First WC - 2x 7970

[crz]

First of all, Hi!
Please be soft on me, this is my first ever WC build.
So lets start.

I am about to build my first WC and humbly asking experienced ones for your opinion, thoughts, comments and advice.

Goal:
- quiet. quiet as much as possible. preferably do not want to hear it.
- efficient. efficient so i to not need to worry about my hardware.
- redundant. if i am away and **** hit the fan, i want to make sure my HW is ok.
- no WOW and BLING factors neccessary in build. I care about what equipement can do and not how it's look like (to degree). So no glowing in dark **** or making cookies.

Usage:
- gaming. I do like playing games. A lot and as much as i can.
- home theater
- quite a lot of 3D modeling such as 3DS etc. when I am not playing games

Hardware:
- 2x ASUS HD7970-3GD5. Also I am planning to overlock it up to 1100MHz link
- 3x 24" 60Hz screens in portrait mode, native res: 3600x1920
- I am not mentioning CPU, RAM, MOBO, HDD etc. since some of those already does have separate WC or do not require it really. For instance CPU does have Corsair H50 link. I will wait until good moment and include those in the loop eventually.
- HAF X Enclousure to fit it all

After reading quite a lot on WC I came up woth this list of equipement to purchase. Money are not an issue really but lets do not go crazy :

0.
1x EK Water Blocks EK-Supreme HF Full Copper universal Easy

1.
2x WC Block EK-FC7970 link

2.
2x Backplate link

3.
2x I/O Bracket link

4.
2x Koolance Dual VID connection nipple variable G1/4" - 2-3 Slots - Black link

5.
1x WaterTank link

Problem with water tank is, I was not able to figure out pumps I do need. It says D5 and I thoughts about two Liang D5 Vario, but not sure will it fit. So instead that I went for kit with two pumps included. Please comment on this since I have no clue is it good ones :/ link

6.
1x 180deg variable connector link
Since I am planning to run pumps in serial I need to connect two pumps together. How safe are those 180deg connectors are? will it leak?

7.
1x Radiator MO-RA3 9x140 Pro Black link
This one seems to be quiet and this is what I am after. Also I thought it will reduce chance of damage by sitting next to the enclose and not above it, if it will starts leaking.

8.
2x Rad Grill Watercool MO-RA3 420 link

9.
2x Koolance screw plug G1/4" knurled link
Not sure is those were added to water block so just in case if they were not, want to have them

10.
2x Alphacool 16/10 compression fitting 90° revolvable G1/4
Also good to have couple of those if have need of sudden turn or lack of space while laying tubes

11.
10x Alphacool 16/10 compression fitting G1/4 - shiny copper

12.
1x Koolance 4-way outlet valve link
Just in case I suddenly feel to stop water flow Want to mount it somewhere ease accessible lets say in case of hell break loose and loop start leaking I'll use this emergency stop valve.

13.
1x Koolance quick release connector 16/10mm (ID 3/8" OD 5/8") plug (High Flow) - VL3N

14.
1x Koolance quick release connector 16/10mm (ID 3/8" OD 5/8") coupling (High Flow) - VL3N

15.
Masterkleer Slang PVC 16/10mm (3/8"ID) Clear 15m (50ft) "Boxed"

16.
1x link
Just in case of :]

I hope I did not missed anything. Did had some difficulties with finding right sizes to all components. As you already notice everything is running on G1/4". Also I stayed away from mixing aluminum in the loop so everything is in brass, copper or other non corrodible materials. As coolant I am planning to use distilled water from local HW store. I do not want to use any premixed coolant solutions or some glowing UV coca-cola.

Let's start.

 

[fall]

120.6 would be good amount of rad for just the 2 cards and with GT AP-14's it will be silent 24/7 (your CPU Cooler will make more noise)

You want dual pumps then go for this

http://www.swiftech.com/MCP35x2PUMP.aspx

best pumps you can buy plus there is a reservoir fitting for it so you wont need the bay ones.

Aside from that looks fine. To save a little bit of cash though you really wont need those single slot brackets.

 

[EarthDog]

Thats a ton of rad... I would imagine a 120x4 would be plenty with some quiet fans. And no need for dual pumps.

 

[fall]

Yes 120.4 would be fine I based my suggestion on that he will probably add in that CPU once the hobby seeps into his blood stream

 

[crz]

120.6 would be good amount of rad for just the 2 cards and with GT AP-14's it will be silent 24/7 (your CPU Cooler will make more noise)

Will it be enough if I am planning to upgrade to 2x7990 and add CPU to the loop in close future? CPU is i7 965 running on 3.6GHz. I'll rather have a bit too much instead to less. It is more difficult to add as far as I did manage to figure out. Correct me if I am wrong.

You want dual pumps then go for this

http://www.swiftech.com/MCP35x2PUMP.aspx

best pumps you can buy plus there is a reservoir fitting for it so you wont need the bay ones.

Aside from that looks fine. To save a little bit of cash though you really wont need those single slot brackets.

Is using dual 5.25" bay solution for pump and res does have some disadvantages? I was thinking opposite since it ease to mount etc. Also I do not want to drill any additional holes in case. I rather go for solution working out of the box. Also as I did mention before money are not an issue to this build

......And no need for dual pumps.

Why two redundant pumps are bad? I mean, redundancy is one of the goals so unless you can give an example of better redundant solution I rather stick with two pumps. I do render a lot of 3D while I am away from my machine and pushing GPUs very hard and last thing I want is unpleasant surprises :]

 

[fall]

Will it be enough if I am planning to upgrade to 2x7990 and add CPU to the loop in close future? CPU is i7 965 running on 3.6GHz. I'll rather have a bit too much instead to less. It is more difficult to add as far as I did manage to figure out. Correct me if I am wrong.

If thats your plan then no, but also since the 7990 is not out we can only assume it will put out the same heat as 2 7970's. Another 120.3 added on later will be enough


Is using dual 5.25" bay solution for pump and res does have some disadvantages? I was thinking opposite since it ease to mount etc. Also I do not want to drill any additional holes in case. I rather go for solution working out of the box. Also as I did mention before money are not an issue to this build

The only disadvantage is that the D5 does not do well in hogh restriction loops. But since your running 2 it will possibly be fine. I always suggest the 35X because it is the best pump on the market.



Why two redundant pumps are bad? I mean, redundancy is one of the goals so unless you can give an example of better redundant solution I rather stick with two pumps. I do render a lot of 3D while I am away from my machine and pushing GPUs very hard and last thing I want is unpleasant surprises :]

Redundant pumps are not bad but are really not needed most pumps are rated at 50000 hours (5 years) of constant work. And in normal cases they will last that long or be DOA (not in loop so not a problem)

 

[Conumdrum]

You'd be fine with one 35x, or even one D5 pump. It's only a CPU/GPU/GPU loop.

The 35x has a nice feature that it's PWM speed controlled, so you can connect it to the mobo CPU fan header and control pump speed while the temps change.

You pretty much got what you needed. Leaks usually come from fittings, so having the rad outside helps with only two fittings. You'll be fine though.

Make sure you can get good 140mm fans, hard to find. Actually, the 120x9 Mora instead of the 140x9 would be a smarter and cheaper cost. Partially due to fans and size too. A 120x9 Mora is enough rad for anything you'lll be throwing at it.

 

[crz]

If thats your plan then no, but also since the 7990 is not out we can only assume it will put out the same heat as 2 7970's. Another 120.3 added on later will be enough

Ok in this case I'll rather go for MORA3 and save work and effort later on adding additional RAD.

Redundant pumps are not bad but are really not needed most pumps are rated at 50000 hours (5 years) of constant work. And in normal cases they will last that long or be DOA (not in loop so not a problem)

How I can prevent destroying my hardware without having redundant pumps? Only on software level such as automatic shutdown when temperatures rise over limit? Sometimes it could be an issue, specially during rendering time and job need to be done on deadline. So another thing off the list. Ill stay with double pump but as you suggest switch it over to swiftech

The 35x has a nice feature that it's PWM speed controlled, so you can connect it to the mobo CPU fan header and control pump speed while the temps change.

This is interesting.

Make sure you can get good 140mm fans, hard to find. Actually, the 120x9 Mora instead of the 140x9 would be a smarter and cheaper cost. Partially due to fans and size too. A 120x9 Mora is enough rad for anything you'lll be throwing at it.

Those 140mm fans included to MORA3 are so bad? Any suggestion regarding 140mm fans then? If not, I could follow your suggestion and go for 120mm then.

 

[robble]

no one else noticed the 1/4"id tubing?

OP - get at least 3/8" preferably 7/16" or 1/2" tubing. 1/4" is tiny.

 

[EarthDog]

Meh... as long as the flow rate is there... doesnt really matter too much... but since its 3 items in the loop, maybe a bit bigger isnt a bad thing.

 

[crz]

no one else noticed the 1/4"id tubing?

OP - get at least 3/8" preferably 7/16" or 1/2" tubing. 1/4" is tiny.

I was thinking to match all components in same size. But hold on a sec. since all outlets inlets are 1/4 and tube itself is thicker is this affect flow somehow? Also my understanding was if water pass faster trough components isn't it better in case when GPU producing a lot of heat for long period of time?

 

[Conumdrum]

The outlets are NOT 1/4" wide. They are British Standard Parellel thread, a pipe end type know as BSPP. The inside of these fittings are larger. It's a common mistake. The ID of these fittings is LARGER than 1/4".

The hose size of the barb, the OD of the barb, or the ID of the compression fitting is up to 1/2" wide.

Water passes faster. Yes, it kinda matters, not in the way your thinking. In the CPU mainly because of impingment. You need enough flow and pressure to make the water 'dance' like crazy in a very turbulent way so more molecules impact the warmer copper surfaces. If flow drops below 1 GPM or so impingment slows down, ergo more heat is left behind in the copper.

There is an article about flow rates dealing with radiators mainly in the stickies that kinda explains it.

 

[robble]

I was thinking to match all components in same size. But hold on a sec. since all outlets inlets are 1/4 and tube itself is thicker is this affect flow somehow? Also my understanding was if water pass faster trough components isn't it better in case when GPU producing a lot of heat for long period of time?

as long as you have enough minimum flow rate your temps won't vary much. However, bigger tubing does equal more flowrate.

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=515368

 

[crz]

The outlets are NOT 1/4" wide. They are British Standard Parellel thread, a pipe end type know as BSPP. The inside of these fittings are larger. It's a common mistake. The ID of these fittings is LARGER than 1/4".

The hose size of the barb, the OD of the barb, or the ID of the compression fitting is up to 1/2" wide.

You lost me here I thought G1/4" is also mean ID and standard name in same time. OK then please correct parts I have wrong so we keep water as you mention in 'crazy dance'. Also I was reading compression fittings are better than barbs so I'll rather go with those.
What size those G1/4" actually are anyway?

 

[skorpien]

G1/4" refers to the threading of the fittings, ie the side of the fittings that connects to the waterblocks, pumps, or radiators. At one time this didn't use to be standard so it really mattered which threading the fittings were. Nowadays most WC manufacturers stick with this standard.

The other side of the fittings is what connects to your tubing and what we're talking about when we say ID/OD. First choose which size tubing you want. Let's say 1/2" ID 3/4" OD. Then if you are going with barbs you need to make sure they fit 1/2" ID tubing. With compressions you have to make sure they fit 3/4" OD as well.

It doesn't matter which you choose. It's mostly a preference of the builder. Both are good and won't leak if done properly.

I mean no insult, but have you read the sticky at the top of this forum? Everything my post mentions (and more) can be found there. Might be worthwhile to review it if you have.

 

[Conumdrum]

Okay, G1/4 aka BSPP 1/4" wiki.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_standard_pipe_thread

ALL major WC parts including ALL of yours have male or female G1/4" threads. Not worry there. BUT you have to match the hose size for your hose. And it shouldn't be 1/4"ID hose.

Just repick your fittings for the rad, pump, blocks etc. No, I'd rather not pick them, it's your stuff, your adventure. Once it's all at your door, it's all you.............

 

[crz]

skorpien: Did read it yes. Look like I got lost in naming and standards, I'll go through them again. Thank you for pointing this.

So let me see... For some reason I was not capable to to find any tubing with 3/4" as you did suggest but what if I will change tubing to lets say this: Tygon R3603 Slang 12,7/9,5mm (3/8"ID) which seems to be reasonable diameter to keep good flow and pressure, and for some reasons it is 12,7/9,5mm. It is closest to 3/8" shouldn't it be 13/10mm instead 12,7/9,5mm ? Or it is for "tightness" reasons?

If tubing is right now (I hope it is) fittings must be changed to lets say those: 13/10mm (10x1,5mm) compression fitting 90° revolvable outer thread 1/4 - copper plated and those: 13/10mm (10x1,5mm) compression fitting outer thread 1/4 - copper plated

Lets hope I got things right now or else I'll buy tubing only and hang myself heh. Also I never mention how much I do appreciate your help and advices, without it I'll probably end up with a bunch of boxes not fit each other.

 

[Jezus53]

Whoa whoa whoa, WAY too many different units. Stick with the inches since that's pretty much the standard here. Just keep it simple. When you pick your tubing just make sure the ID of the tube matches the ID of the fitting and you should be golden. And if you do compression make sure the OD of the fitting matches the OD of the tube. So for example, if you get 3/8" ID and 1/2" OD then make sure the fitting has the same specs.

And quick question, are you not from the US? Because I think you're trying to convert everything and getting mixed up with the numbers.

 

[Conumdrum]

He's in EU I guess, by his parts list and his command of English, way better than me and any other launguage. His suppliers over there use mm measurements. So he needs to use that. I never had to do the compare since I'm US, it can't be that hard to figure out actually.

Take your time CRZ, you only had your first post a few days ago. I spent 3 months before I ordered one part. Slow down is a smart thing this time.

 

[crz]

When you pick your tubing just make sure the ID of the tube matches the ID of the fitting and you should be golden. And if you do compression make sure the OD of the fitting matches the OD of the tube. So for example, if you get 3/8" ID and 1/2" OD then make sure the fitting has the same specs.

You see there is a problem. According to this shop tubing 3/8" come in two flavors: 13/10mm and 12,7/9,5mm. This is why I am confused. I do not want things goes wet because of stupid 0.5mm gap Also I did noticed same weird gap is present with 1/2" tubing.

So what you say? Will those fittings work with these tubing?

And quick question, are you not from the US? Because I think you're trying to convert everything and getting mixed up with the numbers.

Yes, I am living in Norway so all shops are in mm