"Macs Are Better" Mentalities

[cursor]

I love macs--I grew up with an Apple ][+, and it was great. However they aren't worth the $$. People who can't use computers love macs. They've made great headway into the retail market, though. I just heard they had something like 14% market share last quarter. I remember some years ago (before the original CRT iMac) they had something like 3-4% market share and were in real trouble.

The BIG problem with Apple is that they are well known for EOL'ing hardware really fast. I bought an Apple //gs about 6 months before Apple abandoned the platform in favor of Mac. They did the same thing when they went to PowerPC chips, and again when they left PowerPC chips. That [insert expletive in gerund form here] [insert expletive for unination here] me off and I'm very shy to buy any more overpriced hardware from them again.

To quality, they do have much better hardware than your standard $300 desktop or $499 laptop. Duh. They charge twice as much for it--that money goes somewhere. If you buy an equivalently priced PC that you either make yourself or you get from a non-crappy vendor, then you'll get hardware that's as good or better.

A lot of their value proposition goes into the free software that comes with the Mac. I don't need any of that crap though.

 

[freakdiablo]

Well you may all hate me but yes I am a mac fanboy. I love macs. I think they are awesome machines. They also put food on my table. I am a mac consultant/repair guy.

I would LOVE to introduce you to a few people I know (the kind that are convinced Steve Jobs is the Jesus of the 21st century and that Macs never break. After all as a mac repair tech, you would know they do.)) But yeah, like I respect macs as hardware. A $1000 mac and a $500 dell laptop may have similar specs, but I wouldn't call you a liar if you said the mac would last 3 to 4 times as long. With the new MBA and its Ipod hdd may be a different story (I give the average life expectancy of that drive about 2-2 1/2 years.)

 

[Mr.Guvernment]

okay so hardware is the same

take someone who has been using OS for life - anything they do is probably faster if they use OS vs Windows if you gave thema windows box.

take soeone who has been using windows for life, anything they do is probably faster if they use windows vs OS if you gave them a mac.

So now the argument isnt even hardware or software, it is what is the person used to

when i got my macbook i got annoyed cause it seemed to take me forever to figure anything out, and i was trying to use windows shortcuts on OSX.

Obviously someone who has been using one OS over the other for most of their computer life, will be more efficient on said OS, vs one they rarely or have never used....


Mac's arent as overpriced as they used to be, they are often the same price as a dell, sony or other OEM's, their macbook line is their best price range, but what apples gets screwed one, since they only come out with new versions of systems once or twice a year, they seldom update their prices to reflect that of current market prices like dell or other OEM's, so depending when you buy an Apple computer, the price argument is out the window.

 

[acompdude]

I would LOVE to introduce you to a few people I know (the kind that are convinced Steve Jobs is the Jesus of the 21st century and that Macs never break. After all as a mac repair tech, you would know they do.)) But yeah, like I respect macs as hardware. A $1000 mac and a $500 dell laptop may have similar specs, but I wouldn't call you a liar if you said the mac would last 3 to 4 times as long. With the new MBA and its Ipod hdd may be a different story (I give the average life expectancy of that drive about 2-2 1/2 years.)

Thanks dude. Glad my posts made a little sense. And yes macs do break. And it is not just hardware either. There are a lot of software issues too. OSX is by far not perfect but no os is for that matter. The new version of mail has a ton of issues. Most have been worked out but a few still exist. But yea if you need me to explain to someone that macs do break then just let me know. I can give them all the info they need. If they didnt break then there would be no need for me to be around doing what I am and making pretty good money at it. I will say that there is more money in what I am doing than in the PC equivalent at least currently in my area. There arent many people doing it so the company I am with can charge basically what they want. Take your mac to a geeksquad and see what happens. Lol.

BTW. I am somewhat getting out of the "pc" market but I am getting ready to build me a nice shuttle with a quad core and yes windows xp(still not crazy about vista). So even though I love macs and all I still love a good windows/linux box. More mac users need to realize that Steve Jobs is not a god and get a life. Another one of my clients just popped in my head. I was in his office fixing a small issue with parallels and someone came by(Windows user) and were picking on him for his mac breaking and he got all defensive. I laughed so hard inside. I just told the Windows guy that its not a perfect machine. Nothing is perfect. My client looked at me like I was crazy...

 

[FudgeNuggets]

I've used PCs since the days of DOS only....
I tried a MAC the fist time when OS9 was their OS and hated it.
I bought a MAC 2 years ago with OSX and will never switch back to Linux or Windows based PC.
To each their own.....

 

[Mr.Guvernment]

^^^ OS9 ws bad, bad memory management, OSX + was a big improvement for OSX, OS9 and below was, well, just not great............

 

[acompdude]

^^^ OS9 ws bad, bad memory management, OSX + was a big improvement for OSX, OS9 and below was, well, just not great............

I highly agree with that. It is so hard to support OS9 simply for the fact of how crappy it was. If anyone calls us with an OS9 computer we either put OSX if it will run it or tell them to buy a new mac with OSX. OSX has so many improvements its amazing.

 

[Captain Newbie]

I highly agree with that. It is so hard to support OS9 simply for the fact of how crappy it was. If anyone calls us with an OS9 computer we either put OSX if it will run it or tell them to buy a new mac with OSX. OSX has so many improvements its amazing.

It's not an improvement. It's an entirely new operating system. Vista is an "improvement", as have all versions of Windows since the beginning been.

 

[benbaked]

^^^ OS9 ws bad, bad memory management, OSX + was a big improvement for OSX, OS9 and below was, well, just not great............

OS9 was much worse then bad. I consider it the Windows 3.1 of Mac operating systems as far as stability goes...it was THAT bad. It would hard lock if you sneezed, in fact I think Windows 3.1 and 9x might have even been more stable just because they were nowhere near as bloated as the heart-attack-prone OS9. Mac fanatics always gave Windows people crap about DLL hell and BSODs...yet they failed to mention the extensions/cdev hell and "mac bomb" screens that plagued the classic OS (particularly OS8 and 9).

 

[Captain Slug]

Yeah, I used to have fun taking overzealous mac fans into the computer lab at the nearby community college and pressing the "Scan Now" button on any of the scanners hooked up to the G3s which 9 times out of 10 resulted in an instant mac bomb or a hard reset. Despite the factory drivers for the scanners being installed.
Plugging in most USB drives produced the same result.

Apple products for quite a long time were also TERRIBLE in terms of ergonomics. I still think their factory standard keyboards and mice are pretty bad, but they're not quite as bad as they used to be. A good number of their design choices just don't seem to make any sense to me.

I'll use whatever DOES what I want it to DO, when I want it to. I don't particularly care what an operating system looks like, so long as the appearance does not hinder productivity (like all those useless animations and effects do). I'm a pretty organized and orderly person so I've never had any of the issues many other users have had with the interfaces of one operating system versus the other. I really don't enjoy having to tweak my operating system so often, so what I end up using is what's most reliable and compatible.

Since most of what I do tends to revolve around CAD it's not likely that I will be using anything except Windows XP for quite some time. I've used Linux for some things and OSX is great for quickly setting up a secure file server, but my usage needs have kind of dictated what it is I'm primarily using.

 

[1cem4n]

this is going to turn into a flame war guys. i suggest this thread be locked.

 

[Hardin]

It seems to be civil so far.

 

[Ebola]

Now that macs run Intel procs there really is no difference. It's just a design thing now.

 

[Mr.Guvernment]

this is going to turn into a flame war guys. i suggest this thread be locked.

Why even mention something like that? why not let it go, it was going fine until this comment, which is what was un-needed and would start a flame war....

 

[Mr.Guvernment]

Now that macs run Intel procs there really is no difference. It's just a design thing now.

As i say the only reason to buy a MAC is the OS, period, OS and some possible software one may prefer on OSX vs Windows/*nix

 

[cw823]

As i say the only reason to buy a MAC is the OS, period, OS and some possible software one may prefer on OSX vs Windows/*nix

Have you guys even considered design? The new laptop aside, those Mac Pro cases are sweet. The monitors are higher quality. IMO the LCDs are higher quality (including laptops).

Now I won't say it's worth the premium, but if I thought I could afford it, I'd be all Mac. If you think Windows is better than OSX, you're either biased, or you've never worked with OSX.

No more clicking Start, to Shut Down. No add/remove....you want something uninstalled? Drag it to trash.

If you haven't extensively used a mac, you really have no place in this discussion.

 

[twEEkerAreUs]

Have you guys even considered design? The new laptop aside, those Mac Pro cases are sweet. The monitors are higher quality. IMO the LCDs are higher quality (including laptops).

Now I won't say it's worth the premium, but if I thought I could afford it, I'd be all Mac. If you think Windows is better than OSX, you're either biased, or you've never worked with OSX.

No more clicking Start, to Shut Down. No add/remove....you want something uninstalled? Drag it to trash.

If you haven't extensively used a mac, you really have no place in this discussion.

How about this, I work some how related to said place and I pretty much won't buy any of the products.

Also for the clueless that believe Mac's never break or Leopard has zero bugs/issues, ummm yeah I guess those imaginary techs I see every day working every single min (No free time) are all in my mind.

Seriously, the stuff is a little over priced (Way over priced on Mac Pro's) but if you have the money to spend they work and work well for the average/above user. You do get a lot of people though buying into it as a fad or like others mentioned "It looks pretty!"

As much as I've tried to like Leopard, I still don't think very much of it. FYI I dislike Vista and WinXP is well....It works most of the time.

 

[Captain Slug]

No more clicking Start, to Shut Down.

Huh? ACPI compliance since the mid 1996 defines that you can trigger the shut down sequence by simply pressing the case power button once.
Holding the power button down on the other hand triggers a hard shutdown.

The above holds true for all PC hardware since Socket 370 and most operating systems since 1999.

 

[Cheator]

Have you guys even considered design? The new laptop aside, those Mac Pro cases are sweet. The monitors are higher quality. IMO the LCDs are higher quality (including laptops).

Now I won't say it's worth the premium, but if I thought I could afford it, I'd be all Mac. If you think Windows is better than OSX, you're either biased, or you've never worked with OSX.

No more clicking Start, to Shut Down. No add/remove....you want something uninstalled? Drag it to trash.

If you haven't extensively used a mac, you really have no place in this discussion.

I'm not biased. I use osx constantly. I have a mac of my own and my brother's mac. I also use linux and windows in my everyday life, and I can tell you that OSX is the least useful. I might not like windows, but there are aspects of it that are way better than osx.

 

[cw823]

Huh? ACPI compliance since the mid 1996 defines that you can trigger the shut down sequence by simply pressing the case power button once.
Holding the power button down on the other hand triggers a hard shutdown.

The above holds true for all PC hardware since Socket 370 and most operating systems since 1999.

And you're suggesting that most users use the power button to shut their PCs down? You're just trying to make me laugh, right?