EK Big thumbs down

[EarthDog]

Its been a while since I had my EK block, so I could be mistaking, but, last I recall, that raised part was not in any liquid...

Weird that they say that because their own testing shows significantly different...you should click on the link I am talking about to see what I am saying.

EDIT: EXAMPLE. Notice how with this block it doesnt touch that surface? That O ring is a safety measure, not a sign that water can go there.

EDIT2: I also read this:

EK is lifting the RMA limit on corrosion to full 24month from the end-user purchase date without any limit. (updated on June 14th)

Looks like they extended their warranty to cover this issue...

 

[Meathead]

Its been a while since I had my EK block, so I could be mistaking, but, last I recall, that raised part was not in any liquid...

Weird that they say that because their own testing shows significantly different...you should click on the link I am talking about to see what I am saying.

EDIT: EXAMPLE. Notice how with this block it doesnt touch that surface? That O ring is a safety measure, not a sign that water can go there.

EDIT2: I also read this: Looks like they extended their warranty to cover this issue...

Not even the same block or the same card. Mines a different design for a 580 gtx. I remember seeing my exact block with a clear top and showing corrosion in the same spot as my block with liquid clearly being able to access that area. I can't prove it without a clear top so it leaves the possibility of the block coming with nickel missing which either way would support my claim that 6 months did nothing to change the fact that this product is defective.

That's the whole point they extended their warranty because they knew it was faulty equipment and not something normal. What happened to my block is not something that just started to occur over the last 6 months, it had to have started much farther back so denying my RMA is wrong in my eyes. If you don't agree, continue to purchase EK products.

I also do not understand how silver or ptnuke could slow down the redox reaction when they are supplying the ingredients for this reaction. I'll have to take a look at the article again. The water flowing provides the static charge, the ptnuke and silver provide phosphate and silver ions to react with. EK also states that they tested pure distilled and had zero issues after 2 months and that's what they recommend if you don't use expensive coolant.

 

[EarthDog]

Right, that was just an example I posted to show you that those raised areas do not get exposed to the liquid. I am pretty sure the same holds true for your block. Water flows through the channel provided, not through the entire thing.

Well, here is my thing, you say it started a while back or even from the factory, within warranty, and chose not to do anything about it until months AFTER the warranty was up. EK DID step up and extended their normal warranty for this issue it just wasnt long enough for you to take advantage of it. Is this really EK's fault? I dont think so. Should they have found it... yeah, they should have, no doubt. But they did extend their warranty to compensate... but I can see why you feel this way.
EDIT: Forget it... you didnt have the acetal top... my bad...disregard!

I don't understand that either as I read the same thing you did, but if you look at the results from each in that PDF, you can clearly see a difference in distilled only vs Dist + SKC or Dist + PTN.

Oh well.

 

[Meathead]

Right, that was just an example I posted to show you that those raised areas do not get exposed to the liquid. I am pretty sure the same holds true for your block. Water flows through the channel provided, not through the entire thing.

Well, here is my thing, you say it started a while back or even from the factory, within warranty, and chose not to do anything about it until months AFTER the warranty was up. EK DID step up and extended their normal warranty for this issue it just wasnt long enough for you to take advantage of it. Is this really EK's fault? I dont think so. Should they have found it... yeah, they should have, no doubt. But they did extend their warranty to compensate... but I can see why you feel this way.

I don't understand that either as I read the same thing you did, but if you look at the results from each in that PDF, you can clearly see a difference in distilled only vs Dist + SKC or Dist + PTN.

Oh well.

When I first purchased the block, ek policy was you cannot open the top or you void the warranty. Can't check factory conditions with that policy so i didnt.

I took the top off recently because I figured voiding the warranty at this point wouldn't be bad. I did not know about any corrosion issues at this point. I'm stating it happened a while ago because things do not just rot and corrode overnight so I'm arguing 6 months should not affect the rma decision. Water blocks are supposed to be designed to last and I'm just going to be clearing out gunk. Ek has since changed their policy on opening blocks to not voiding the warranty.

 

[EarthDog]

I missed where you said you didnt have the acetal top... my bad.. nothing you could do about it before hand.

That said, liquid is not supposed to be in the areas where yours showed copper. I'm 99% sure of that owning a similar EK block and scouring the web for images. Not one of their blocks have water outside of the channel that I found.

Damnit, splitting hairs again as that doesn't really matter too much. I honestly wouldn't worry about it without the acetal top as again, liquid doesn't touch that area. Not a huge deal here IMO, you cant even see it and it won't clog up/damage the loop.

 

[Robert17]

I want no part of the egg toss of this thread but would like to offer that the deposition method used for nickel plating is important for the long term efficacy of the desired corrosion resistance of the finished product. The following should be enlightening enough:

http://www.techmetals.com/InternetArticles/Corrosion Resistance of Electroless Nickel Coatings.pdf

Where electro-less plating works best for all the correct reasons, and:
http://metaltest-inc.com/services/corrosion-testing/nickel-corrosion.html

for consulting further. Or:

http://www.keytometals.com/Article18.htm

for the big picture.

Basically EK knows how to make water blocks. They may want to do a little more research on how to properly address long term corrosion resistance resulting in long term customer satisfaction. A big win is possible for everyone involved.

 

[Meathead]

I missed where you said you didnt have the acetal top... my bad.. nothing you could do about it before hand.

That said, liquid is not supposed to be in the areas where yours showed copper. I'm 99% sure of that owning a similar EK block and scouring the web for images. Not one of their blocks have water outside of the channel that I found.

Damnit, splitting hairs again as that doesn't really matter too much. I honestly wouldn't worry about it without the acetal top as again, liquid doesn't touch that area. Not a huge deal here IMO, you cant even see it and it won't clog up/damage the loop.

Yep all I can do at this point now that I'm done venting is use the block and keep track of any abnormalities. I do have the acetal top but its black so ill just start cleaning once a year. Thanks for letting me know that very little if any water should be flowing there. Makes me feel slightly better that my system won't clog and fail relatively soon. I do actually feel lucky that my block is not as bad as some of the others that had massive nickel oxidation. Some of the blocks were practically ruined after a few months of use.

What is so strange is most of the wear that is occurring around that middle area that you're saying shouldnt even have much flow there. I guess I will find out in a year or two the consequences.

 

[Squadfer]

my guess, just to throw another one out there

in relation to where the gpu chip itself is sitting, it could be that the nickle plating got hot enough to bind itself to the top instead of the bottom piece... Taking off the top resulted in that part sticking to the top? i dunno... but as stated, water shouldn't be going through there as that would cancel out the effect that the channel is suppose to provide... I'm also pretty sure they don't make different blocks for the different type of top that you decide to put on...meaning a clear top will fit in place of a non clear top and vice versa..

no expert on this, just throwing out another possible idea

EDIT* i stand corrected on my theory as the images from the pdf files from ekwb are almost identical... sorry, disregard my post :/

However, those were posted in 2011? this is two+ years later? what happened to yearly inspections/cleanings on your end which would of revealed this issue within the warranty... kinda like changing your oil in your car and then not doing it for years on end, then finding out that the oil filter was faulty causing damage to your engine... I wouldn't expect the maker of the oil filter to cover that damage even if it was still in warranty...

 

[Meathead]

The testing I linked/quoted shows that PTNuke and Silver KC slowed that process. The culprit is the Distilled water, NOT PTN or SKC.

Is your block literally flaking off nickel? Can you post some pictures?

I finally got a chance to look at your link.... It's a link to block staining. I was looking at a study that was conducted for CORROSION. Here's the correct link. Conclusion : http://www.ekwb.com/shop/EK-IMAGES/Corrosion_Report_Final.pdf and http://www.ekwb.com/shop/EK-IMAGES/EKWB_Internal_Report.pdf . I don't think it's flaking off rather its eroding away.

The science institute reported corrosion from silver or phosphate biocide. They recommended against using both and recommended EK's 15$ fluid ( f that ). EK's "Inside Team" used 5 various systems and found harm in only systems used with ptnuke or similar chemical biocides (phosphates).

The report from the first conclusion link above is from a respected science facility supposedly. They showed pictures of the nickel being washed away and it's on pieces that "shouldn't have water" but do see a tiny amount such as around the screwhole in my water block. This is a "text-book from the factory faulty product" based on the evidence. They reported visible corrosion after ONE MONTH.

/end reply

EVGA warranties graphics cards for 3 years yet EK can't stand by a simple piece of machined metal for 2.4 years. They made the mistake. My block has some type of corrosion going on and it didn't just sprout up yesterday or in the last 5 months. There is no other way than it has been a problem from the start of the blocks life. It is some type of corrosion with a white powdery substance as a byproduct of said corrosive reaction. According to their study, once copper is exposed, the process snowballs in a sense. They didn't even offer free corrosion resistant coolant as a peace offering since this would supposedly "slow down the corrosion defect".

If you honestly think I'm asking too much to get a non-defective block or some of the EK coolant that supposedly fixes this corrosion, you must get walked on a lot in life. They are lucky they didn't have to replace whole WC systems and got away with only RMA's for their products after releasing untested water blocks for buyers to test.

 

[Conumdrum]

To the OP: Looks like you missed the window. Looks like your block is still usable, not as pretty. You opted to modify your PC and took a risk like anyone who pushes the limit (YES, WC is pushing it) with a PC.

You missed the window. Suck it up, use the stuff, or go back to air cooling.

If you kept up with comments here and at XS, you would of been informed.

WHen did you find the TOM's hardware post? In the last 3 days?

Tell me again why you can't use the block anymore? Did we discuss annual cleaning and inspection yet? Tearing the block down including gaskets? As Yoda says. "Hmmmm"?

Sorry man, you use watercooling, you have minor plate loss. Since you didn't post pics that's my thought.

It's watercooling. No worries, buy stuff if it's bad, it's a hobby. Or use air cooling.

 

[Meathead]

To the OP: Looks like you missed the window. Looks like your block is still usable, not as pretty. You opted to modify your PC and took a risk like anyone who pushes the limit (YES, WC is pushing it) with a PC.

You missed the window. Suck it up, use the stuff, or go back to air cooling.

If you kept up with comments here and at XS, you would of been informed.

WHen did you find the TOM's hardware post? In the last 3 days?

Tell me again why you can't use the block anymore? Did we discuss annual cleaning and inspection yet? Tearing the block down including gaskets? As Yoda says. "Hmmmm"?

Sorry man, you use watercooling, you have minor plate loss. Since you didn't post pics that's my thought.

It's watercooling. No worries, buy stuff if it's bad, it's a hobby. Or use air cooling.

A week ago I started looking into all of this and filed for RMA when I felt like my cause was justified and had done enough homework on all of this. You're right, I did miss the window and I already stated I'd suck it up. Hobby or not, every other block manages to not leak into the system though.

Block is cleaned. Can't put vinegar on the nickel and voids the warranty so it was just scrubbed with a toothbrush and some distilled water. Block is technically useable but I'm not sure what happens upon any further corrosion. It looks to be getting really close to the middle screw hole and that area leaking would kill my PCI cards below. I also figure that all the metal corroding is building up somewhere and will eventually cause a block. Anything collecting on the pump propeller will probably mess with the pump and possibly shorten life. Not worried about looks as it has a black can't see through top.

It's happening with my gpu block and most of the user reported cases I saw were GPU blocks also yet my cpu block by EK with full nickel is doing just fine. It's cool. I'm over it. Just telling my story so people can avoid doing business with EK if they disagree with how this was handled and do not want to shop there. End of story