either the ready-made kits or even DIY watercooling like I have. It all costs $$ no matter what you do or how you go and I've chosen pieces that can be used with either so there is no "Loss" of the investment I have in them, can use them with both Intel and AMD.

EDIT:
I'll add that you don't have to invest in an 8 core, even the quads are fun to mess around with, the FX-4300 being the cheapest Vishy quad you can get. I also have one of those and just ordered with the new board a 4350 I'll be toying with as soon as it gets here.

However STAY AWAY from any of the 41xx or 81xx model chips, those are Bulldozer pieces.... However if someone just gives one to you that's OK.
The 43xx, 83xx or even the 9xxx chips are what you really want.

It's all a matter of what it's worth to you or how much you're willing to invest for trying it.

 

[trents]

There is an Asus m5a97 and an m5a97 evo. The evo is a better board an has 6+2 power phase. I got an Fx-6300 to 4.5 without any problem on top end air. I also had spot fans blowing on the VRM and the back side of the socket. That combo might be a good compromise between over clocking potential and price.

 

[Dr. McCoy]

The best overall board for a balance of performance, cost and reliability would be the Sabertooth 2.0, these have plenty of options to tweak for getting what you want from a chip.
Has the 8+2 power phase like the CHV-Z so it will handle even one of the 9xxx chips no prob but with one of those CPUs you'd need water or better just to run it.

Only real "thing" is although it has plenty of options the CHV-Z has even more for absolute tweaking of stuff in the BIOS, the BIOS in this board model is simpler but not overwhelming to someone still trying to figure out what does what and the effect a tweak would have.
For someone getting into AM3+ and wanting a board that will deliver this model is probrably the best choice overall.
The BIOS in a CHV-Z can be confusing and even work against you if you don't understand all the jargon within..... However it is the one if you just have to have the absolute "Best" of the breed.

 

[mackerel]

I think we're going around in circles now. AM3+, FM2+, low end, high end... I'm not going high end. That is a given. I might consider that for Zen.

I'll have a think if I will go lower end, even if it means little or no overclocking potential. Yes, I know which site this is! The other option would be not at all. I don't need this, but it would be something different to play with for a bit.

 

[Janus67]

If you won't be overclocking/tweaking it, I don't see what there is to play with? If you don't need a new system just wait for Zen in that case.

 

[mackerel]

The relative performance of AMD vs recent Intel CPUs is generally done to death... but not for all scenarios that I'm interested in. So I wanted to do my own benching. Even 2 cores not overclocked would be enough to do that, but the cost difference to go to 4 is hardly any extra cost so might as well grab some more while at it. Overclocking to any degree is a bonus.

I'm still looking at the M5A97 series with interest. I say series as there seems to be quite a few models in that range. What is the limiting factor for overclocking? From what I see, there is a variety of power phases from 4+2, 6+2, and it even says 6+2+2 for the top end Evo 2.0. It was mentioned earlier I wanted a 990 chipset, but this is a 970 with beefed up power. Is that enough, or is there some other missing functionality between them? I could stretch to the Evo 2.0 + FX-6300 pairing but if a slightly lower board will suffice I would consider that. Basically I'm spending too much time thinking about what I could be doing, as opposed to actually doing it.

I will go back and have one more look at what APU I could get for equivalent cost, but the bigger cache of the FX I think swings it more for me than iGPU especially as I have spare GPUs lying around anyway.

 

[mackerel]

I'm now sat here with a load of parts in a shopping cart, thinking to myself, do I really want to do this? Part of me says, get the i3 instead as I know for my main interest areas it'll be both faster and cheaper. But that doesn't answer my question of what would AMD do?

After a bit of thinking, I've had another idea. I'll keep an eye open for USED parts/systems. In a quick search of my local area I don't see anything fitting the description with only Athlon/Sempron showing up. Bulldozer and later versions have been around for some time, so I'd expect something to pop up sooner or later. I just can't justify to myself buying new at this stage. I can afford it, but that doesn't mean I should!

If I find something I'll update but I think I'm done for now.

 

[Silver_Pharaoh]

I would absolutely look for a good used motherboard and some RAM if you need it. Yup.
Just something to consider though, used CPU's may have been "beaten" on by previous owners. Though honestly, unless they were benchmarking 99% of used CPU's are in perfect condition.

Maybe buy a new FX 4300 or 6300 and buy a good used mobo.

 

[Sergiu]

The GA-970A-UD3 and UD3p have 8+2 power phase so they're a decent boards to OC without breaking the bank, I see no real reason for going for the 990 version unless you wanna SLI or something.

 

[Bluefalcon13]

Donno if it still has the issue cause I sold my Phenom II, but the ud3p was only overclocking one core of my 955BE

 

[Dr. McCoy]

I think we're going around in circles now. AM3+, FM2+, low end, high end... I'm not going high end. That is a given. I might consider that for Zen.

I'll have a think if I will go lower end, even if it means little or no overclocking potential. Yes, I know which site this is! The other option would be not at all. I don't need this, but it would be something different to play with for a bit.

I understand where you're coming from, I too woudn't want to spend alot on something I'm not comfortable with or even may question whether it's worth it or not.

I was stating what options you have and for all I know you may change your mind BUT the biggest thing is the info - This way you'll have an idea of what you're getting instead of going in blind and I've done that before. Got lucky and scored some good pieces but again I've also scored some lame pieces too because of it. The idea of getting something used is better from a cost standpoint but used is the same as buying a used car/auto, you just don't know and I've done my share of buying stuff used. The majority of the time it's OK so I'll say you're probrably doing yourself a favor getting something used in the overall.

The best CPUs to get would be the AM3+ Vishera based chips, a good clocking 4300 quad will give you some experience on the cheap. Even some of the older AM3 chips such as the Zosma/Thuban based chips will let you learn alot, the 960T being a favorite of many BUT if expecting to unlock hidden cores you'll certainly want to do some research on what boards have the capability of unlocking cores and which ones do not.

Now.... The 970 based boards will let you OC some and paired with a chip such as the mentioned 4300 will let you see how it does. No, you don't really need a 990 chipped board to have some fun with these but be sure to look around because I've seen some great deals on better boards than the cheaper/lower models sell for new. It's all a matter of luck in finding one and getting it before someone else does but you know that already.

Be picky, be sure to ask questions about a given piece before pulling the trigger on a purchase and we'll do our part so you can do yours successfully.

 

[mackerel]

Where I live there isn't the population density for a good amount of used deals. Most used offerings are pre-built systems or unrealistically priced older enthusiast stuff. I will have limited choice (or none that I can find right now). I recognise the risk on used kit. One of my other interests is fish keeping, and used kit is highly variable in condition, but it is easier to check computer kit.

 

[Bluefalcon13]

Where I live there isn't the population density for a good amount of used deals. Most used offerings are pre-built systems or unrealistically priced older enthusiast stuff. I will have limited choice (or none that I can find right now). I recognise the risk on used kit. One of my other interests is fish keeping, and used kit is highly variable in condition, but it is easier to check computer kit.

You can always keep an eye on the classifieds forums here. Stuff crops up frequently there.

 

[Silver_Pharaoh]

You can always keep an eye on the classifieds forums here. Stuff crops up frequently there.

Yes All you need is 100 quality posts to gain access!

 

[mackerel]

According to my profile, I have 98 posts here, and this would be 99. Now, if they are considered quality is another matter

I'll have a look when I do get access but I'm not sure if there are many active geographically convenient to me to make it economic to ship.

 

[ShrimpBrime]

Are you looking to build a gaming rig?

Or just playing with AMD cause you never have before?

Get 100 post here!

 

[mackerel]

The last desktop AMD CPU I owned was the X6 1055T, which blew away Intel CPUs at the time. But that was a long time ago. I'm fully kitted out with Intel systems now, but realised I pretty much skipped an era of AMD CPUs. I know them as Bulldozer modules, but is there a more correct term for them? It is purely for playing around with. I don't need more systems, although any I do have can be put to used in distributed computing projects until it gets too warm and I start regulating them.

I actually do currently have one working AMD system, but it is a low end E2-1800 that can barely power the small laptop that its in. I know it wont be representative of the higher power models.

 

[Silver_Pharaoh]

The last desktop AMD CPU I owned was the X6 1055T, which blew away Intel CPUs at the time. But that was a long time ago. I'm fully kitted out with Intel systems now, but realised I pretty much skipped an era of AMD CPUs. I know them as Bulldozer modules, but is there a more correct term for them? It is purely for playing around with. I don't need more systems, although any I do have can be put to used in distributed computing projects until it gets too warm and I start regulating them..

Team32 is always open to new members!!!
Are you familiar with Folding@Home?

 

[mackerel]

I used to do a bit of folding, but haven't done that in a while. Actually, looking at my stats page, I last returned a unit to team 32 almost 8 years ago. That was around the time I joined the forum. I could have another go at it. I'm not going to run my modern systems on it, but I have a small collection of older ones if they're still any use at all. I'm totally out of touch so will need to get back up to speed, which I guess will be best done in the folding forum and not this thread.

 

[ShrimpBrime]

The last desktop AMD CPU I owned was the X6 1055T, which blew away Intel CPUs at the time. But that was a long time ago. I'm fully kitted out with Intel systems now, but realised I pretty much skipped an era of AMD CPUs. I know them as Bulldozer modules, but is there a more correct term for them? It is purely for playing around with. I don't need more systems, although any I do have can be put to used in distributed computing projects until it gets too warm and I start regulating them.

I actually do currently have one working AMD system, but it is a low end E2-1800 that can barely power the small laptop that its in. I know it wont be representative of the higher power models.

I'm actually using an E2-3200 FM1 desktop. OC'ed to 3.7ghz.

BullDozer is correct term. That's the 4100-8100 series. The more current line is PileDriver 4300-9300 series processors.

You could do benchmarking. You've been invited to Team32 OCF. If you have older rigs, perhaps ClassicPlatforms.com would be a neat forum for you to browse through time to time. Not recruiting for our benching team or anything, but just to have a look around at the old hardware there because the place is mainly about older tech. Slot processors - s939 mostly the specialty over there.

Anyhow, if you are building a gaming rig, might as well wait till ZEN is released later this year and save moneys for it. At that point current FX platform should cheapen greatly. October is the expected launch date. In fact any one thinking of even going to Intel at this point may as well wait it out. It's said AMD will be releasing 8 cores and 16 threads and the server platform will be up to 16 cores and 32 threads.