Got my Asus M5A99X evo up and running!

[Johan45]

Nice work Trents That should keep things cool.
Going off of what you said yesterday

The M5A97 nonevo had a spread of >.75v. So I could set it at 1.425 in bios for every day computing but it would surge to over 1.5v under heavy load. The new board I have to set to 1.5 in bios and it stays steady at that with whatever vdrop compensation LLC is implementing under light computing. Under heavy load it will only go to 1.512v (right now I'm Priming with the 960T unlocked to 6 cores at a little over 4 ghz clock speed). This is with the Ultra High LLC setting.

I got messing around and found that if I kept lowering the Vcore the extreme setting on the PLL would kick it up higher. The max offset I got was 0.72v. This was on my Sabretooth. If you're curious I could give it a go on the PRO with the 965 to see if I get the same results.




@RGone you say this isn't what LLC was designed to do but I think it's pretty awesome. I had a gaming session after this and the Vcore topped just shy of 1.44v. In the end I think this might be my new permanent setting. You get the power when you need it and less when you don't

 

[trents]

Do you mean LLC? You said PLL.

 

[Johan45]

OOPs ya it was early when I posted that.

 

[RGone]

@RGone you say this isn't what LLC was designed to do but I think it's pretty awesome. I had a gaming session after this and the Vcore topped just shy of 1.44v. In the end I think this might be my new permanent setting. You get the power when you need it and less when you don't.

Hehehe. I know it is always strokes for folks. I just prefer knowing that what I set in bios is what I will get for Vcore. I don't like having to calculate what I will get underload hopefully since it can change. I know what you did and could do it as well. But try and teach that to the newbs with a board that over and undershoots CPU_LLC. Hard to teach with a keyboard for communication.

By the way, Asus says what you want to see is done with Offset Vcore setting and they even have written up how to do it if I am correct. Low idling Vcore and initiate the Offset Vcore when loaded.
RGone...

 

[Johan45]

Hehehe. I know it is always strokes for folks. I just prefer knowing that what I set in bios is what I will get for Vcore. I don't like having to calculate what I will get underload hopefully since it can change. I know what you did and could do it as well. But try and teach that to the newbs with a board that over and undershoots CPU_LLC. Hard to teach with a keyboard for communication. QUOTE]
Ya I hear ya on that one, I only know cause I messed around for awhile to find what it's max would be.

By the way, Asus says what you want to see is done with Offset Vcore setting and they even have written up how to do it if I am correct. Low idling Vcore and initiate the Offset Vcore when loaded.
RGone...[/

I might have to look into that My PRO with the 965 only moves .25 just like Trents seen with his. I might backtrack on the bios cause i've heard it said in these forums that the older versions were more in tune with the denebs and thubans. Maybe I'll see a difference maybe not. We'll see

 

[trents]

By the way, Asus says what you want to see is done with Offset Vcore setting and they even have written up how to do it if I am correct. Low idling Vcore and initiate the Offset Vcore when loaded.
RGone...

Really! I'll have to look into that soon. I always put those things on manual, 'cause like you with LLC, I don't like to do the math.

 

[trents]

Maybe I'm missing some other settings need to "unleash" the power of the offset mode but so far what I've tried with it seems to show nothing but an alternate way of declaring the CPU vcore in bios on my board. It seems to have no effect under load.

 

[RGone]

Felt a little better tonght so let my fingers onto the Keyboard.

Okay one thing I need to say first so that I do not forget.
1. > Offset Vcore will not work without Cool N Quiet enabled. I likely also would leave C1E enabled. Not sure about the new APM (Application Program Management For FX processor).TurboCore can be off. And down the way will speak to Windows power maangement mode.

2, > CPU VID is a voltage programmed into the cpu to tell the Bios what to use as default voltage to the cpu.

3. > It is my understanding that CPU VID can/could/might change with the load. Not sure on AMD cpus since there is not nearly as much info about the AMD cpus as there is for Intel.

4. > This is what Asus intends for CPU_LLC to do. At least on the CHV where the greater amount of information was available.
CPU Load Line Calibration: The “Regular” option sets a margin between the user set voltage and the actual voltage to ensure that the real-time voltage level does not breach (overshoot) the set VID by longer than AMD specifications.
Medium and High, set a tighter margin between the idle and full load voltage, so that idle voltage does not need to be ramped excessively to meet full-load voltage requirements when the processor is overclocked.

Ultra-High and Extreme may over-volt past what you’ve set in BIOS in an attempt to ensure that the voltage does not sag below the applied voltage for a long duration (when the VRM is faced with a heavy load). Auto is currently configured to default to Extreme LLC, so it’s an idea to set Medium or High manually if you do not want any visible over-voltage.

We prefer to use the Medium setting for most overclocking as it seems to compliment the transient response of the VRM (Vdroop on the Medium setting is around 0.05V on the current BIOSes). << Note that about current bioses. I would read that to mean the Vdroop amount may change with bios version. << My note.

What I have said openly in the forums is that I prefer setting my Vcore manually and choosing an LLC mode that maintains MY manual Vcore setting loaded or unloaded, then I am not guessing. Old school I suppose.

There is another way perhaps. I have not done this because of statement above.

Might need to add another note here. Denebs have far fewer Pstates than the later FX processors since the FX processors have multiple speed TurboCore. Each of those Pstates to my understanding can call for a greater CPU VID setting or in effect that base VID needed to operate the cpu. This known it should be far easier to use Offset Vcore on Denebs than on the FX processors. FYI.

Now for setting Offset Vcore as I best understand it.
1. Manually set Vcore to the voltage that will pass P95 Blend mode for the length of time you wish P95 to run without failure. Do so with only Medium or High LLC setting.

2. Use CoreTemp to find the VID of your processor. There are other ways but more involved. CoreTemp gives the CPU_VID of the installed processor.

3. Alright we know what the CPU_VID of the processor is now. We know what we set the Vcore manually to pass P95 Blend for the desired length of time. So > #4.

4. Subtract the CPU_VID from the Manual Vcore we had to use to pass P95 and that result should be the number you would use as + XXXX setting in Offset mode. Maintain the Medium or High mode of CPU_LLC since that is what was tested with using manual setting.

5. So now what happens? Well when you put Win 7 in "Balanced" power mode and you are doing nothing on the computer at all but maybe a little surfing, the Balanced mode setting will drop the cpu speed back to the PerCentage of WideOpen speed that you have chosen in Win 7 power mode settings. I use 15% and not the default 5% of max cpu speed at idle type loads. Continuing, I will have a slow cpu speed setting and Cool N Quiet will have dropped the Vcore down to the CPU-VID and will NOT have applied the OFFSET Voltage which comes on as Load is Raised on the cpu. Now we have a more energy efficient system that is not always running wide open speeds and voltages and always outputting heat.

6. There are no telling how many posts I have read off and on about Offset Vcore. I have tried to take some of those, all over the map posts, and cut them down to the essentials in how it should all work.

7. I do not for a second believe there will not have to a little tweaking done to the process as described. I don't know of anything that ever seems to just work.

Just a couple of more thoughts for clarity. I wrote this based on my CHV motherboard. How its' LLC is made to work. Obviously there are Asus boards that do not have those levels of CPU_LLC. That in itself would make for 'adjusting'.

I also know exactly what my CPU_LLC will do at each level. I have tested it as some have as well. Therefore if one has X CPU_VID (from CoreTemp) and his subtracted result from #4 above is as an example is 0.1250, I could instead of using 0.1250 as my + Offset Vcore number; I could use 0.1350 or close as possible and be sure of sufficient Vcore at Wide Open cpu speed at full load using the same CPU_LLC as in #4 above.

Vdroop is instituted by the Cpu manufactures to keep the VRM rise in Vcore from damaging processors. LLC was instituted to try and keep the Vcore closer to the setting in bios without allowing possibly damaging rises in Vcore but maintaining enough Vcore to pull the load on the processor. So if I use Offset Vcore and a medium CPU_LLC, it may well be possible to get even a little better than the best of both worlds.

One more time, I think I will state that getting the hang of the principle maybe easier on Deneb processors since they do not have so many Pstates that may influence the CPU_VID. Of course with me and my board and cpu...well nothing for it but to have to deal with FX-8350 and my CHV when I get back on it. Maybe this will give those who tinker and have the skills, an idea to see what happens. About it as I see it.
RGone..

EDIT:
I alwsys have had Cool N Quiet enabled on my CHV board. I use the Balanced mode in Win7 power manager to drop my Cpu speed from 4.4Ghz and 4.8Ghz to approx 1600Mhz. So having Cool N Quiet enabled does not mess up MY overclock. When I post in the forum I move Win7 to performnce mode so the throttle down is not seen in Screen Captures.
END EDIT. .

 

[Johan45]

Thanks for the detailed info RGone
I'll give that a try with the 965 this weekend if time permits. Doesn't sound like it'll be too time intensive and would suit that rig quite well, since it's either surfing/netflix or running full bore on SETI.

 

[RGone]

Thanks for the detailed info RGone
I'll give that a try with the 965 this weekend if time permits. Doesn't sound like it'll be too time intensive and would suit that rig quite well, since it's either surfing/netflix or running full bore on SETI.

Yeh, the Offset Vcore mode should do well if trying on the 965 refers to the HTPC listed in signature. It surely could benefit from running lesser Vcore all the time. You likely have all your required Vcore either committed to memory or a page of notes. I have my required Vcores written down so all I need really is the real CPU_VID. Good luck man.
RGone...

 

[Johan45]

Ya that's the same garbage chip

 

[trents]

I wish there was a way to backup bios overclocking profiles to disc. I hate it when I change some setting and the computer won't reboot and then I have to reset CMOS and lose all the stuff I painstakingly entered.

 

[Mandrake4565]

Indeed!

 

[trents]

Well, vcore is set to 1.5 in bios and that makes it Prime95 stable. Wish it were under 1.5 but with my new cooler the CPU socket temp is only 29c at idle so I'm not real concerned.

 

[RGone]

Humh? Does clearing the CMOS on the Asus board, clear the saved bios profiles as well? I guess I am living in "dated" mode. DFI had saved profiles separate from the CMOS and we could save the profile to disk and use a proprietary program to retrieve or move the saved profile to another computer even. Shett shett.

I have the bios captures saved to three or four locations so I can at least 'see' what I had set bios to. But I swear, I guess I have done this crap so long and always the same on any AMD board that I can remember all my bios settings for the normal and overclocked video edit speed. That said, I find it hard with this old memory I have to remember my name some mornings. Hehehe.
RGone...

 

[trents]

Haven't had to clear the CMOS on my new board but on the M5A97 nonevo that had the burnt trace, clearing the CMOS wiped the profiles.

 

[RGone]

Haven't had to clear the CMOS on my new board but on the M5A97 nonevo that had the burnt trace, clearing the CMOS wiped the profiles.

Shett shett. Will have to see what my CHV does now that you got me wondering.
RGone...

 

[trents]

Yeah, without being able to save those stable profiles it puts a damper on experimentation.

 

[caddi daddi]

prettyful build Mr. Trents.
I bet the little fishy would behave a little better if you filled the bowl with everclear( or at least taste a little better).

 

[Mandrake4565]

LOL Caddi and his everclear.