Need advice for new build and I'm a little out of touch

[moto211]

So, its been about 3 years since my last build (the machine in my sig) and I've tried to keep up with what's hot, but honestly I'm a little out of touch. I've been busy with school, work, extended traveling for work, and keeping up with my kid. So, I've kept up enough to have a rough idea of what's hot and what's not, but a lot of big changes have happened since my last build and I'd like everyone advice/help.

So first off, a little background info on my needs. To sum it up, my current machine satisfies most of them. The most demanding things I do are probably rosetta/F@H and transcoding video. I could stick with my current machine for another couple of years and probably be totally happy with it. But, I want to set my kid up with his first computer. I know I could get whatever the $400 deal of the moment is from Dell or HP and it would be totally sufficient for his "needs". But, why do that when I see an opportunity to get myself and upgrade that my lady won't complain about? As an enthusiast, having what's hot is enough reason to upgrade, without having real reasons. In all honesty, my desktop spends most of its time idle, chugging away at a DC project and acting as a file and backup server for the rest of my network (ATM the network consists of this desktop plus 3 laptops). Plus, how cool is that my four year old's machine will most smoke most people's main machines? And being reasonable, I know that my Q6600 machine will probably take him through elementary school and possibly into middle school with very little (if any) upgrades and/or additions. Whereas a $400 OEM machine would last him 5-6 years at best. My current hardware, although totally adequate, is too many generations behind to have good resale value. At best, I would get enough from the parts that I'd be willing to sell (CPU, mobo, RAM, and vid card) to cover the cost of an OEM machine for him. More likely, I'd still have to kick down a little cash and still have to build myself a new setup. So, really, my needs are less needs and more wants.

With that said, although I do want badass current gen hardware, I want to try to keep the initial cost down. If I spend 700-800 on the bulk of the upgrade now and 300-400 on the rest later, I'm good with that. Let me elaborate. On the short term, I plan buy a case, power supply, motherboard, cpu, and ram. I have a 320GB 7200rpm drive that I'll use for the time being and I'll use borrow the 3870 from my current machine. Later, I'll buy a ssd and pick up a new new video card or grab one from the classifieds if a good deal shows up.

So, here is my list: http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=19827087

What do you guys think?

 

[Theocnoob]

I know sandybridge is a better transcoder overall per clock. It does H264 transcoding even faster due to acceleration on the IGPU in the actual CPU itself, but I'm pretty sure the IGPU goes into a dormant state unless the CPU is on an H67 platform and you don't want that as it will not allow you to overclock.

Good list. I'm not familiar with the ASUS line for this generation except the top tier stuff so make sure that board got good reviews and people on the board have been happy with it . This board not the pcb... ... I confused myself just now.

I don't know if I'd build in a minitower. Kinda massochistic if you're using an ATX mobo.
I'd go with a mid tower or full tower so you don't end up losing fingers or your mind.

 

[moto211]

Yeah, I may end up changing the case. That case is actually very roomy for its size and I picked it because the computer will reside in my living room. But, I might pick something larger that will have better airflow. What about the CPU? Do you think the 2600K is worth the premium over the 2500K? Also, what if I go with a H67 board and use the onboard temporarily and disable it after I add a video card? If what I've read is correct, I would then have the same overclocking ability as a P67 board.

 

[Theocnoob]

Yeah, I may end up changing the case. That case is actually very roomy for its size and I picked it because the computer will reside in my living room. But, I might pick something larger that will have better airflow. What about the CPU? Do you think the 2600K is worth the premium over the 2500K? Also, what if I go with a H67 board and use the onboard temporarily and disable it after I add a video card? If what I've read is correct, I would then have the same overclocking ability as a P67 board.

Nope. H67 locks your multiplier as far as I know. P67 locks your IGPU. It's sort of a screwed if you do screwed if you don't situation. You're better off chopping away a foot than a head though. I'd lock an igpu over a multiplier any day.

What I'm not 100% sure on is whether the igpu transistors are still available for in-hardware H264 transcode on P67... Actually I'm not even 1% sure I have no idea. I only know that when they are active they do help with that, but only for that specific file format.
2600K has hyper threading, so I think it's worth the extra money. If you look at it in terms of performance per dollar, it is absolutely not worth the extra money. If you just like computer parts and things that are faster, it's worth it.
Definitely not 40% faster for 40% more money though.

 

[moto211]

Ok, so after some research, H67 is definitely out. I'm sticking with a P67 board and I confirmed that in chip transcode acceleration is a function of the IGPU and is lost with a P67 board. Oh well, it'll still transcode better than my Q6600. I might sell the P67 board and get a Z68 board when they come out. Then I'll be able to use dedicated graphics for media and gaming and use the acceleration built into the IGPU for transcoding. Here's the article that confirms the limitations of H67/P67 and details Z68 if anyone cares:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/z68-express-lucidlogix-virtu-ssd-caching,2888.html

So, back to the P67. I'm thinking about picking a different board. What do you guys think of the MSI P67A-GD65?

Also, about my picked GPU. Do you guys think the 560ti might be worth the extra cost? Also, how do the 6850/6870/6950 stack up against the 550ti/560ti?

 

[Theocnoob]

Ok, so after some research, H67 is definitely out. I'm sticking with a P67 board and I confirmed that in chip transcode acceleration is a function of the IGPU and is lost with a P67 board. Oh well, it'll still transcode better than my Q6600. I might sell the P67 board and get a Z68 board when they come out. Then I'll be able to use dedicated graphics for media and gaming and use the acceleration built into the IGPU for transcoding. Here's the article that confirms the limitations of H67/P67 and details Z68 if anyone cares:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/z68-express-lucidlogix-virtu-ssd-caching,2888.html

So, back to the P67. I'm thinking about picking a different board. What do you guys think of the MSI P67A-GD65?

Also, about my picked GPU. Do you guys think the 560ti might be worth the extra cost? Also, how do the 6850/6870/6950 stack up against the 550ti/560ti?

GD65 is good. No major complaints so far and I know several people ordered it in B3 rev.

A lot of programs allow you to use your actual GPU for transcode too so I don't think you're necessarily losing much there. i5/7 gen 2 transcodes faster than gen 1 which was already way faster than 'core2' cpus at transcoding by a lot so you won't be disappointed at all with that performance.

6850 and 70 are worse than the 560. 6950 is faster and significantly faster if flashed to 6970. Remember though, that ATI/AMD drivers are about as intuitive as hyroglyphs.

 

[moto211]

GD65 is good. No major complaints so far and I know several people ordered it in B3 rev.

Do you know if the GD65 has adjustment to compensate for vdroop like asus boards do?

A lot of programs allow you to use your actual GPU for transcode too so I don't think you're necessarily losing much there. i5/7 gen 2 transcodes faster than gen 1 which was already way faster than 'core2' cpus at transcoding by a lot so you won't be disappointed at all with that performance.

I'm sure I won't be disappointed and I'm aware that many media transcoding programs utilize the GPU to accelerate transcoding. But, I will still be going with a Z68 board when they're out. I'm not sure how transcode acceleration compares between nvidia and amd, but they're probably comparable. I don't know if you've read that Tom's review, but its a worthwhile read. In their tests, the IGPU Quick Sync accelerated transcode cut the transcode time by 75% compared to a transcode of the same clip accelerated by a 6970 2GB.

6850 and 70 are worse than the 560. 6950 is faster and significantly faster if flashed to 6970. Remember though, that ATI/AMD drivers are about as intuitive as hyroglyphs.

Yeah, I'm fully aware of the frustration of being an ATI/AMD users in regard to the drivers. Unless AMD release something groundbreaking for the midrange, I'm going Nvidia this time around. But, I'm still wondering, as a person that does limited gaming (but wants it look pretty good when I do), is the 560 worth the extra money over the 550?

 

[Theocnoob]

Do you know if the GD65 has adjustment to compensate for vdroop like asus boards do?



I'm sure I won't be disappointed and I'm aware that many media transcoding programs utilize the GPU to accelerate transcoding. But, I will still be going with a Z68 board when they're out. I'm not sure how transcode acceleration compares between nvidia and amd, but they're probably comparable. I don't know if you've read that Tom's review, but its a worthwhile read. In their tests, the IGPU Quick Sync accelerated transcode cut the transcode time by 75% compared to a transcode of the same clip accelerated by a 6970 2GB.



Yeah, I'm fully aware of the frustration of being an ATI/AMD users in regard to the drivers. Unless AMD release something groundbreaking for the midrange, I'm going Nvidia this time around. But, I'm still wondering, as a person that does limited gaming (but wants it look pretty good when I do), is the 560 worth the extra money over the 550?

The 550 is poo. We were all very disappointed. 460 is better. Confusion ensues. Same as the whole 5870 is a bit faster than 6870. Are you guys TRYING to confuse me?

Anyways...

I've yet to see a board that doesn't have some sort of anti-vdroop. They call it different things, but it's always there. Even if you did get vdroop.. I've never seen it as worth complaining about. If the board always droops .01v, just always set .01v higher than intended.. It's not like its catastrophic... maybe a minor annoyance. Since load line calibration or anti vdroop or whatever you want to call it usually slightly overvolts for stability, you're better off not using it and spending the extra couple of hours to determine a precise voltage and take the vdroop into account in a very anal retentive 1980's nerd fashion.

 

[David]

Theocnoob is right - you want P67 for a K-series CPU.

As for 2600 K vs 2500 K - the former lets you do bigadv workunits for Folding@Home (as it has 8 threads rather than 4) so if FaH is your brand of DC I'd recommend the 2600 K as you'll do far more PPD.

I don't think we (frontpage) have managed to get a hold of a 560 Ti for review yet: I did have a quick look to see if splat or hokie or mdcomp had compared one to their 6950s/6970s. Anandtech reckon the 560 Ti is a little bit faster and quieter than the 6950, however: http://www.anandtech.com/show/4135/nvidias-geforce-gtx-560-ti-upsetting-the-250-market/17