Before Making a Thread About Buying a PSU....

Bad ConNecTioN · Nov 18, 2004

Yes, sticky this. I really don't know why it hasn't been as the info seems to be good.

Sleepyone · Nov 18, 2004

Well only time will tell, will get back with you in a year if it stops working. But really big is not always better. Just because it looks big dosn't mean it dosn't have cheap parts in it. Using a Fluke DVM isnt what I would call a good check for the long run. Lets face it if you look at most items made for home pc, they all look cheap. If you can take a look at items made for big aircraft or items that cost 100k a pop. Then you can get the idea of what its all about.

I.M.O.G. · Nov 18, 2004

Larva runs the show around this forum, and he mentioned some criticisms (constructive) which may explain why this hasn't been stickied. Stickying gives a thread the appearance as though it has the approval for the forums, and if there are shortcomings, a thread probably shouldn't be stickied.

computerpro3 · Nov 18, 2004

I jus went back and fixed all of the "shortcomings" he mentioned.

-computerpro3

computerpro3 · Nov 18, 2004

and about enermax

from SPCR Noisetaker 470w review, and again, this is one website that actually uses REAL psu testing

CONCLUSION

The Enermax NoiseTaker 475 frankly surprised me. I was not expecting anything special from this model, jaded as I am with marketing hokum from any source; Enermax spreads its share of such hokum. I certainly was not expecting 82% maximum efficiency, nor low-noise operation to 200W and beyond. Both of these qualities are enough to immediately put this model among the Recommended PSUs. Add the high stability and high power capability, and it really starts to look like... something special?

It's true that the ATX12V V1.3 PSU Guideline calls for higher efficiency than before, but the numbers — 70% at full load, 60% at typical load and 50% at light load — are nowhere near what Enermax has achieved here.

The protection circuitry works well. In truth, it would be amazingly difficult to build a desktop system that could demand 470W from the PSU for any length of time. Thus far, the highest power draw I've seen is with an ARM Systems P4-3.2 dual SATA drive PC, which only demanded 235W max in AC power. This NoiseTaker was drawing 600W in AC voltage before the protection circuits shut it down.

This is not to say the unit has no flaws.

The bunched cables may be tidy and nice looking but ye gads, get those girdles off! They could be a real struggle to manage in a real system. Even Ralf Hutter's cabling skills may not be enough here.

Then there are the fans that clatter at low speed; they really can and should be improved. Yes, the usual swaps with quieter fans will make real improvements here, if you can negotiate the tangle of wires inside and are willing to void that 3-year warranty. (The full voltage startup surge should help most fan get started and 3V may be be enough to keep most of them running once they're started).

Sorry to be addressing just the modders and diehards.

Even without any modifications, the Enermax NoiseTaker 475 will be useful and important for people who want to build high power systems that still run quietly. It may not be the quietest PSU at idle, but at 200W output and still just in the low-20s dBA @ 1 meter, it is tough to beat!

It would certainly be interesting to look at the other models in the NoiseTaker line. If that >200W fan speed ramp up point remains unchanged, the lower power NoiseTakermodels would be of great interest to SPCR enthusiasts

Certainly a decent psu.

computerpro3 · Nov 18, 2004

Sleepyone said:
Well only time will tell, will get back with you in a year if it stops working. But really big is not always better. Just because it looks big dosn't mean it dosn't have cheap parts in it. Using a Fluke DVM isnt what I would call a good check for the long run. Lets face it if you look at most items made for home pc, they all look cheap. If you can take a look at items made for big aircraft or items that cost 100k a pop. Then you can get the idea of what its all about.

I'm well aware that bigger isn't always better, thats why I don't reccomend those 650w $20 psu's. Me, personally, I'd rather have a pcp&c 425 deluxe than an Enermax 600w or Antec 550.

But since I have my pcp&c 510 deluxe with custom mods from factory done to it, I think I'm good for now :clap:

svnrd · Nov 19, 2004

sticky, sticky, sticky

i wish i saw this before i bought my aspire

yanz · Nov 19, 2004

go ahead, buy a deer psu and put it in your machine, and leave it running prime 95 overnight. I dare you See my point?

Oklahoma: thx for the link. added.

i see you're point. well, i don't know much about psu when i buy mine. but this thermaltake never give me a problem. 24 hours prime stable. this is the brand i trust and have for now: thermaltake (420-480W), fortron, and antec. i use these for a dozen or more system i built... i have bad experiences with cheap 10-30 dollar psu's, so now i believe that good brand = good quality. but still i have to read those review/other's experience with their psu... it's really help...

Daewood · Nov 19, 2004

personally i do not think this should be a sticky (even though you took all that time to write it up and revise it) because what is bad for some may be okay or even great for others.

take the ultra-x connect some have had troubles and others love it...
another is the raidmax, although they are not good with overclocking i think that they are just fine for budget cases that comes with one.

that is just my .02 and i think the only way this should be a sticky is if you change the words "Do not buy a psu from the following companies !!!!!!!" to something along the lines of "i recomend staying away from this psu because they have a reputation to go out and take compys with them"

computerpro3 · Nov 20, 2004

Daewood said:
personally i do not think this should be a sticky (even though you took all that time to write it up and revise it) because what is bad for some may be okay or even great for others.

take the ultra-x connect some have had troubles and others love it...
another is the raidmax, although they are not good with overclocking i think that they are just fine for budget cases that comes with one.

that is just my .02 and i think the only way this should be a sticky is if you change the words "Do not buy a psu from the following companies !!!!!!!" to something along the lines of "i recomend staying away from this psu because they have a reputation to go out and take compys with them"

You would have a point if it were true that raidmax were fine for most people, or if Ultra X-connect was not manufactured by powmax, one of the worst psu manufacturers out there. Thing is, those psu's are on the list for a reason, because they have been proven to kill systems or have a lot of evidence that points to them being likely to kill systems. I made a thread @ hardforums about post your psu blowing up stories, out of the first 14 responses, a raidmax psu was cited in almost 25% of them. I have used a raidmax 450w psu rated for 25a on the 12v line in a p3 600mhz machine with a riva tnt2 graphics card and it blew out. Yes, thats right. I opened it up and oh my God, there was nothing inside!

Again, I say, don't defend a psu company unless you're willing to put one inside YOUR multi thousand dollar computer and run prime 95 overnight. Go ahead, you put a raidmax in your machine. Isn't gonna happen, huh.

Bad ConNecTioN · Nov 20, 2004

No worries...well just bump it when necassary

Daewood · Nov 20, 2004

computerpro3, no where in my post did i say that i would recomend any of the psus i mentioned because i beleive that one of the most important thing in my pc is the power supply but i was just saying for people that just go out and buy a raidmax case and it has one of them in it if they are not overclocking or using 80 fans then they are fine until you can afford a good psu

Bad ConNecTioN · Nov 20, 2004

Its like going to a bad doctor because you can't afford a good one... it might do for now, but he is still a bad doctor.
Wouldn't you want to know that he is a bad doctor before hand?

Whether this particular PSU works for that particular person it is still a bad PSU. The fact that someone uses it succsefully doesn't mean its good. Buyers should still be warned that they are possibly buying a piece of crap.

computerpro3 · Nov 20, 2004

Daewood said:
i was just saying for people that just go out and buy a raidmax case and it has one of them in it if they are not overclocking or using 80 fans then they are fine until you can afford a good psu

And I'm saying, no, they are NOT. I killed a 450w raidmax with a 600mhz pIII machine! Or more accuratley, the raidmax killed it. RIP.

Get a 3.0ghz machine instead of a 3.2ghz machine or a 6800 gt instead of ultra and spend the extra $30 and get a real psu. A fortron 530 is one of the betteer psu's out there period and it's only $75. There is NO excuse other than ignorance not to have a solid psu. A raidmax is fine for NO config, same goes for deer, powmax, etc, etc. They have been OUTLAWED, BANNED, in some contries due to saftey concerns. They are dangerous.

computerpro3 · Nov 23, 2004

bubump

Daewood · Nov 24, 2004

well my raidmax has not died with my 1.8 celly for 2 years but i do agree with you about a good psu like TTGI, Fortron, PC Power & Cooling, or ocz for a very stable and reliable PSU...

yanz · Dec 1, 2004

with your knowledge, computerpro3, i would apreciate if someday you make an article about how to make a (really) good psu. how all the caps, coil, tranformer, regulator work, and how good the scheme, design.. and how to differentiate a bad psu from a god psu by look inside it's open case (and not fooled by large heatsink, or aPFC circuit that fill the left room)... what the fresh look would tell us the caracther of the psu..

because, i've to admit that what i have now is maybe a pseudo knowledge. i know a psu good only by try using it on 3-4 system amd-intel (one is a super heavy oc-ed barton 2.4ghz) and get the similiar good voltage rail, read the article and get excited by how the writer conclude that our psu's is the good one with stable voltage, minimum ripple, aPFC, and candy eyes looking. and finally try the rail with multimeter and get that the value is the same/close (finally i borrowed a mm and try it my self..

)

i mean, we all talk about processor with it's fsb, cache, how nanometer it is, what's socket, pipeline, ss3 or x64bit, how good at oc it is.. can we talk about the psu the same way we use all 'bla-bla-bla' name with cpu..?

really i want to start it. i start it by read those good stickies thread, but even larva didn't give all what he knows about technically about (how to make) a good psu. come on larva, don't hide it, fortron is good but how technically a fsp psu is made? scheme, diagram, pictures, would help a lot and that's what i want to include in an article...

i would ask more but my bad english hold me

what i want to point out is, we all know how and what is the good psu, how to get it, all about using it or buying x model. let gets more technical.. how a manufacture make a good or not to good but el cheapo psu?

do i repeat the same question? sorry..

and thanks..

yan.

Evilsizer · Dec 1, 2004

Daewood said:
well my raidmax has not died with my 1.8 celly for 2 years but i do agree with you about a good psu like TTGI, Fortron, PC Power & Cooling, or ocz for a very stable and reliable PSU...

Sorry TTGI is not that good IMO. I bought a ttgi (superflower) 550ss had it running fine in my p4 rig below for about a year. Then a friend messed up his computer and he just so happened to have a 6800U in there so i put it in my box.... I tried 4-6(lost track) time to bench my comp with that card only to find the machine not on. The last time i did try to bench it, i was eating dinner and came back only to smell burning. The PSU box was really hot.

Now i'm about to order this psu from zippy. I dont understand why this one isnt on there even though there are two 600watts from zippy on the egg. This one linked has 2x12v lines 46amps total. :drool:

link
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=17-103-710&depa=1

"Long Live TUALLY'S!"

*edit: I had read 3 reviews where the superflower was good namely the 550ss. Then I read I the forums that other said they were not good but bought it anyway

*

Oklahoma Wolf · Dec 1, 2004

Evilsizer said:
Now i'm about to order this psu from zippy. I dont understand why this one isnt on there even though there are two 600watts from zippy on the egg. This one linked has 2x12v lines 46amps total.

Here's a page with pics of the innards of that one for you - I expect great things from this beast

http://terasan.okiraku-pc.net/dengen/no76/index.html

computerpro3 · May 30, 2005

updated

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