Is AMD a sinking ship?

[Kuroimaho]

I do not think K10 is so bad that you have to compare it to duals neither do I believe they made it to compete with duals, but prices will tell, I won't mind if you are right and they sell it for C2D price sub 200.

 

[knightwolf6543]

by all means k10 is not bad it all, plus in those scores their comparing a test sample, which would be considered a mainstream product up against two enthusiast products. k10 will rock no doubt about that. amd just has some bugs to work out which when done will be in another stepping. as for c2d i'm just saying back when it was first out thats what i was told it was aimed at c2d.

 

[frankkesel]

Hi guys

To me (an intel fan) AMD is a good thing , it help competition and good price

we dont want one monopolistic big cpu compagny dont we ????

EDIT: I dont think Amd is sinking , it just need some times, they put a lot of ressource in the ATI merging/fusion, dont forget 2 years ago when the first dual core went out , AMD has the lead for a little while ....

 

[th3]

What AMD need is for their fanboys to stop talking and start buying.

Sinking ship, no way. x86 is the biggest CPU market, and AMD is the second biggest player in that market, $9bn companies like that dont just disappear after a few bad quarters.

 

[frankkesel]

What AMD need is for their fanboys to stop talking and start buying.

Sinking ship, no way. x86 is the biggest CPU market, and AMD is the second biggest player in that market, $9bn companies like that dont just disappear after a few bad quarters.

Everything you said is true , but isnt there just two major public cpu ? lol

2 of 2 lol mean last hehe , just kidding

 

[rogue3092]

Phenom is a dud, and AMD fanboys won't admit it. It's just not competitive enough to compete with the Kentsfield, much less the Yorkfield. Therefore, AMD can't compete with Intel on price, and will only make a few bucks per chip, if that, if they want to really sell any. I think they should just wait for a 45nm die-shrink of Phenom, where they might be able to compete clock-for-clock and will certainly be able to add more cache.

Anyway, AMD is by no means a sinking ship, as their server proc sales are still going fairly well. I had an X2 4400+, went to a C2D E6600, going to a C2Q Kentsfield in a few months. 12mb cache/overclocking to 3.6+ easily = the win.

 

[FlahsMemory]

Well the sad thing is that AMD can only compete with intels low end quads. The good thing is that intel is upping the cost on its line of product which means that AMD has a higher price margin to deal its goods in. We are talking an initial price of around 400 for the q9450 because people dont realize that the 300+ dollars are for 1000 units.Closes thing to a q6600 is going to be the 6mb version of penryn in price and even that is going to be around 300+

 

[AlabamaCajun]

What if all the intel fanboys bought an AMD system next month instead of Penryn. This would boost AMDs revenue enough to get all their duckies in a row and finance the new 45nm K10.5s. This would force Intel to run production and lower prices on the upcoming Nehas. Then when Neha comes out, give you AMD system to your sister and buy a new Neha. We AMD fanboys would have what we want and you intel fanboys would have what you want.

 

[hUMANbEATbOX]

AMD is not in the hole, they are doing just what they wanted to do. they be booming in the server market, one of the many deals they bad was a sale of 25,000 barc cpus, even if they sold for $100 each
thats $2.5 million. then again you also got to think of profit so they probable sold for more then $100.

AMD IS in the hole, it is indisputable. Look at their debt. Look at their losses (they lost $226million in Q3 2007 alone). $2.5million is a drop in the bucket (and I can promise that they did not make $2.5m in profit on those 25k barcs, they maybe made a profit of $20-30 per CPU)

of course AMD is still having problems with manufacturing at 65NM, which actually is a good thing. cause once they get those fixed, phenom will bench better and o/c better.

This is absurd. If they weren't having problems with 65nm, they could have been making and selling 3.6ghz K8's for the last year. They would have been a profitable company instead of bleeding money.

as for those avatars that say core 2 duo owned they are true, source

I would hardly call that "owning" a C2D. The reason it (barely) wins in 3DM06 is because it has 2 extra cores (and it only beats the dual core E6850 by 842pts). Take a look at the Cinebench results, and see that on a core per core basis, it looses to K8 let alone C2D.

And lets not get into how they heavily overclocked those X4's and left the C2D at stock (for the sake of a 'clock per clock' comparison). Overclock that E6850 a good 800-1000mhz and you'll see some ownage.

Most real world users don't even know that Dual Core exists let alone quads. Talking about the Joe Sixpacks out there. To say that X4 owns C2D based on a few tests that highlight quad cores is a flawed comparison. For most people who don't need a Quad (read: 99% of computer users), even a 6400+ will beat any of the X4's coming out in the next 6 months.

Sticking your head in the sand and pretending that all of AMD's problems don't exist (or pretending they are actually benefits) does nothing for AMD. It does not help them. What can help them is a truly competitive product, nothing else.

 

[David]

Polite Reminder: I'm watching this thread. All is good so far.

 

[Vio1]

amd's biggest problem is delivery. They say one thing about a certain delivery date, and then they cant provide. a lot of washy unconfirmed information. They need to be able to deliver and compete with the competition if they want to be a profitable business.

 

[FlahsMemory]

AMD is getting hit in the OEM market and that is why they are going for quantity and not quality. Once AMD takes care of most of the official sales in the server and OEM market they can pause and start fine tuning its production process to cater to higher clocks. They may have a cheaper alternative Fasn8 vs. intels skulltrail that may pull buyers on their side. Intel is aiming for 3000 per pair on processors alone. AMD may offer a pair of cpu and 2-4 graphics cards for that much. Who knows? It is going to get shaky for highend buyers soon.

 

[th3]

For most people who don't need a Quad (read: 99% of computer users)

It has never been about what people need, its about what Intel/AMD/ATI/Nvidia want them to need.

What can help them is a truly competitive product, nothing else.

And Phenom is that competitive product, in the midrange segment. 2.4GHz X4 vs Q6600, those 99% you mentioned earlier dont overclock anyway.

Are the new prices on the Extreme Edition Yorkfields confirmed now? Going from $1000 to around €1000 because AMD cant compete on high end, thats what would happen also in the midrange segment without Phenom.

 

[>HyperlogiK<]

It has never been about what people need, its about what Intel/AMD/ATI/Nvidia want them to need.

And Phenom is that competitive product, in the midrange segment. 2.4GHz X4 vs Q6600, those 99% you mentioned earlier dont overclock anyway.

Are the new prices on the Extreme Edition Yorkfields confirmed now? Going from $1000 to around €1000 because AMD cant compete on high end, thats what would happen also in the midrange segment without Phenom.

I agree for the most part. But there are two different ways in which you can read 'competitive product', competitive for the mid to high end consumer, sure, but competitive with Penryn as a revenue raiser for the manufacturer, maybe not.

 

[hUMANbEATbOX]

It has never been about what people need, its about what Intel/AMD/ATI/Nvidia want them to need.

I think you are being shortsighted. Look at your mother/father/aunt/sister/brother/coworkers/boss/etc/etc. 99% of the computer users out there wouldn't even be able to tell you what or who ATI/NV are. They are happily oblivious, all they want to do is check their email/facebook/fav site/etc/etc. It IS about what people need. Not everyone buys a new PC every year, most hold on to them for 3-4 years, more if they can, only replacing it when the absolutely have to. My mother is still on a 2400+ at stock speeds, because it is what she needs. Those types of people FAR outweigh us, the enthusiasts.

And Phenom is that competitive product, in the midrange segment. 2.4GHz X4 vs Q6600, those 99% you mentioned earlier dont overclock anyway.

Exactly, they don't overclock anyways, so they won't be seeing a 3ghz X4 for at least a year IMO. The fastest speed AMD will ship this year is 2.4ghz, and that cannot be considered a 'midrange' part, when it is the top part AMD will offer, and will likely be priced accordingly (meaning, more than the $150-200 that the typical person will spend on a CPU, even in a prebuilt machine, more like $350+). I can't bring myself to classify any quad core, be it from AMD or Intel as 'midrange', considering either will be overkill for the majority.

Are the new prices on the Extreme Edition Yorkfields confirmed now? Going from $1000 to around €1000 because AMD cant compete on high end, thats what would happen also in the midrange segment without Phenom.

AMD hasn't been able to compete on the midrange segment for over a year now. Have we seen q6600's and e6750's going for $500? No. Will we? No. Because I'm sure Intel knows that if they boost the prices on all midrange and lowend CPU's, they won't sell as many as they are now, even with AMD as competition. People would just sit on their current CPU or get a VIA.

 

[knightwolf6543]

I think you are being shortsighted. Look at your mother/father/aunt/sister/brother/coworkers/boss/etc/etc. 99% of the computer users out there wouldn't even be able to tell you what or who ATI/NV are. They are happily oblivious, all they want to do is check their email/facebook/fav site/etc/etc. It IS about what people need. Not everyone buys a new PC every year, most hold on to them for 3-4 years, more if they can, only replacing it when the absolutely have to. My mother is still on a 2400+ at stock speeds, because it is what she needs. Those types of people FAR outweigh us, the enthusiasts.


Exactly, they don't overclock anyways, so they won't be seeing a 3ghz X4 for at least a year IMO. The fastest speed AMD will ship this year is 2.4ghz, and that cannot be considered a 'midrange' part, when it is the top part AMD will offer, and will likely be priced accordingly (meaning, more than the $150-200 that the typical person will spend on a CPU, even in a prebuilt machine, more like $350+). I can't bring myself to classify any quad core, be it from AMD or Intel as 'midrange', considering either will be overkill for the majority.


AMD hasn't been able to compete on the midrange segment for over a year now. Have we seen q6600's and e6750's going for $500? No. Will we? No. Because I'm sure Intel knows that if they boost the prices on all midrange and lowend CPU's, they won't sell as many as they are now, even with AMD as competition. People would just sit on their current CPU or get a VIA.

actually most people in my family are into computers, so they know what i am talking about

we will see 3.0Ghz x4 in less then a year ( 2007 is almost over), in a year we should see 45nm and shanghai

 

[hUMANbEATbOX]

actually most people in my family are into computers, so they know what i am talking about

we will see 3.0Ghz x4 in less then a year ( 2007 is almost over), in a year we should see 45nm and shanghai

Your family is an exception.

About the second statement, we shall see. I hope for AMD and our sake that comes true, but AMD does not have a good track record when it comes to realizing their road maps on time.

 

[knightwolf6543]

Your family is an exception.

About the second statement, we shall see. I hope for AMD and our sake that comes true, but AMD does not have a good track record when it comes to realizing their road maps on time.

You can blame hector ruiz for AMD's problems, which rumor has it he will be leaving!

 

[>HyperlogiK<]

But the legacy of the past 5 years of serious mismanagement is going to haunt AMD for a long time.

They have to make fusion, bobcat, bulldozer, and the associated 45nm lithography work (things which will cost a great deal of money) and work well enough to compete with current and upcoming intel products that are more dangerous than any of the old netburst parts. While doing all of this they have to be making enough money to pull themselves out of a huge financial hole in which they have ended up.

Hopefully they will find a new Jerry Sanders-alike who can manage all of this.

 

[knightwolf6543]

either that or hector starts working for the amount of money he is earning.