Pros and Cons of Windows 8 over previous versions

[||Console||]

I read somthing the other day about Win 8 using Truecontrol (I think) chip that can let any one with the back door key totaly control the pc ?
edit found it http://investmentwatchblog.com/leak...-entities-not-to-use-windows-8-links-the-nsa/

 

[awktane]

Technically the quickest way on a default install of windows 8 or server 2012 is to hit ctrl-alt-del (or for a rdp session ctrl-alt-end) and then click the power button at the bottom right.

 

[mbentley]

Technically the quickest way on a default install of windows 8 or server 2012 is to hit ctrl-alt-del (or for a rdp session ctrl-alt-end) and then click the power button at the bottom right.

That was one of the other ways they found to be among the quickest

 

[c627627]

I read somthing the other day about Win 8 using Truecontrol (I think) chip that can let any one with the back door key totaly control the pc ?
edit found it http://investmentwatchblog.com/leak...-entities-not-to-use-windows-8-links-the-nsa/

I would comment on that with the old Script Kiddie vs. NSA answer.


Script Kiddies [unskilled individuals who use scripts or programs developed by others to attack computer systems] cannot take advantage of backdoors like that.

NSA employees and similarly skilled individuals can access your computer but they can access it regardless of whether it is running Windows 7 or Windows 8 so that's the big picture here. Having Windows 7 instead of Windows 8 is not going to protect you from a highly skilled determined individual.

 

[awktane]

I read somthing the other day about Win 8 using Truecontrol (I think) chip that can let any one with the back door key totaly control the pc ?
edit found it http://investmentwatchblog.com/leak...-entities-not-to-use-windows-8-links-the-nsa/

TPM is for secure certificate storage. The only thing I'm aware of that microsoft uses it for is bitlocker. It has nothing to do with what software runs. Am I missing something?

Edit: Ah I found a semi-intelligent look at the subject... http://www.zdnet.com/dont-let-paranoia-over-the-nsa-and-tpm-weaken-your-security-7000019791/

As usual, all features related to the TPM can be disabled if you are concerned about government brain probes.

 

[awktane]

That was one of the other ways they found to be among the quickest

I find it odd that from the Server Manager you can shut down remote servers but not restart them without bringing up the powershell. To me that's an odd thing to leave out.

 

[m715]

Well 1st a big thanks again to c627627 for the heads up on ClassicShell many months ago, makes using WIN8 viable

I was a big Windows 8 hater and I still don't like it purely because of the metro interface which is built primarily for entertainment and social media, NOT productivity.

The metro interface works good for smart phones and tablets with a touchscreen, but is a flop (at least in my view) in terms of a desktop and laptop. I don't think I use any of their apps as I've run into issues with pretty much all of them for my purposes, they make me feel like it should be called "Window 8", not Windows.

BUT that said with classic shell windows 8 works just fine, I have it set so I never see the metro interface when my computer starts up. I'd say for one memory management seems to be better in WIN8 vs WIN7.

I will say I've had more problems installing WIN8 on computers than I have ever experienced with WIN7.

 

[goose90proof]

How exactly do you get to the place where you claim things are different in Windows 8, what PC Settings?

This stuff here. Some things in control panel will ultimately point to PC settings. I want to also highlight my previous point on things taking at least 1 more step to do.

In W7, I hit the windows key and start typing. I've been using windows for a while. I know the command for just about any control panel snap-in or mmc module and can pop it open in about 3 seconds. In W8, I hit the Windows, now Metro key and something else happens depending on 1 of two things: If I'm using a tablet, I have to right-click/gesture, tap in the search field, and then start typing when the awful soft keyboard comes up (getting better at the soft keyboard). If It's a computer with a hard keyboard, I can just start start typing, but if what I'm looking for is in Settings and not Applications, I have to take my hand off the keyboard, click on the "Settings" search category and see if my desired result is there, and click on it. DO. NOT. LIKE. It slows things down. I like to be able to use the keyboard as much as possible for navigation.

EDIT: I like it on this Samsung tablet I have at work. It's perfect for devices that don't have a hard keyboard when I just need to be able to point and something, but for desktops, I prefer W7.

 

[pcgamer4life]

If It's a computer with a hard keyboard, I can just start start typing, but if what I'm looking for is in Settings and not Applications, I have to take my hand off the keyboard, click on the "Settings" search category and see if my desired result is there, and click on it. DO. NOT. LIKE. It slows things down. I like to be able to use the keyboard as much as possible for navigation.

This is something I brought up a page or so back. mbentley informed me that this is supposedly going to be fixed in 8.1, which I'm happy to hear.

And, FYI, you don't have to use the mouse to click, you can use tab/down arrow to get there.

 

[mbentley]

Yeah, I would have to agree that I hate combinations where I have to take my hands off of the keyboard, to the mouse, back to the keyboard, etc. I try to keep my hands from having to move as much as possible. Adds quite a bit of speed if you can either get away with one or the other. I still prefer the keyboard for most 'quick shortcuts' though as they are universally easy on any keyboard. Switching between mice isn't always quite so easy, especially if I am using a trackpad versus my mouse at work. Makes me a bit more sluggish.

 

[c627627]

This stuff

goose90proof, once again, you are in default Windows 8 Metro which you would not be in if you installed Classic Shell, which would give you what you are looking for under Window 8, including PC settings.

You can also use this shortcut to access PC Settings from Desktop the way you want them to look
%windir%\System32\Control.exe

In W8, I hit the Windows, now Metro key and something else happens.

Why are you using Windows 8 without Classic Shell installed!? That's like torturing yourself. Use Classic Shell to click on the Start Button where you can immediately start typing under Windows 8 just like you could under Windows 7.

I prefer W7.

What can you not do under Windows 8 that you can do under Windows 7 after you install and configure Classic Shell correctly?

http://sourceforge.net/projects/classicshell/files/

 

[goose90proof]

I concede. You are right. Classic Shell fixes all my complaints. I bow before our new Windows 8 overlords.

but I still don't like it...

 

[c627627]

You should follow that up with a reason because after you make it identical to Windows 7, what does it have that makes it worse?

I only ask because maybe there is something in there that worse than under Win7.


Not counting having to spend 30 seconds to install Classic Shell, so far I only see one possible problem: software compatibility. But the thing is, when someone posts a popular program claiming it cannot run under Windows 8, a simple search reveals the problem is user specific, not OS-specific. It turns out other people run the same software fine under Win8, but if there is a software compatibility problem, that would be a reason not to go with it.

 

[goose90proof]

I honestly can't think of anything right now. I never bothered to install classic shell until today. I'm just resisting the change. I like the number 7 better, than 8... does that count?

 

[Culbrelai]

Pros:
•Not Windows Vista
•Great for Tablets
•Microsoft account synchronization
•Works well with free Hypver-V Core 2012

Cons:
•Adds at least 1 step to any administrative operation (search, change settings, etc.)
•No start menu (the 8.1 start menu is not a start menu)
•Complete departure from control panel organization traditional as of WinXP (so confusing)
•Windows 8


Quote:
Originally Posted by c627627
There is no difference, no difference whatsoever between Windows 7 and Windows 8 after the quick Classic Shell install.

Not true. Control panel is totally different. General navigation through Windows is different. It is less optimized for productivity than Windows 7 - IMO.

Truth.

I dislike File Explorer (Formerly Windows Explorer) and it's ribbons, which again serve no purpose but to annoy. The right click menu in Windows Explorer was enough.

There are also two Control panels now, the normal desktop one and the Metro one.

I generally dislike having to hide a large portion of the operating system and act like it's not there to have an enjoyable productive user experience, when I can just go with Windows 7, where there is nothing to hide.

 

[c627627]

I honestly can't think of anything right now. I never bothered to install classic shell until today. I'm just resisting the change. I like the number 7 better, than 8... does that count?

100% absolutely yes. 'Because I feel like it' has always been a valid reason in my book.

 

[MattNo5ss]

The only downside I see to Windows 8 is having to rely on a 3rd party fix to give consumers their options.

Consumers shouldn't have to resort to these 3rd party fixes. All of those options should be available in the stock Windows 8. The majority of consumers will use out-of-the-box Windows 8 because it's pre-installed on their OEM PC. The majority of consumers are not tech-savy or even think it's possible to find some seemingly random 3rd party fix on the interwebz to give them the options they want.

 

[goose90proof]

The only downside I see to Windows 8 is having to rely on a 3rd party fix to give consumers their options.

Consumers shouldn't have to resort to these 3rd party fixes. All of those options should be available in the stock Windows 8. The majority of consumers will use out-of-the-box Windows 8 because it's pre-installed on their OEM PC. The majority of consumers are not tech-savy or even think it's possible to find some seemingly random 3rd party fix on the interwebz to give them the options they want.

Good point. Windows 8 out of the box I do not like. I sometimes have to provide support for my companies software products. When stuff gets to me, it's supposed to be top tier, but I've gotten some Windows 8 users that were ultimately having problems because of the OS, not the product. There are some new concepts.

 

[mbentley]

The only downside I see to Windows 8 is having to rely on a 3rd party fix to give consumers their options.

Consumers shouldn't have to resort to these 3rd party fixes. All of those options should be available in the stock Windows 8. The majority of consumers will use out-of-the-box Windows 8 because it's pre-installed on their OEM PC. The majority of consumers are not tech-savy or even think it's possible to find some seemingly random 3rd party fix on the interwebz to give them the options they want.

Good point. Windows 8 out of the box I do not like. I sometimes have to provide support for my companies software products. When stuff gets to me, it's supposed to be top tier, but I've gotten some Windows 8 users that were ultimately having problems because of the OS, not the product. There are some new concepts.

At least Microsoft isn't going all Apple* and squashing 3rd party tools from working when they make the product more useable for a fair number of users


*As a side note, I love my iPhone but it would be nice if they would allow people to jailbreak without having to go through exploits to do it.

 

[SteveLord]

For Apple's tactics I sure don't have to fix their devices as much. And I would say without a doubt that their iOS devices are less susceptible to viruses because of that compared to Android and Microsoft. And unlike their computers, the amount of iOS devices out there presents no shortage of targets. So if you ask me, that argument doesn't stand as well as people would like it to. Just like the original ones about no removable battery and how not being able to play Flash was an end to the world.

To be fair, managing such simple devices on the IT side is anything but that. Apple's enterprise support could have been a lot better. And other products that provide it are ultimately limited by what Apple allows them to do.

As for Windows 8, I see nothing worth the money and labor if you already have 7. The fact you have to **** around with it immediately has never sat well with me. With Windows 7, I generally disable UAC (a terrible feature, so let's not use that to promote 7 or 8) and then I could be good to go. At least major vendors like HP allow for some choice when purchasing new systems. I can get it installed with 7 downgraded from 8. So that way I still have licenses for both.

So do we all just need to get use to buying every other operating system and every other technology advances in general?