SOLVED Just another person having problems OCing FX 4100

[trents]

Okay, yeah I see what you're talking about on the core temp. Be aware that the FX CPUs have temp sensors that are typically calibrated about 15c on the cool side. Also, "the whole CPU hasn't gone higher than 48c" is not the temp of the whole CPU but the CPU socket temp as measured from a thermistor in the motherboard.

 

[KissaXD]

Oh yeah that could very well be. I can put together a system, but I can't exactly tell where all the sensors and stuff are. But knowing that the core temps are not overheating or anything, that's comforting enough for me Overheating hasn't really been a concern of mine with this case, especially not after improving the airflow a bit (air gets sucked in the case at the front part of the case and is exhausted via the back).

I did run into a little problem right before increasing the core voltage another notch, I couldn't even get into my uefi setup screen as my computer would just freeze completely. I solved this by unplugging my g19 keyboard and plugging in my old keyboard. After this prime test I'll see if I still have this problem or not.

 

[RGone]

You have enough posts and now onto the second page of this thread. We need to see what is use in each post. The Signature follows each of your posts. That way those that would help do not have to go all the way back to find a post with system configuration info.

How to put up Sig at OCF.

New Shortcut method for putting a Signature with your system information
following your every post so people can know what is in the case that they are trying to assist with.
You can use something like what is shown in my signature as a good template of needed information Thank you.

 

[KissaXD]

Yes, I am by all means a very big talker... I'll try to use the edit function a bit more

Anyways, No crashes, freezes, errors or warnings after 8h of Prime and my system wasn't even slowed down either. The temps were also very good, the core temp only raised by 1.6 degrees, putting it on 39.5°C and the "CPU" temp was 49°C.

The problem still persists that when I try to boot with my G19 keyboard plugged in, the booting progress will freeze right after the mobo screen. Boots fine with the other keyboard plugged in.

Both are USB keyboards, the big difference between the 2 is that the G19 has macro keys, changeable key lights and an LCD display.

Oh and there's still the CPU throttle if I don't enable/disable turbo core in AMD overdrive


EDIT: I solved the keyboard/boot problem by disabling USB legacy in uefi, the system has booted fine twice. We'll see how long it holds.

 

[trents]

Why don't you disable Turbo core in bios?

Have you checked your USB settings in bios? There's options for legacy and some other things.

 

[KissaXD]

Why don't you disable Turbo core in bios?

Have you checked your USB settings in bios? There's options for legacy and some other things.

All power saving features etc are disabled (turbo core, power saving, c1e, c6, ...) and as stated in my edit, I've disabled USB legacy which solved the keyboard problem

I've also tried putting the power settings to balanced and then back to high performance again, checked the CPU power settings in CCC, it's all as it should be.

My mobo does however only have a 4+1 power phase design, can this have something to do with it?

 

[RGone]

A little air stuff...

The NZXT "Phantom" case without any numerical designators after the word Phantom seems to indicate a full tower case? Did a little look-see at NZXT website and that is what I seemed to see.

Okay there are many cases out there today and most seem to believe more fans just have to be better. I really wonder.

"Trents" has shown the image just below a number of times and as the individual moves more toward the general outline of air-flow, their temps have almost always become better for sure as relates to cpu cooling.

The second picture relates to the "Phantom" case as shown at the NZXT website.

 

[RGone]

MOBO: AsRock 970 Extreme4 < That mobo does not have an enable/disable APM in the bios anywhere? Maybe in the cpu section?

If you have C n Q disabled as well as C1E, C6, Turbocore and any other green setting you see and that includes a working enable/disable of APM and with Windows power manager set to Performance; there should be NO up and down of the CPU Mhz.

 

[KissaXD]

Yes, I mean the tower case... I tend to forget there's also a smaller version of the case.

I quickly made a picture of my case with some arrows explaining the airflow:

Anyways, it's certainly not the best setup, but I tried to optimize it with the fans and space available. I used to have a big fan on the side panel, but then the cpu cooler came... Oh and don't mind the dust, this apartment is very bad at that front. But I've blown out all the hardware just last week using cans of pressurized air.

And no, I haven't seen something called APM anywhere in the bios, but I did find something similar in the advanced CPU options.

I'll just restart my computer and see what else I can find in EUFI and give you a complete list of what's been disabled in an edit.


EDIT: So after I managed to get into UEFI (disabling USB legacy apparently disables all use of USB devices while not booted to the OS, luckily I still have PS/2 keyboards and mice lying around)

These are the functions I disabled:
CPU Active core control
AMD Turbo core
C&Q
C1E
C6 (this was the one I thought was kind of the same as APM, so I guess I don't have it)
Thermal Throttle

I also saw what UEFI version I'm running: P1.30

 

[trents]

APM = Advanced Power Management. It is the main culprit in the frustrating down-throttling of the FX CPU frequencies when the TDP wall is approached. It may be called something else in your bios but whatever it's called it might be helpful in spotting it if you have the idea of what it does.

 

[KissaXD]

APM = Advanced Power Management. It is the main culprit in the frustrating down-throttling of the FX CPU frequencies when the TDP wall is approached. It may be called something else in your bios but whatever it's called it might be helpful in spotting it if you have the idea of what it does.

Yeah, but my motherboard just doesn't have this function. I thought it was just called differently on my mobo, that's why I thought it was disabled, but it turned out it was the C6 I disabled.

I wonder if the 2.0 update of my uefi bios has this function + it could possibly also fix the issue I'm having while booting with my g19, but I kinda got put off flashing the bios chip as I've googled a bit and seen people basically breaking their mobo while trying to flash it... (my mobo came with P1.30 pre-installed instead of the usual 1.0 or 1.10)

 

[trents]

If you have Control Panel Power Options set to High Performance some of these things may have been switched off by Windows and you won't see them in bios.

 

[KissaXD]

If you have Control Panel Power Options set to High Performance some of these things may have been switched off by Windows and you won't see them in bios.

I checked it, but this does not seem to be the case...

 

[RGone]

I really hate to say this but there may be only less than a handful of motherboards that can handle the real strain of 8 core FX processors. I mean time after time.

This user posted this >> "I have the same problem with an fx-8120 on an Asrock 970 extreme 4 board.
I disabled APM, thermal throttling, C1E, C6 in the bios, and set 4Ghz@1,3V. If i start any stress test, the socket temps are just rocketing to 65C in like a min, and then it throttles down. I have an EKL block cooler on it, already tried to reseat it with new thermal grease 3 times, but nothing changed. Tried different UEFI versions, but still the same. I start to think the temp readings are off, becouse the cooler is barely warm.
Yeah i tried it without OC, and it throttled down on 3,1GHz@1,25V as well."

He bought his wife an FX-4170 for that board and bought himself an Asus Sabertooth and H100 and went off into the sunset just beaming.

 

[RGone]

Bios version for 970 Extreme4 mobo to add Application Power Management (New AMD APM) to bios. Whether it works like the enable/disable on Asus mobo is not known.

L1.46 11/17/2011 Instant Flash 2.42MB Add "AMD Application Power Management" option.

 

[KissaXD]

Bios version for 970 Extreme4 mobo to add Application Power Management (New AMD APM) to bios. Whether it works like the enable/disable on Asus mobo is not known.

L1.46 11/17/2011 Instant Flash 2.42MB Add "AMD Application Power Management" option.

So this should be a beta release for my bios., but it seems so old... (I was looking at the 2.0 update earlier on this page: http://www.asrock.com/MB/overview.nl.asp?cat=Download&os=BIOS&Model=970 Extreme4) Donwloaded it already, though.

I've read a bit about how to flash and that it's recommended to set all the settings back to default (which will undo the OC)

But IF I do this flash, can I just put the same OC settings and will it run stable without having to stress test? (I suppose not)

And what if I end up breaking my mobo?

Just thinking ahead here

Any tips? (Other than the ones stated at the AsRock "how to" page)

 

[trents]

I would think you would need to stress test again if for no other reason to see if the APM switch off option actually worked. I wouldn't think it would take 8 hrs. of testing to discern that, however. It would become apparent pretty quick.

 

[KissaXD]

I would think you would need to stress test again if for no other reason to see if the APM switch off option actually worked. I wouldn't think it would take 8 hrs. of testing to discern that, however. It would become apparent pretty quick.

Yes of course, that's what I always do to test whether my cpu is throttling or not, just open up hardware monitor or amd overdrive and run intelburntest for a minute as that suffises to check it.

 

[trents]

If it turns out that the beta bios doesn't make any changes as far as switching off APM goes I would conclude that change was incorporated into later bios versions and just doesn't work. You can always reflash to the latest version.

 

[KissaXD]

Yeah, but I'm scared that by doing a bios flash I will simply break my bios as in: I will need to buy a new mobo to get my system running again

Edit: Oh and I only just read your comment about the 8-cores just now, Rgone. Good thing that this is a Quad-core then

Edit 2: I think I'm going to try updating to the P1.40 bios as apparently AsRock added support for my CPU in that BIOS update because at this point my CPU isn't exactly supported by my mobo, lol

Edit 3: So updated the bios to P1.40, the update was a succes, however, no APM... but since I already made the step of flashing anyway, I went ahead and tried the L1.46 beta version Rgone recommended. Once again, he was right!

So, I now have an overclocked CPU, my G19 was plugged in and enabled while booting and our cherry on top of the cream pie: APM disabled and no back throttling issues!
I'll probably run another blend test for half an hour since all my issues always came to light within 30 minutes of stress testing... Just to make sure the OC settings are still correct

So I'd like to thank both Rgone and trents for their help and utmost patience with me as all of my issues have been resolved.

I'd say, topic closed and let's hope it is of any help to someone else out there on the net.

One last thing I've learned: Always listen to Rgone as he is always right.