Looking for a motherboard upgrade

[Runscream]

Right now I have a Gigabyte Z370P D3, which, as you may know, is one of the most basic Z370 boards. Considering this and that I have just a Cryorig H7 cooling my delidded i5-8600k, I'm actually happy to be able to reach a 4.8 Ghz overclock. This is not 100% stable, one core failed the prime95 test after about 40 minutes, but at least it doesn't crash, even when rendering video or playing games like AC Odyssey, which get all cores up to 100% at times. However, something happened to my motherboard when putting back the CPU after delidding it, and now the first PCIe slot won't work, so I have to put my GTX 1080 on the second slot, which is only runs at x4, which not only gimps the gpu, but also makes it run hotter, since the card is very close to the PSU shroud and gets worse airflow than before. The CPU was tested on a different PC with a video card on the first PCIe slot and it worked perfectly fine, so I guess it's safe to assume that it's my board that's failing. I thought that since I'll change it because of the PCIe slot, I might as well go for a motherboard that's also better suited for overclocking so I can finally achieve a 5 Ghz overclock. Of course I'll also upgrade the cooler to something like a Noctua D14 if needed.

So, after doing some research, these are my main options within my budget:
-Asus Prime Z370-A
-Asrock Z370 Extreme4
-Aorus Z370 Ultra Gaming
-Aorus Z370 Gaming 3 (can't find the 5 one where I live :/)
-Asus TUF Z370 Plus Gaming
-MSI Z370 Tomahawk

I was also wondering if I should consider a cheap Z390 board, like the MSI Z390-A PRO, but I don't know if it being Z390 means it has better overclocking capability.
I don't know much about VRMs and power phases, and I don't know where to look up that info, since it's obviously not mentioned in the manufacturers websites, so I come to you hoping you can help me choose a new motherboard.
Thank you for your time!

 

[DaveB]

Right now I have a Gigabyte Z370P D3, which, as you may know, is one of the most basic Z370 boards. Considering this and that I have just a Cryorig H7 cooling my delidded i5-8600k, I'm actually happy to be able to reach a 4.8 Ghz overclock. This is not 100% stable, one core failed the prime95 test after about 40 minutes, but at least it doesn't crash, even when rendering video or playing games like AC Odyssey, which get all cores up to 100% at times. However, something happened to my motherboard when putting back the CPU after delidding it, and now the first PCIe slot won't work, so I have to put my GTX 1080 on the second slot, which is only runs at x4, which not only gimps the gpu, but also makes it run hotter, since the card is very close to the PSU shroud and gets worse airflow than before. The CPU was tested on a different PC with a video card on the first PCIe slot and it worked perfectly fine, so I guess it's safe to assume that it's my board that's failing. I thought that since I'll change it because of the PCIe slot, I might as well go for a motherboard that's also better suited for overclocking so I can finally achieve a 5 Ghz overclock. Of course I'll also upgrade the cooler to something like a Noctua D14 if needed.

So, after doing some research, these are my main options within my budget:
-Asus Prime Z370-A
-Asrock Z370 Extreme4
-Aorus Z370 Ultra Gaming
-Aorus Z370 Gaming 3 (can't find the 5 one where I live :/)
-Asus TUF Z370 Plus Gaming
-MSI Z370 Tomahawk

I was also wondering if I should consider a cheap Z390 board, like the MSI Z390-A PRO, but I don't know if it being Z390 means it has better overclocking capability.
I don't know much about VRMs and power phases, and I don't know where to look up that info, since it's obviously not mentioned in the manufacturers websites, so I come to you hoping you can help me choose a new motherboard.
Thank you for your time!

Sorry for your troubles. I had two of those Z370P D3s which had no trouble getting i5-8600Ks and i7-8700Ks past 5 GHz. But since your PCIe x16 slot is gone, why not RMA it? Gigabyte provides a 3-year warranty on motherboards so it's definitely covered. If you decide to get a new motherboard, IMO it's always better to upgrade to the latest chipset for a few dollars more. So I'd look at inexpensive Z390 motherboards such as the MSI Z390-A Pro you mentioned or the ASRock Z390 Pro4. The VRM section of the ASRock looks more robust, ASRock claims "10 phase" but they're known to be creative with these terms.

 

[Runscream]

Sorry for your troubles. I had two of those Z370P D3s which had no trouble getting i5-8600Ks and i7-8700Ks past 5 GHz. But since your PCIe x16 slot is gone, why not RMA it? Gigabyte provides a 3-year warranty on motherboards so it's definitely covered. If you decide to get a new motherboard, IMO it's always better to upgrade to the latest chipset for a few dollars more. So I'd look at inexpensive Z390 motherboards such as the MSI Z390-A Pro you mentioned or the ASRock Z390 Pro4. The VRM section of the ASRock looks more robust, ASRock claims "10 phase" but they're known to be creative with these terms.

Hi, thanks for your answer. I live in south america, but got my board through Amazon US (a friend who was over there brought it to me), and my local Gigabyte website says they will only offer warranty service to products obtained through local authorized sellers :/ However, may I ask what voltage, LLC and cooling solution did you use on your i5-8600Ks to get them to 5 GHz?

I couldn't find the ASrock Z390 Pro4 in my local retailer's website, but other than the MSI Z390-A Pro, these are my options:

-GIGABYTE Z390 UD
-ASUS PRIME Z390-P
-MSI MAG Z390 Tomahawk
-GIGABYTE Z390 GAMING X

I'm guessing that the two latter options might be the better choices because of their higher prices, but I included the first two since they're about the same price as the MSI Z390-A Pro.

 

[kracht pip]

After a delid you may need to loosen the screws for the socket hold down about a half a turn or you can get issues. just another thing to try.

I dont know what mobo to recommend in that price range

if you can get a asrock Taichi thats what i'd recommend. these cheap boards these days really seem to suck

 

[maxfly]

being that i spent roughly 2 months looking for a solid z390 mb ill try to help you some.

"I'm guessing that the two latter options might be the better choices because of their higher prices, but I included the first two since they're about the same price as the MSI Z390-A Pro."

-GIGABYTE Z390 UD- same 10+2 vrm as gaming x. reviews well. worth considering.
-ASUS PRIME Z390-P -meh, one of asus lowest end boards. i dismissed it automatically when i was researching z390 mbs because they make no mention of vrms or vrm cooling. i found that really aggravating during my search.
-MSI MAG Z390 Tomahawk- reviews really poorly when heavily oced. poor vrm cooling. kick it to the curb.
-GIGABYTE Z390 GAMING X- entry level mb according to gigabytes line up. but still has 10+2 vrm so it should oc well.

personally i would go with the asrock z390 extreme 4 if you can find one. it reviews really well has solid vrm cooling and isnt crazy expensive. its the best price to performance mb i could find. then the mb in my sig fell into my lap and boom, z390 mbs were an after thought lol.
my advice is read as many reviews as possible before pulling the trigger on your next mb. once youve read a few you can skip thru to the relevant parts pretty quickly. hope that helps!

 

[wingman99]

When you delided the processor it is possible that damaged the PCI-E on the chip. Check the socket for bent pins and check for burnt or missing pads on the processor. My Cheap Gigabyte motherboard doing 5.0GHz.

 

[caddi daddi]

I use the asrock, z370 extreme 4, awesome sauce in an atx board.
I also have an asus rog strix z370-I gaming, awesome sauce in an ITX board and it's as cute as a tiny button to boot!!!!

 

[Runscream]

After a delid you may need to loosen the screws for the socket hold down about a half a turn or you can get issues. just another thing to try.

I dont know what mobo to recommend in that price range

if you can get a asrock Taichi thats what i'd recommend. these cheap boards these days really seem to suck

Thanks! I'll try that and see if it fixes the issue.

being that i spent roughly 2 months looking for a solid z390 mb ill try to help you some.

"I'm guessing that the two latter options might be the better choices because of their higher prices, but I included the first two since they're about the same price as the MSI Z390-A Pro."

-GIGABYTE Z390 UD- same 10+2 vrm as gaming x. reviews well. worth considering.
-ASUS PRIME Z390-P -meh, one of asus lowest end boards. i dismissed it automatically when i was researching z390 mbs because they make no mention of vrms or vrm cooling. i found that really aggravating during my search.
-MSI MAG Z390 Tomahawk- reviews really poorly when heavily oced. poor vrm cooling. kick it to the curb.
-GIGABYTE Z390 GAMING X- entry level mb according to gigabytes line up. but still has 10+2 vrm so it should oc well.

personally i would go with the asrock z390 extreme 4 if you can find one. it reviews really well has solid vrm cooling and isnt crazy expensive. its the best price to performance mb i could find. then the mb in my sig fell into my lap and boom, z390 mbs were an after thought lol.
my advice is read as many reviews as possible before pulling the trigger on your next mb. once youve read a few you can skip thru to the relevant parts pretty quickly. hope that helps!

Thanks for the suggestion. Maybe my friend will go to the US in february, so I can ask him to bring the asrock z390 extreme4, since it's not available in my country (and even if it was, they'd probably charge like $40 extra). If I can't get that one, I guess I'll just go with the Gigabyte z390 UD. By the way, what review websites would you recommend? I only trust in guru3d, but they don't always review the boards I consider to buy.

When you delided the processor it is possible that damaged the PCI-E on the chip. Check the socket for bent pins and check for burnt or missing pads on the processor. My Cheap Gigabyte motherboard doing 5.0GHz.

I checked the socket with a magnifying glass+flashlight thing and found no bent pins. I also checked the CPU pads and all seemed ok. My guess is *something* (thermal paste, alcohol or even sweat) shorted the board and my PCIe slot sacrificed itself for the rest of the motherboard haha. By the way, could you tell me what voltage and LLC are you using to get 5 GHz? I know not every CPU is the same, I just find it weird that even at 1.39v my 4.8 GHz aren't 100% stable. I believe I'm not using LLC correctly, but if I put it on high or turbo, my temps just go through the roof.

I use the asrock, z370 extreme 4, awesome sauce in an atx board.
I also have an asus rog strix z370-I gaming, awesome sauce in an ITX board and it's as cute as a tiny button to boot!!!!

Yeah, I'm seriously considering the asrock extreme4, either the z370 or the z390. Hopefully I can get it. Thanks for the suggestions

 

[wingman99]

I checked the socket with a magnifying glass+flashlight thing and found no bent pins. I also checked the CPU pads and all seemed ok. My guess is *something* (thermal paste, alcohol or even sweat) shorted the board and my PCIe slot sacrificed itself for the rest of the motherboard haha. By the way, could you tell me what voltage and LLC are you using to get 5 GHz? I know not every CPU is the same, I just find it weird that even at 1.39v my 4.8 GHz aren't 100% stable. I believe I'm not using LLC correctly, but if I put it on high or turbo, my temps just go through the roof.

I'm using LLC on AUTO. My settings for 5.0GHz are LLC AUTO, DVID +0.080 = 1.260v to 1.332v. Prime95 without AVX.

 

[caddi daddi]

you might try running the board through the dish washer, stripped, on the top rack, right side up, let it dry in the sun for 24-48 hours, this has saved more than one board for me.

 

[maxfly]

websites that i trust for solid reviews are overclockers.com (of course lol), anandtech, hardforum, techspot, kitguru, techradar, tomshardware, thats all i can think of. i know im forgetting some. try not to rely on just one review when your researching.

 

[Runscream]

I decided I'll most likely go for a Gigabyte Z390 UD and spend the extra cash on a Noctua D15 Thanks everyone!

 

[larryccf]

i'm going to throw in my two cents - for some reason a number of the board mfgrs seem to have lost the plot on the Z390 chipset. I've had two Asrock motherboards that were solid as a rock and stable, i went with the Asrock Taichi Z390, and after assembling the computer, installing windows, i went to their web & downloaded their then latest BIOS - P1.51. I installed it using the flash drive or USB drive method. It instantly, on reboot made it to POST and then for a couple of seconds it showed the white circling dots, then it rebooted - the 2nd time it never made it to the white circling dots, just showing the POST screen for a few seconds and again it rebooted and this time no display to the monitor. When i connected a GPU from another computer, i got the display - it was also showing, iirc Dr Debug code, either 55 or 65 - but after talking to Asrock tech support we determined something had gone out on the CPU on the video side, whether code wise or physical circuit wise i don't know. But that BIOS had fried something on the motherboard and the CPU. I went to the Asrock forum, kind of a slow forum post wise, but there were folks there complaining about issues with that same BIOS release. I posted on another forum (Tom's) and right away someone popped in, they'd had the same experience ie frying their board and CPU. A few other posters popped in that they were having issues and had been able to go back to the original BIOS, P1.30, and others popped in that they were having issues with the 3rd Bios, P1.80

But what happened next is kind of telling - I should have RMA'd my board, but wasn't familiar with that, instead sent it back to Asrock for warranty support. They show having received it Nov 10th - and i haven't heard a word since, including any response to 3 emails asking for a status report. I suspect they're flooded with returned boards - that's just my guess, but my experience with them in the past was always stellar - super responsive.

OKAY, so while i waited, i ended up going with the Gigabyte Aorus Master Z390 - worked fine for about 3 - 4 days, then i noticed BIOS settings were spontaneously changing - then after correction back to original settings, they'd re-set themselves to their new self desired setting. Then it got even worse - BIOs would not even accept changes to settings, even to loading "default" settings. Okay - RMA'd that board, next board repeated the same exact experience - Newegg was source on both boards so i assume those two boards were from the same batch of boards with bad BIOS chips. Then over on Tom's i started seeing a number of Gigabyte Z390 board posts, not just about the Aorus Master, with similiar BIOS complaints.

I asked a friend, who is a fairly accomplished world class overclocker (placed 12xx out of 53,000 in last year's or the year before competition), he's also retired AMD and ASUS engineer - he recommeded the MSI MEG Z390 ACE - and as you see in my sig, this board has been so rock solid stable, you;ll have to pry it out of my "cold dead hands" (in the words of Charleton Heston).

The only 2 boards i saw zero complaints about on TOm's were the MSI and the Asus Z390 boards. AGain, i'm not attacking the other boards for all their chipsets - it just seems they've dropped the plot on the Z390 chipset

fwiw

 

[DaveB]

That's really odd. The only Z370 boards I used were the cheapest Gigabyte ATX models at my local Microcenter and both of them were rock stable and reliable. It just doesn't seem that the Z390 motherboard design should be significantly different enough to cause issues vs. the Z370? Especially with something as simple as maintaining a BIOS setting.

 

[larryccf]

well, again, the gig boards were both from Newegg and within a couple of weeks of each other so they could have been from the same batch, and i don't know the BIOS was bad but the BIOS chips were weak so their issues could have been isolated to what lot or batch they came from. I noticed sellers are starting to offer BIOS chips on ebay, and i actually bought one for a Z97 board i've got (4 yrs old) that the BIOS kept corrupting - it seemed to have cured my issues, and for $12 was a cheap fix. The other posters on Tom's could have been bad chips as well or the BIOS - i can't really state

The Asrock board, that was definitely the BIOS, and the curious part to me, they pull the bad BIOS (P1.51) off their web altogether so they must have learned it was a total disaster - you'd think they'd double verify the replacement BIOS - but issues were still showing up in that BIOS and the one that replaced it.

The one thing that taught me was to research any BIOS release before i install it, and especially not a week after it's released

 

[maxfly]

my motto has always been if it aint broke...break it!!! i kid, i seriously try not to update a new mb unless im having issues with something. or theres an update to something i need. ive only had one bios go bad on me over the years but that was plenty. fortunately there were two other bios roms to choose from.
that asrock issue sounds pretty heavy man. killin the cpu AND mobo? thats some serious money asrock is having to replace over a botched bios.

 

[larryccf]

yeah, i had the same philosophy re updating BIOSs, then stupidity took over, that and the promise of "microcode update, improved power distribution and improved sex life" .... it was that last one that got my attention

re the CPU, actually Overclockers UK was who i bought the cpu from, and even though i told, iirc, John in tech support about the Taichi board and how it progressed thru 3 reboots, each one worse than the previous one - he was the one that had me bring my GPU over to the system with the 9900k, and bingo, display showed up - that's when he indicated the BIOS had done something to the video side of my cpu, and he issued the RMA. THey were pretty good about it. I think they chg'd me 20 British pounds for the restocking or some such, but i had no complaints. I suspect Intel replaces it to them or credits them.

 

[maxfly]

haha, i hear ya. ive been suckered into bios updates that i had no need of. now i read as much info as is available before i pull the trigger. they just make them sound sooo gooood!

probably just replace it out right, intel returns/swaps are top notch. ive had really good luck getting cpus replaced. they dont care how it happened. they just want to verify that its not working correctly so they can shoot you the replacement asap. being that their resellers im sure its even easier.

 

[prime81]

Don't look past the ASUS Maximus Hero X and Maximus Hero XI boards. I've always, always had good luck with reliability and overclocking on ASUS boards.

 

[Runscream]

Don't look past the ASUS Maximus Hero X and Maximus Hero XI boards. I've always, always had good luck with reliability and overclocking on ASUS boards.

Thanks for the suggestion, but those boards, as well as the MSI MEG Z390 ACE, are way out of my budget.