i always thought it was better to copy to hdd first. are dvd burners so good now that it doesn't matter if you copy straight from disc now or hdd? i remember long time ago with a cdr burner it wasn't so good to copy from disc to disc but better to copy from hdd to disc.
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The Overclocking Buyers Guide
- Thread starter splat
- Start date
i always thought it was better to copy to hdd first. are dvd burners so good now that it doesn't matter if you copy straight from disc now or hdd? i remember long time ago with a cdr burner it wasn't so good to copy from disc to disc but better to copy from hdd to disc.
OP
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2002
- Thread Starter
- #82
when computers were slower and had less memory, it was riskier to try and copy straight from disc to disc. it was also risky to try and multitask while writing a cd. but most modern computers are fast enough and have enough ram to not have to worry about these things anymore
OP
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2002
- Thread Starter
- #83
Updated!!! sorry, real life has been in the way.
edit: forgot to mention that all the links have been updated to try and include some OCForums Price Grabber info, to try and help the forums out a little (thanks to IMOG for the idea)
edit: forgot to mention that all the links have been updated to try and include some OCForums Price Grabber info, to try and help the forums out a little (thanks to IMOG for the idea)
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- Joined
- Mar 6, 2003
According to that link the Intel Core i7 920 is not $189.99 but $279.99.
In fact all of those are wrong, the total for the High-End Intel is $560.
In fact all of those are wrong, the total for the High-End Intel is $560.
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Nice guide! I really like your concept of OC/$$$. A nice addition might be something like raw performance/$. It would really help guys like me out who are interested in the most economic solution for a specified budget.
Is there rough math on figuring performance on a quad vs dual core.
At the same MHZ is the quad twice as powerful, or more, or less?
Is there rough math on figuring performance on a quad vs dual core.
At the same MHZ is the quad twice as powerful, or more, or less?
OP
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2002
- Thread Starter
- #88
performance really is a relative term because depends on too many variables. once cpu might be better in one program then another. I still don't like to recommend quad core cpus unless you have a specific need for it, like folding or video editing. I think dual cores are still easier to overclock and I think the quads come with a price premium, so the dual core cpus are just a better value for a general gamer/internet user.
that being said, once you are choosing between cpus in the same family you can generally look at mhz and cache size as directly effecting performance. more mhz, more cache give more perfomance, basically. theres more to it than that, but one easy way to check relative performance is to look at the charts on hwbot.org for the different programs
OP
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2002
- Thread Starter
- #89
Nice guide, splat.
I wouldn't be so hard on the quads. Once people figure out they can easy virtualize for free, people will realize that quads are the only way to go. For starters, why dual boot when you can run multiple OS's in desktop windows? And hey, talk about easy system backup. Your system is one file. Then there are snapshots before you do that yum update. The use cases go on and on.
If you are lucky to live near a Micro Center, you can grab the i7 720 for $200. This puppy can be easily clocked by a beginner to 3.8 mhz on air. Don't forget it throws in hyperthreading, giving you 8 virtual CPUs to delegate to your VMs.
I do wonder how I can have 8 distinct temp readings, though (lm_sensors).
Here is a system I just built. I chose components I could throw in my shopping cart at MicroCenter. Nice being able to exchange parts locally.
Keep up the good work, though. I love building systems and threads like yours help us get others into it.
I wouldn't be so hard on the quads. Once people figure out they can easy virtualize for free, people will realize that quads are the only way to go. For starters, why dual boot when you can run multiple OS's in desktop windows? And hey, talk about easy system backup. Your system is one file. Then there are snapshots before you do that yum update. The use cases go on and on.
If you are lucky to live near a Micro Center, you can grab the i7 720 for $200. This puppy can be easily clocked by a beginner to 3.8 mhz on air. Don't forget it throws in hyperthreading, giving you 8 virtual CPUs to delegate to your VMs.
I do wonder how I can have 8 distinct temp readings, though (lm_sensors).
Here is a system I just built. I chose components I could throw in my shopping cart at MicroCenter. Nice being able to exchange parts locally.
Keep up the good work, though. I love building systems and threads like yours help us get others into it.
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OP
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2002
- Thread Starter
- #91
quads+ definitely have their place, but they still require a specific need to really shine. Games are starting to become multithreaded, but right now there isn't enough to make a basic user require the use of a quad. Virtualization is a great example of where more cores does work better, but i'd say that is still a niche instead of mainstream, so if you know you are going to be virtualizing then go ahead and load up on as many cores as you can as well as RAM.
for the general gamer today, their money is still better spent on a dual core with higher mhz than a quad core with lower mhz. i'm sure that will change in the near future tho.
for the general gamer today, their money is still better spent on a dual core with higher mhz than a quad core with lower mhz. i'm sure that will change in the near future tho.
Yeah, need update with AM3 socket, X3 chip and intels i5 in there for budget rigs.
Also putting AMD 955BE against an intel i7 965 extreme is just silly. These builds should be on price breaks not performance breaks.
OP
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2002
- Thread Starter
- #95
Thanks for updating this Splat! I have some of my own suggestions of course but not necessary to incorporate them.
I'd pick a 4870 or 4890 over the GTX260 anyday and its at the same price break almost. They also have drivers for Linux 32 bit and 64bit. The only problem is they don't fold well. The one caveat is that ATI has back-filled all the performance points with their 5xxx series cards which put them even farther ahead of nVidia (except the GTX260 IMO). Maybe slot these cards in your builds instead?
High End: Radeon 5870 - $409
Mid Level: Radeon 5850 - $310
$200 card is between the Radeon HD 4890 and the GTX 275.
$150-175 range is between the Radeon HD5770 and GTX260. Its a wash and I'd rather the DX11 and better multi-monitor support.
IMO going from the Radeon 5890 to GTX260 in the next performance break is too much of a decrease since these days games rely heavily on GPU. 600 to 160 dollars in a card? If I spend over 1000 for a comp I'm going to want more than a GTX260, even though the card is still viable in some applications. High-End should at least be able to play the latest games with all the bells and whistles turned on and that would mean a GTX285 or Radeon HD 5870.
What about recommending a dual core chip for the budget build. Single core chips are pretty old and dual core AMD's start at around 60 bucks. 30 bucks for the newer generation is worth it. (I'm thinkin Athlon II X2 Regor 240 here).
You could shave some cost off the budget AMD rig with a different board. Since Regor is AM3 it might look something like this.
ASUS M4A785TD-V EVO 99.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131398
AMD Athlon II X2 Regor 240 $55.00 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...e=amd_athlon_ii_x2_240-_-19-103-714-_-Product
Crucial Ballistix 2x1GB DDR3 1333 $57.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148338
$212.98 Total as opposed to $223.98 Giving up CrossFireX and slight performance going from 790FX to 785G chipset. But in a budget rig, you're not going to Xfire or notice the difference in chipsets anyways.
For mid-level the AMD Athlon II X4 presents a serious value. Its got less gaming performance with the lack of L3 cache and it is not unlocked which makes it more difficult to overclock but at $99.00 its a steal. X3 is great if you can unlock the fourth core and games slightly better but the AII X4 beats it stock on many other fronts even with its slower clock speed. Its basically a Deneb core without the L3. DDR3, AM3, extra core ready for future apps that are optimized for it, which are becoming more prevalent. From an overclocking standpoint 3.2-3.5ghz range is happenin on air.
Here's a nice review on it.
http://www.guru3d.com/article/amd-athlon-ii-x4-620-review-test/1
AMD Athlon II X4 Propus 620 $99.00 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...706&cm_re=athlon_ii_x4-_-19-103-706-_-Product
You DFI LP790FX AM3 board is a great buy!
Exreme End: Since we're overclocking this system, I'd go with the i7 920 instead of the 965. Put the extra money into a good water cooling setup. If no water, switch to the Megahalems CPU cooler. Its the same price but better cooling. Also, I'd scale the case costs because someone paying 2400 dollars for a comp is going to want a nice case to put it in.
Maybe go with the Corsair 800D here for extreme end. Antec 900 Two for High, and Cooler Master Storm Scout for mid. Cases are more of a personal choice though.
CPU Coolers for overclocking: Some other suggestions would be these, cheaper, with equal or better performance:
AMD
Thermalright Ultra Extreme 120 (no fan included) $46.99 http://jab-tech.com/Thermalright-Ultra-120-eXtreme-AM2-BP-pr-4387.html
*XIGMATEK HDT-S1283 $34.98 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ..._re=xigmatek_hdt-s1283-_-35-233-003-_-Product
^seriously good price/performance ratio.
Intel
Thermalright TRUE (no fan included) $64.95 http://jab-tech.com/Thermalright-TRUE-black-Rev-C-pr-4528.html
Prolimatech Megahalems (no fan included) $62.95 http://jab-tech.com/Prolimatech-Megahalems-CPU-Cooler-775-1366-1156-Rev-B-pr-4557.html
*XIGMATEK HDT-S1283 $34.98 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ..._re=xigmatek_hdt-s1283-_-35-233-003-_-Product
DVD drive. Plextor makes good stuff but if you don't burn very often, which for me is becoming more and more infrequent as I have the internet and usb sticks that are easier to use for file moving, I would be apt to cheap out on the drive. For instance this one with same capability but 20 bucks cheaper.
Samsung DVD/R/RW Combo Drive $30.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151175
Anyways, thanks for the work and updates. This will be a useful reference point for new overclockers!
I'd pick a 4870 or 4890 over the GTX260 anyday and its at the same price break almost. They also have drivers for Linux 32 bit and 64bit. The only problem is they don't fold well. The one caveat is that ATI has back-filled all the performance points with their 5xxx series cards which put them even farther ahead of nVidia (except the GTX260 IMO). Maybe slot these cards in your builds instead?
High End: Radeon 5870 - $409
Mid Level: Radeon 5850 - $310
$200 card is between the Radeon HD 4890 and the GTX 275.
$150-175 range is between the Radeon HD5770 and GTX260. Its a wash and I'd rather the DX11 and better multi-monitor support.
IMO going from the Radeon 5890 to GTX260 in the next performance break is too much of a decrease since these days games rely heavily on GPU. 600 to 160 dollars in a card? If I spend over 1000 for a comp I'm going to want more than a GTX260, even though the card is still viable in some applications. High-End should at least be able to play the latest games with all the bells and whistles turned on and that would mean a GTX285 or Radeon HD 5870.
What about recommending a dual core chip for the budget build. Single core chips are pretty old and dual core AMD's start at around 60 bucks. 30 bucks for the newer generation is worth it. (I'm thinkin Athlon II X2 Regor 240 here).
You could shave some cost off the budget AMD rig with a different board. Since Regor is AM3 it might look something like this.
ASUS M4A785TD-V EVO 99.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131398
AMD Athlon II X2 Regor 240 $55.00 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...e=amd_athlon_ii_x2_240-_-19-103-714-_-Product
Crucial Ballistix 2x1GB DDR3 1333 $57.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148338
$212.98 Total as opposed to $223.98 Giving up CrossFireX and slight performance going from 790FX to 785G chipset. But in a budget rig, you're not going to Xfire or notice the difference in chipsets anyways.
For mid-level the AMD Athlon II X4 presents a serious value. Its got less gaming performance with the lack of L3 cache and it is not unlocked which makes it more difficult to overclock but at $99.00 its a steal. X3 is great if you can unlock the fourth core and games slightly better but the AII X4 beats it stock on many other fronts even with its slower clock speed. Its basically a Deneb core without the L3. DDR3, AM3, extra core ready for future apps that are optimized for it, which are becoming more prevalent. From an overclocking standpoint 3.2-3.5ghz range is happenin on air.
Here's a nice review on it.
http://www.guru3d.com/article/amd-athlon-ii-x4-620-review-test/1
AMD Athlon II X4 Propus 620 $99.00 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...706&cm_re=athlon_ii_x4-_-19-103-706-_-Product
You DFI LP790FX AM3 board is a great buy!
Exreme End: Since we're overclocking this system, I'd go with the i7 920 instead of the 965. Put the extra money into a good water cooling setup. If no water, switch to the Megahalems CPU cooler. Its the same price but better cooling. Also, I'd scale the case costs because someone paying 2400 dollars for a comp is going to want a nice case to put it in.
Maybe go with the Corsair 800D here for extreme end. Antec 900 Two for High, and Cooler Master Storm Scout for mid. Cases are more of a personal choice though.
CPU Coolers for overclocking: Some other suggestions would be these, cheaper, with equal or better performance:
AMD
Thermalright Ultra Extreme 120 (no fan included) $46.99 http://jab-tech.com/Thermalright-Ultra-120-eXtreme-AM2-BP-pr-4387.html
*XIGMATEK HDT-S1283 $34.98 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ..._re=xigmatek_hdt-s1283-_-35-233-003-_-Product
^seriously good price/performance ratio.
Intel
Thermalright TRUE (no fan included) $64.95 http://jab-tech.com/Thermalright-TRUE-black-Rev-C-pr-4528.html
Prolimatech Megahalems (no fan included) $62.95 http://jab-tech.com/Prolimatech-Megahalems-CPU-Cooler-775-1366-1156-Rev-B-pr-4557.html
*XIGMATEK HDT-S1283 $34.98 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ..._re=xigmatek_hdt-s1283-_-35-233-003-_-Product
DVD drive. Plextor makes good stuff but if you don't burn very often, which for me is becoming more and more infrequent as I have the internet and usb sticks that are easier to use for file moving, I would be apt to cheap out on the drive. For instance this one with same capability but 20 bucks cheaper.
Samsung DVD/R/RW Combo Drive $30.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151175
Anyways, thanks for the work and updates. This will be a useful reference point for new overclockers!
- Joined
- Oct 11, 2005
- Location
- Tau'ri
For the High end intel I would not recommend a p55 setup, for the same price you can grab a X58 chip and board and have more longevity from the system. The P55 budget system is okay though
OP
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2002
- Thread Starter
- #100
all are great suggestions and my only retort is that these simply focus on overclocking, not over-all system performance. I spent most of my time researching mobo-ram-proc combos and the rest is basically thrown in to complete the build. Most of the combos I chose were either based on price (for the oc/$) or simply by popularity at HWBot.
I also stuck with air cooling on all builds for simplicity, which of course if one is looking to really go crazy with overclocking they are going to use water, dice, or ln2 and they're going to use whatever expensive full featured mobo they want can get their hands on.
