HELP: Wireless Keyboard

[chillz]

I am the sad owner of a useless G915. Long story short, I can't update the firmware and now I'm stuck with this ridiculously expensive un-customizable keyboard. In case Logitech can't fix it (which is most likely) I've started looking for a replacement.

I'm looking for pretty much everything the G915 is, except with a longer lifespan. Here's my criteria:

1) Full-size -OR- TKL + Numpad -OR- Southpaw layout
2) 2.4GHz wireless
3) 5+ Macro keys
4) Backlit (RGB not necessary)
5) Does not have to be mechanical


After several days of research I'm considering a few of options:

1) Any wireless TKL + EPOMAKER TH21 numpad
2) Logitech G613 (I know it's another Logitech G keyboard but it checks all the boxes and I can easily find it for less than $100CAD)
3) EPOMAKER TH80 Pro Barebone + FEKER JJK21 Barebone (most expensive prospect since I also have to get switches and keycaps)


I did check out the usual brands like Microsoft, Logitech, Keychron, Razer, etc. Obviously I'm looking mainly at gaming keyboards because they would most likely have dedicated macro keys. Surprisingly, not many fit the bill.

From personal experience I don't care for Corsair's peripherals, which is unfortunate because they have a couple of keyboards that meet all my requirements. But their software is worse than G-HUB and their connectivity sucks.

Logitech does have some consumer keyboards (mechanical and non-mechanical) with "programmable keys" but they do not have dedicated keys. Most likely I can write a macro on a key, or at least assign a function to a hotkey, but I would probably have to use an [FN] key or something to activate.

I did check out Keychron and their Q12 has a southpaw variant. Unfortunately it's not wireless. I was thinking maybe a TKL + numpad, but their numpads are all wired. This bummed me out since their build quality is stellar, and their software has evolved greatly over the years.

RK is another brand I was interested in, but sadly no keyboards with macro keys, and no numpads.

Now I only heard of EPOMAKER last year, and they do have a wireless southpaw keyboard (SKYLOONG GK96LS). But it's only Bluetooth. Fortunately they do have 2.4GHz numpads and a decent selection of TKLs so I'm leaning towards them. The downside is that their build material is mainly plastic, and I found mixed reviews on their software.

There are a ton of other brands out there but I'm hesitant to consider a product with sketchy reviews and limited resources. And I'm not savvy enough to program my own keyboard so I want to enter an ecosystem that's somewhat simplified and intuitive, and well supported by the brand and community. Any insight into the brands and/or products I've mentioned would be a huge help, especially on their longevity and software. Or if you have better options for me to consider please let me know. Thanks all!

 

[rainless]

Don't buy another Logitech. I'll make fun of you mercilessly for the rest of your life and you don't wanna be that guy.

I have a brand new wireless Logitech mouse and keyboard. The table is like three feet from the desktop tower... signal is interrupted CONSTANTLY. I can't sit there and type a number into Photoshop. Can barely use the mouse. NOTHIN but blinking lights. I'll never buy another Logitech product again. I have to go back to the old mouse and keyboard that this one was supposed to be replacing!

Fool me once... shame on you... Don't let them fool you again. That would just be stupid.

 

[Woomack]

Maybe it won't be much of a help, but I personally like more standard keyboards (the best with flat/laptop type keys) with a backlight (RGB or white, doesn't matter, just to see better in a dark room) and a mouse with multiple programmable buttons (macros and everything else). I'm using Razer Naga X right now, but before that, I was using Corsair Scimitar. I'm not a fan of Razer, but there is not a big choice on the market, and this one seems fine.

 

[rainless]

Maybe it won't be much of a help, but I personally like more standard keyboards (the best with flat/laptop type keys) with a backlight (RGB or white, doesn't matter, just to see better in a dark room) and a mouse with multiple programmable buttons (macros and everything else). I'm using Razer Naga X right now, but before that, I was using Corsair Scimitar. I'm not a fan of Razer, but there is not a big choice on the market, and this one seems fine.

Wireless?

 

[MisterEd]

Don't buy another Logitech. I'll make fun of you mercilessly for the rest of your life and you don't wanna be that guy.

I have a brand new wireless Logitech mouse and keyboard. The table is like three feet from the desktop tower... signal is interrupted CONSTANTLY. I can't sit there and type a number into Photoshop. Can barely use the mouse. NOTHIN but blinking lights. I'll never buy another Logitech product again. I have to go back to the old mouse and keyboard that this one was supposed to be replacing!

Fool me once... shame on you... Don't let them fool you again. That would just be stupid.

Back in 2017 I bought a Logitech MK550 Wireless Keyboard and Mouse Combo:

• Wireless Keyboard K350
• Wireless Mouse M510

The mouse worked OK but the keyboard drove me crazy. Sometimes I had to kit a key numerous times before it would register. A lot searching online led me to believe the problem was related to interference at 2.4GHz. I tried a couple things that seemed to help a lot.

• I moved the USB dongle from a USB 3.0 to a USB 2.0 port.
• I moved as many wireless devices as possible from 2.4GHz to 5GHz.

The keyboard worked OK until a few months ago when the original problem returned but was worse. This time the solution was to replace the USB dongle. Now I wonder if the original dongle was faulty from the start.

 

[rainless]

Back in 2017 I bought a Logitech MK550 Wireless Keyboard and Mouse Combo:

• Wireless Keyboard K350
• Wireless Mouse M510

The mouse worked OK but the keyboard drove me crazy. Sometimes I had to kit a key numerous times before it would register. A lot searching online led me to believe the problem was related to interference at 2.4GHz. I tried a couple things that seemed to help a lot.

• I moved the USB dongle from a USB 3.0 to a USB 2.0 port.
• I moved as many wireless devices as possible from 2.4GHz to 5GHz.

The keyboard worked OK until a few months ago when the original problem returned but was worse. This time the solution was to replace the USB dongle. Now I wonder if the original dongle was faulty from the start.

If it was... then mine was, too. And about 600,000 other people's.

Seriously... Google this problem. You'll find more results than if you were to Google "Taylor Swift."

I would've returned my Keyboard and Mouse combo immediately if I wasn't hit with a blizzard of problems (Moto breaking down, getting locked out of my computer, getting sick) around that exact same time. I guess it's still under warranty... depending on how long Logitech's warranty is.

 

[Woomack]

Wireless?

Naga V2 Pro is wireless - https://www.razer.com/gaming-mice/razer-naga-v2-pro/RZ01-04400100-R3U1?cid=ecom_store
I'm using the wired version as it doesn't really matter to me, but it's much cheaper. I'm actually using all these 12 buttons on the side of the mouse
Corsair Scimitar is in a wireless version too, but also not cheap - https://www.corsair.com/ww/en/p/gam...elite-wireless-mmo-gaming-mouse-ch-9314311-na

 

[rainless]

(partial) Success! I got in contact with Logitech and managed to convince them to send me a replacement adapter for free. We'll see how that goes when it gets here...

In the meantime I see no alternative other than to go back to my previous Keyboard and mouse.

 

[chillz]

Maybe it won't be much of a help, but I personally like more standard keyboards (the best with flat/laptop type keys) with a backlight (RGB or white, doesn't matter, just to see better in a dark room) and a mouse with multiple programmable buttons (macros and everything else). I'm using Razer Naga X right now, but before that, I was using Corsair Scimitar. I'm not a fan of Razer, but there is not a big choice on the market, and this one seems fine.

I would love to use a basic keyboard, but I need the macro buttons on the left side (being left-handed) for video editing as well as gaming.

I used to have a wired Naga ages ago when I was hardcore gaming. It didn't last 4 months so I avoid Razer mice. Not to mention the toll it took on my hand trying to reach the back 3 buttons!

I currently have a G502 and it has enough buttons for some of my shortcuts and hotkeys. I just need 5 more tbh.

I'm also looking at standalone macro pads but can't seem to find one that has solid software and support. There's also the issues of cost, shipping ETA, and return/refund availability. Sure I can find a $20 macro pad on AliExpress but the 20-40 day delivery window and convoluted return policy is not an attractive prospect. So I'd rather purchase directly from a well-known company or an established retailer, even if I have to pay a premium.

 

[Woomack]

Not that I'm pushing the topic, but Naga is available for left-handed - https://www.razer.com/gaming-mice/Razer-Naga-Left-Handed-Edition/RZ01-03410100-R3M1
I just got my second Razer Naga X as in the last one, the first center/5 button is sometimes not working (like I have to click it twice or just push harder). It was on sale, so it's still the cheapest option. For me (I have quite large palms) it's a pretty comfortable mouse and more comfortable than Corsair Scimitar that I had before. I moved from Corsair because three mice in a row had problems with a wheel after about 2 years, literally, just after the end of warranty. I guess the new version is already modified, as it looks slightly different, but Razer was still significantly cheaper.

I'm not a fan of Razer, as their product endurance is sometimes not the best, but I can say about the same about most other brands. It's really a matter of luck, as I see. I generally like HyperX products, but they have no mice with multiple programmable buttons. I use their more standard gaming mouse and keyboard for a test rig, and I reviewed multiple HyperX products in the past. All were great and so far only one keyboard was broken after longer usage.

I got used to multiple programmed buttons a long time ago, and it was very handy earlier this year. I broke a finger in my left hand, and I got the news that on the broken bone was a tumor, so I had surgery, and in short for ~5 weeks at first and the next ~5 weeks after surgery, I could use mainly 2 fingers in my left hand, but I was still playing games as most stuff I had programmed in the mouse (not even macros, but mapped keyboard keys). In MMO like Black Desert, I was literally clicking W/S/A/D and nothing else. In Diablo 4 I was almost only using a mouse.

 

[chillz]

Don't buy another Logitech. I'll make fun of you mercilessly for the rest of your life and you don't wanna be that guy.

I have a brand new wireless Logitech mouse and keyboard. The table is like three feet from the desktop tower... signal is interrupted CONSTANTLY. I can't sit there and type a number into Photoshop. Can barely use the mouse. NOTHIN but blinking lights. I'll never buy another Logitech product again. I have to go back to the old mouse and keyboard that this one was supposed to be replacing!

Fool me once... shame on you... Don't let them fool you again. That would just be stupid.

Currently at $86CAD, the G613 is so tempting though! Especially since building my own keyboard will be extremely expensive. Going with EPOMAKER's barebone kits, it'll be at least the same cost as my G915. Going with the EPOMAKER ready-built TKL + Numpad is a little more reasonable at about $200CAD so I'm leaning towards that option.

I found a new possibility though. Redragon has a wireless TKL with 5 macro keys: K596 Vishnu. I know they're more of a budget brand, and I've never tried their products before, but they've been around for several years and seem to be doing well. But this particular model is just $6 less than the G613. Not to mention I'd prefer a full-size since I actually use the numpad.

I know I need to do more research on DIY keyboards; I'm pretty sure I can find a full size I can custom as a southpaw. Or maybe find a better alternative to EPOMAKER. If not, I might as well go all out and get the EPOMAKER barebone kits. But for the interim, maybe I'll just get the G613 seeing as how I'm already in the ecosystem. And I can do more research and save up for a proper DIY kit.

IDK. I'm at my wits end with all of this. Preferably I'd like Logitech to fix my keyboard so I don't have to buy anything. But ultimately I'd like to get away from Logitech's ecosystem altogether. I rarely use my G533 headset anymore so don't really need it. And although I love my Logitech mouse, I think I can find an alternative easily enough. I've also read that other brands have software with less memory demands than Logitech, Corsair, Razer, and the like. That, in and of itself, is incentive enough to make a move.

 

[chillz]

Not that I'm pushing the topic, but Naga is available for left-handed - https://www.razer.com/gaming-mice/Razer-Naga-Left-Handed-Edition/RZ01-03410100-R3M1
I just got my second Razer Naga X as in the last one, the first center/5 button is sometimes not working (like I have to click it twice or just push harder). It was on sale, so it's still the cheapest option. For me (I have quite large palms) it's a pretty comfortable mouse and more comfortable than Corsair Scimitar that I had before. I moved from Corsair because three mice in a row had problems with a wheel after about 2 years, literally, just after the end of warranty. I guess the new version is already modified, as it looks slightly different, but Razer was still significantly cheaper.

I'm not a fan of Razer, as their product endurance is sometimes not the best, but I can say about the same about most other brands. It's really a matter of luck, as I see. I generally like HyperX products, but they have no mice with multiple programmable buttons. I use their more standard gaming mouse and keyboard for a test rig, and I reviewed multiple HyperX products in the past. All were great and so far only one keyboard was broken after longer usage.

I got used to multiple programmed buttons a long time ago, and it was very handy earlier this year. I broke a finger in my left hand, and I got the news that on the broken bone was a tumor, so I had surgery, and in short for ~5 weeks at first and the next ~5 weeks after surgery, I could use mainly 2 fingers in my left hand, but I was still playing games as most stuff I had programmed in the mouse (not even macros, but mapped keyboard keys). In MMO like Black Desert, I was literally clicking W/S/A/D and nothing else. In Diablo 4 I was almost only using a mouse.

I'm used to using a mouse on my right. I tried going left-handed decades ago but growing up in a right-handed world made it a pointless endeavour. Even with the advent of ambidextrous or left-handed mice, I didn't feel the need to. Right now I just need extra macro keys on the left side of my keyboard, like on my G915.

I just found another possibility: the Redragon K618 Horus. The macro keys are just above the F1-F4 so this could work. It's a better option than the Redragon K596 Vishnu since the Horus is full size, and it's currently on sale for $78CAD. I hear their software is bad though

 

[Woomack]

I'm not using any software, I just program what I need and turn off the software. Corsair software is a mistake. It's not so good to work with and uses multiple services in the background, but once the device is programmed, then can uninstall it. Razer soft isn't so bad if you install only Synapse and nothing else, but I turn it off anyway. Most brands have bad soft that often runs multiple services in the background. I guess ASUS is the worst in general, with 5+ services. HyperX was fine.
Many cheaper brands have products from the same OEM and share the software. It's usually not the best soft, but again, once programmed, then you don't have to use it.

 

[rainless]

Currently at $86CAD, the G613 is so tempting though! Especially since building my own keyboard will be extremely expensive. Going with EPOMAKER's barebone kits, it'll be at least the same cost as my G915. Going with the EPOMAKER ready-built TKL + Numpad is a little more reasonable at about $200CAD so I'm leaning towards that option.

I found a new possibility though. Redragon has a wireless TKL with 5 macro keys: K596 Vishnu. I know they're more of a budget brand, and I've never tried their products before, but they've been around for several years and seem to be doing well. But this particular model is just $6 less than the G613. Not to mention I'd prefer a full-size since I actually use the numpad.

I know I need to do more research on DIY keyboards; I'm pretty sure I can find a full size I can custom as a southpaw. Or maybe find a better alternative to EPOMAKER. If not, I might as well go all out and get the EPOMAKER barebone kits. But for the interim, maybe I'll just get the G613 seeing as how I'm already in the ecosystem. And I can do more research and save up for a proper DIY kit.

IDK. I'm at my wits end with all of this. Preferably I'd like Logitech to fix my keyboard so I don't have to buy anything. But ultimately I'd like to get away from Logitech's ecosystem altogether. I rarely use my G533 headset anymore so don't really need it. And although I love my Logitech mouse, I think I can find an alternative easily enough. I've also read that other brands have software with less memory demands than Logitech, Corsair, Razer, and the like. That, in and of itself, is incentive enough to make a move.

Do NOT... under any circumstances... buy the G613. Not unless you're just a glutton for punishment.

My wife's GERMAN okay... She likes to drink beer and smoke and talk to her friends. Loves doing this outside. New York's Central Park, at 3am, would probably NOT be a great place to try and do this. Neither is La Plaine here in Marseille. I dutifully informed her of this. She decides to go ahead and do it anyway. SURPRISE, SURPRISE... she got her iPhone stolen.

...which was actually a best-case scenario.

Similarly... I'm sitting here TELLING YOU not to buy that thing. The hell with Logitech's "ecosystem"... Let them actually figure out how to make their stuff WORK before you ever pay money for another one of their products. Hell... Buy the damned Red Dragon simply because it's NOT Logitech. I bet you that, at minimum, the thing will WORK.

Most manufacturers generally test for THAT. Maybe this mouse doesn't feel as nice as that mouse... Maybe this keyboard doesn't have as many buttons as THAT keyboard... But, generally speaking, THEY AT LEAST WORK.


On the subject of expensive gaming mice... I had a Logitech GX16 or something like that... weighted gaming mouse (WIRED, mind you!) that developed an insane double-click problem. ABSOLUTELY LAUGHABLE given how much money I paid for the thing. In fact... it's the ONLY mouse I've ever owned that developed that problem.

At this point... Logitech is floating by on name recognition alone. There's no way such a big company, that's been around so long, should be putting out, let alone be rewarded for, such crappy products. Though, I suppose, the same could be said about KFC... Who've gotten worse and worse with each passing year (and they were bad enough while The Colonel was still alive to mock them...)

ASIDE:

Does anyone know of a bluetooth adapter that actually has wake-up capabilities? Most external bluetooth adapters sleep when the computer sleeps. But Logitech's crappy 2.4ghz wireless adapter... which does suck as mentioned... does not. So does anyone know of a bluetooth that stays awake that I can use to wakeup the computer?

That might be a nice workaround if the new adapter they send doesn't work either.

 

[chillz]

Do NOT... under any circumstances... buy the G613. Not unless you're just a glutton for punishment.

My wife's GERMAN okay... She likes to drink beer and smoke and talk to her friends. Loves doing this outside. New York's Central Park, at 3am, would probably NOT be a great place to try and do this. Neither is La Plaine here in Marseille. I dutifully informed her of this. She decides to go ahead and do it anyway. SURPRISE, SURPRISE... she got her iPhone stolen.

...which was actually a best-case scenario.

@rainless you have the best damn responses LOL!

ASIDE:

Does anyone know of a bluetooth adapter that actually has wake-up capabilities? Most external bluetooth adapters sleep when the computer sleeps. But Logitech's crappy 2.4ghz wireless adapter... which does suck as mentioned... does not. So does anyone know of a bluetooth that stays awake that I can use to wakeup the computer?

My old ioGear Bluetooth 4.0 adapter stayed live, but I no longer use it. I had a keyboard linked to it and could wake up my computer that way. I stopped using it when I built my current rig since the mobo has BT built-in.

 

[rainless]

@rainless you have the best damn responses LOL!

Thanks! You gotta do a lotttt of living to have these responses. Who else is gonna come up with the crazy German wife? They sure as hell don't have 'em down at the Home Depot... (It's actually the first place I looked. I even asked if they had a slightly used one in the back... Out of Stock.)

 

[chillz]

So I had a Zoom meeting with one of Logitech's Lead Managers on Wednesday. We did some troubleshooting but nothing panned out. Long story short, he did conclude it was an issue with the keyboard itself and not my systems. So I'm happy to say that they're sending me a new keyboard, and it's expected to arrive this Monday!

There's definitely a conflict between the G915 and Windows when it's physically plugged in. I told him that prior to the G-HUB auto-update and the new firmware update, Windows always detected and recognized my keyboard. When I went through my own troubleshooting, I did think it was a USB issue. So I did everything possible on my end to fix it -- rolling back drivers, updating BIOS, using different ports, etc. -- but nothing worked. He saw this himself as I screen-shared almost the entire time on Zoom.

Although we narrowed it down to the kb itself, he was actually baffled by it. He told me Logitech uses Generic USB drivers for all their devices so there would never be a conflict. I asked if their updates drop packets into their devices whenever there's an update available, which from my experience is pretty common with updateable electronics. He didn't answer the question directly, but he didn't dismiss it, and in a roundabout way said it may be a possibility.

He did ask if I could send them my old keyboard to them so they can get it into their labs, do a deep dive and maybe pin down the issue. I am more than happy to do so, and I'll be shipping it out once I get my new one. Hopefully they'll find a fix as I know I'm not the only one currently having this experience.

I for one am glad this whole ordeal is over, and I'm extremely happy I don't have to buy a new keyboard!

Well, maybe I should hold off celebrating until I get my new kb and plug it in. I may still run into the same issue

 

[WhitehawkEQ]

Don't buy another Logitech. I'll make fun of you mercilessly for the rest of your life and you don't wanna be that guy.

I have a brand new wireless Logitech mouse and keyboard. The table is like three feet from the desktop tower... signal is interrupted CONSTANTLY. I can't sit there and type a number into Photoshop. Can barely use the mouse. NOTHIN but blinking lights. I'll never buy another Logitech product again. I have to go back to the old mouse and keyboard that this one was supposed to be replacing!

Fool me once... shame on you... Don't let them fool you again. That would just be stupid.

Don't blame Logitech, I would check for any thing making a lot of RF noise in your area that could interfere with your KB and Mouse. I have a M570 wireless trackball that I use about 10+ feet away from the receiver with no problems.

 

[chillz]

I'm just happy they replaced my kb out of warranty Here's a few pics when I unboxed it. There were a couple of differences with packaging. And the new dongle is smaller oddly enough.

 

[WhitehawkEQ]

Congrats on getting a replacement, I use the G110 KB no problems so far.